chrisvp
Member
the man makes sense 
then again , could this be another cover up for something bigger that will hit the fan ?
then again , could this be another cover up for something bigger that will hit the fan ?
John Howard, the filthy liar
- Thread starter Spiff
- Start date
chrisvp
Member
chrisvp
Member
was in that situation 2 weeks ago , was not nice , even the internet became boring , hope you get well soon man
chrisvp
Member
Wrathchild said:
true, i would have to really think about a vote for costello where as Howard is my default vote regardless of whats going on, not true about the reasons you gave for voting for howard though. I vote for him because im living a good life, in part due to his partys economic managment, anyone remember keating, 15% interent rates, try buying a fucking house with that.
Gillard, maybe, they have no one else
Shannow
Stunt Plough Rider
Sydo said:Cheers dude. But I'm fine really, it's just a cold.
I could even have gone to work today, but I'd rather use my remaining sick leave before I quit at the end of the month.
sick leave
That's a very "non-conservative" approach, to a rort that the unions organised to the detriment of business:zombie:
I've got 270 days of sick leave accrued that I'll never see.
Southy
Proud Brisbane Metaller
Julia Gillard would make a good leader, only because she has had alot to do with unions, so has Boomer, but he seems useless, hopefullt the Ir laws will change that
Wrathchild
Miserable Bastard
Danallica said:
That's because you have a functioning set of lower limbs, so to you and millions of other Aussies, this "welfare to work" bullshit means nothing.
Its all very well to drivel on about the importance of getting people with disabilities off welfare and into the workforce, but lets pull our heads out of the clouds and live in the real world for a moment. If you had two applicants for the same job, each with identical qualifications and one of them had a disability, who would you pick? The able-bodied guy can drive and doesnt have to rely on taxis to bring him to work every day. Plus, if you employ him, you dont have to spend a fortune turning your entire premises upside down and inside out to make it accessible. Thats just the way it works. The Powers That Be can pass all the equal opportunity laws and use all the politically correct language they want, but they cant beat discrimination when it makes good economic sense. I could work fifteen hours or more a week if I had the chance, but I can count on the stump of an amputated hand the number of companies that would let me in the front door.
I'm not having a go at you or any other Coalition supporters here. Just bringing something to light that the majority doesn't often consider
.W
Shannow
Stunt Plough Rider
Wrathy, the "welfare to work" is musch worse than trying to get people off welfare.
My sister (paraplegic with Spina Bifida) has been employed since she was20 years old, went to Uni, got a degree in psych etc. She put her hand up for someone to vacuum/dust her house, and was told to get stuffed...AND that as she's currently employable, she's got to have her condition degrade in order to ever be eligible for disability support. They also wanted to make her pay for her prosthetics and shit.
What's really bad about the welfare to work WRT disabilities is that soon after Howard got in, they decided to re define the long term unelmployed.
Unemployed for more than 2 years, and you were therefore unemployable, and there must be something wrong with you.
So they moved a heap of long term unemployed onto disability benefits, and declared a great success in fixing unemployment.
Wait a few years, demonise the people that they declared disabled as being able bodies and bludgers, and there you go.
My sister (paraplegic with Spina Bifida) has been employed since she was20 years old, went to Uni, got a degree in psych etc. She put her hand up for someone to vacuum/dust her house, and was told to get stuffed...AND that as she's currently employable, she's got to have her condition degrade in order to ever be eligible for disability support. They also wanted to make her pay for her prosthetics and shit.
What's really bad about the welfare to work WRT disabilities is that soon after Howard got in, they decided to re define the long term unelmployed.
Unemployed for more than 2 years, and you were therefore unemployable, and there must be something wrong with you.
So they moved a heap of long term unemployed onto disability benefits, and declared a great success in fixing unemployment.
Wait a few years, demonise the people that they declared disabled as being able bodies and bludgers, and there you go.
I am not one of those who would support a party unconditionally, even though i said my vote for howard is a default one, there are policies in the libs that i dont like at all.
They have manged to manipulate areas of measuring aspects of economic developemnt to best suite what they are looking to achieve, what shannow said is one way in which they have done this, also by making you count as employed by working 1hr a week, this has helped to bring the UE rate down alot as well.
However i think the gov has copped alot of unfair criticism over various policies, more specifically the new IR reforms, which i think will be a good step for the further developemtn of the country
They have manged to manipulate areas of measuring aspects of economic developemnt to best suite what they are looking to achieve, what shannow said is one way in which they have done this, also by making you count as employed by working 1hr a week, this has helped to bring the UE rate down alot as well.
However i think the gov has copped alot of unfair criticism over various policies, more specifically the new IR reforms, which i think will be a good step for the further developemtn of the country
Celestial-Todd
The Incredible Bulk
My good friend Skotty has had a heart attack, two collapsed lungs and a minor brain hemmorage in the past year. He was told by Centrelink recently that they were cutting off his disability support because he was "able to work"
Sure... he's not confined to a bed and can walk... but the second he does anything more then walk around for an hour or so, he has to spend days in bed
Sure... he's not confined to a bed and can walk... but the second he does anything more then walk around for an hour or so, he has to spend days in bed
Celestial-Todd
The Incredible Bulk
Hey Wrathy... I've been meaning to ask for a while (but was too embarrased)... what exactly is your disability, if you don't mind me asking?
Wrathchild
Miserable Bastard
Cerebral Palsy, caused by popping down the chute two months ahead of schedule. I can get around pretty easily with help from various custom-built gadgets (I refuse to use a wheelchair until I don't have a choice), and I'm constantly aware that I could be a lot worse off.
Christ, Shannow. Your sister's situation sounds horrible! What's worse about it, though, is that the advocacy services that are designed to help people out do almost nothing other than choke to death on their own procedures and paperwork. I used to volunteer for one until somebody went walkabout with a large amount of money and got our funding withdrawn
W
Christ, Shannow. Your sister's situation sounds horrible! What's worse about it, though, is that the advocacy services that are designed to help people out do almost nothing other than choke to death on their own procedures and paperwork. I used to volunteer for one until somebody went walkabout with a large amount of money and got our funding withdrawn
W
chrisvp
Member
Danallica said