i think i might give up on guitar sim and buy a real amp, what amp?

[XxSicRokerxX]

Alright so im still a bit new...

I bought a pair of KRK monitors and a Toneport ux2 interface a while ago and for the past few months ive been battling with amp simulators (nickcrow amps,solo c, revalver III) and impulses.

But im still not necessarily happy with the tones.

So i think im going to take everyones advice and buy an amp.

But the question is what should i buy first?

Should i buy a guitar HEAD? is there a way to Buy just a guitar head and have the output go to my INTERFACE Input then i can record it on my DAW and juse a cab simulator/impulse?

Or do i have to buy a HEAD and CAB? then send it to my interface?

Or do i have to buy Head+Cab+mic?

I think i read somewhere if you buy a HEAD with TUBES and have no CAB, you'll blow the tubes? or something?

I have a line 6 spider 3 combo amp, is there a way i could use this and get better sounds than an AMP Sim?

Or should i save my money for an 1. Amp head 2. HEAD + CAB 3. Head+CAB+mic? I know the best would be option 3 but i dont have the money for that. But what would be best for right now?

Oh and if you can please suggest specific amps that would be great im going for a DEFTONES, Breaking Benjamin, PapaRoach type of sound.

 

[Robert W]

Or you could save yourself a little dough and DL LePou's Lecto sim for free, then treat yourself to some very reasonably priced IRs like Own Hammer or ReCabinet before spending some big bucks on a new amp.

 

[Wolfeman]

IMO, if you are struggling with getting decent sounds out of those sims and impulses, then you are going to struggle even more with a micing a real cab.

Maybe you should look into what you are doing wrong first.

 

[di0de]

IMO, if you are struggling with getting decent sounds out of those sims and impulses, then you are going to struggle even more with a micing a real cab.

Maybe you should look into what you are doing wrong first.

+1

But yeah you should check out the Lecto plugin.

 

[XxSicRokerxX]

Robert W have you honestly been able to get some tones that you are satisfied with using an AMP SIM? i mean im sure even the best of the best amp SIM and commercial impulses would get you CLOSE but just not quite there. I've spent hours trying to model sounds but i just cant quite get it right, ive seen competitions and on this forum of people using amp sim to model an actual guitar amp, and they just wont be able to, they'll even agree that amps are the better option.

 

[XxSicRokerxX]

compare for yourself. http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/andy-sneap/595561-ultimate-modelling-challenge.html Download the actual tone and try to replicate it with the DIs see if you can come close if you can, please post if you can.

 

[Sodhats]

The sound of a mic'd cab in a room are what amp sims really struggle to emulate. I wouldn't just buy a head, most emulated heads are very realistic.

Although having said that, people on here have gotten some really great tones out of amp sims. Working out why you can't would be more helpful.

 

[AntonioPetrole]

no offense, but the amp isn't gonna make your guitar tone godly. Just keep messing with amp sims until you are positive. There are plenty of albums and tones that sound amazing with amp sims (Dandeliums tones, Oceano, etc.) Also get lecto, its amazing

 

[viralz]

Not a big fan of lecto, I think it lacks some tightness. My old peavey rockmaster with impulses sounded better then most amp sims I've tried. Maybe you should try to use an external guitar preamp.

 

[Robert W]

Robert W have you honestly been able to get some tones that you are satisfied with using an AMP SIM? i mean im sure even the best of the best amp SIM and commercial impulses would get you CLOSE but just not quite there. I've spent hours trying to model sounds but i just cant quite get it right, ive seen competitions and on this forum of people using amp sim to model an actual guitar amp, and they just wont be able to, they'll even agree that amps are the better option.

Yes, it took forever to get the kind of tone I was after, but that was because I'd been asking the wrong people, mostly the djent types, for tone tips.

As for real amps, of course they are a better option, assuming of course you have access to practice spaces and a big bankroll to fund all the purchases you're going to need to make.

As for time spent knob turning and tweaking sims, I've spent years doing that myself, trying everything new I could find until I happened, quite by chance, to get the kind of tone I was looking for. Nobody just plugs into an amp sim and gets a magic tone. It takes a LOT of trial and error to get it to sound right.

When people here tell you that buying a real amp isn't going to solve your tone problems, believe them. You think getting a sim to sound good is tough, try spending countless hours fiddling w/ mics for the right speaker position!

 

[TheWinterSnow]

When people here tell you that buying a real amp isn't going to solve your tone problems, believe them. You think getting a sim to sound good is tough, try spending countless hours fiddling w/ mics for the right speaker position!

I always hear people saying that real amps are harder to dial in and mic compared to running sims but if you know what you are doing, nothing will beat a real amp with a real cabinet.

Like mentioned before it has nothing to do with the preamp, in sims it is the impulses that are hard to emulate, so even if you had a real preamp and where using impulses, you still have a very similar sounding tone.

I will wager that if you had a good cabinet and a good mic (57s are always a good starter mic) and mic up the typical Sneap way, you can't get a bad tone.

I will say with a real amp the whole nightmare of it being harder to dial in is in actually dialing in the amp's settings. With a sim, the tone knobs really don't do anything and almost any random turning of eq knobs will give you something usable. Real amps are less forgiving, you have to obtain an ear for what will mic well and even for experienced ears can take hours to get the right sound.

I say though, that if you want a real amp/cab and want to learn (because after all once you do have it down, you will get better tones), then get a head, cab and mic it up. The real confidence boosters would be 5150 with any quality cabinet with v30s and mic'd with a single SM57. There are more than plenty of threads and how to's for that combination since most of us around hear use them all the time for recording.

 

[arv_foh]

you guys are nuts.. I can dial in a good tone from a 5150 or 6505 through a Mesa oversized 4x12 so fucking quick.. it's so easy it's almost criminal

I have played around with amp sims for hours and it still doesn't sound as good, IMO

OP if I were you I'd get a 5150/6506, a Mesa OS 4x12 and an SM57

Are the preamps on the Toneport decent? If not maybe a Focusrite Saffire should be in your future too

 

[XxSicRokerxX]

if a GUITAR sim is similar to an actual head but the cab emulation is the problem then... why dont i just buy a real cab perhaps a Mesa OS 4x12 as mentioned and a SM57 and just use an amp sim? then save til i can buy a 5150/6505. am i cheating if i do this? lol

 

[arv_foh]

if a GUITAR sim is similar to an actual head but the cab emulation is the problem then... why dont i just buy a real cab perhaps a Mesa OS 4x12 as mentioned and a SM57 and just use an amp sim? then save til i can buy a 5150/6505. am i cheating if i do this? lol

you'll still need a power amp to power the cab

 

[JoergieN]

You guys are the pros here not me, so feel free to disagree with me as much as you want. But the way I feel is that if you need the versatility, go with good amp sims. If you feel the need to have great versatility with your sounds but you want to use real amps for all of it, then you are spending a 100x the amount of money that would by just using good amp sims, which I feel sound quite similar, but not quite the real thing. However if you have your sound and you only need 1 amp to get that sound, then go for the amp IMO.

 

[AHChris]

you guys are nuts.. I can dial in a good tone from a 5150 or 6505 through a Mesa oversized 4x12 so fucking quick.. it's so easy it's almost CRIMINAL

I have played around with amp sims for hours and it still doesn't sound as good, IMO

OP if I were you I'd get a 5150/6506, a Mesa OS 4x12 and an SM57

Are the preamps on the Toneport decent? If not maybe a Focusrite Saffire should be in your future too

Hahaha I see what you did there

 

[Robert W]

You guys are the pros here not me, so feel free to disagree with me as much as you want. But the way I feel is that if you need the versatility, go with good amp sims. If you feel the need to have great versatility with your sounds but you want to use real amps for all of it, then you are spending a 100x the amount of money that would by just using good amp sims, which I feel sound quite similar, but not quite the real thing. However if you have your sound and you only need 1 amp to get that sound, then go for the amp IMO.

Not a "pro", just a DIY type, but here's some things the OP might want to consider,

Are you planning on playing live? If so, then you'll need that amp, but if he's not, and doesn't have access to a practice space where he can crank that amp for recording purposes, then sims make more sense, at least IMO.

As Maagisk said, versatility are where sims really shine. You can DL 10 amp sims for free, but unless you have 40K in disposable income, you won't be able to achieve similar sounding results in RL.

Also, IRs, as have been said previously by other posters, make almost ALL difference when it comes to getting good sim tones. Good IRs will come with various mics and positions, so achieving the sm57 on axis/off axis micing combo will not be hard to replicate. Again, getting good IRs will do more for your tone than the amp sim itself. I like the Own Hammer and ReCabinet stuff myself, but there are plenty of other good IRs out there as well, so try as many different ones as you can.

One other thing, getting a Peavey, as some have suggested, might be fine if you like the way a Peavey sounds, but not everyone does. They're good if you're looking for a certain kind of tone, but that's about it. Personally, I think a JCM800 is a better " all around" amp, but that's just my opinion.

 

[Jarkko Mattheiszen]

Getting a decent tone with a real amp is hardly rocket science. Get a nice head (5150), a nice cab (Mesa, for instance) and a nice mic (57), look up some pointers on this forum (there are tons of threads about mic placement and 5150 settings to get you started) and start fiddling around. That way, if you don't get a sound that pleases your ear, you know the problem is with your way of capturing the tone, not with the gear itself, and you don't have to try gazillions of free amp sims and presets and wonder what's wrong. There are only so many knobs and switches on the 5150, and a 57 on a decent 4x12 with V30's is bound to sound good in some positions

 

[Jevil]

I think i might give up on porn sites and screw a real girls.

Clear enough?

 

[Wolfeman]

I think some of you are jumping the gun here telling him to 'buy an amp, it will sound better than sims'.

Yes, IMO nothing beats a real amp and cab, I totally agree. But how do we know that this guy isn't screwing something up when he is post processing or mixing? If that's the case, he's going to struggle just as bad, if not worse, with real gear.

Post a soundclip of the guitar tone you are getting, along with the DI you are using and all the settings you used on the sims/plugins/etc. Then go form there.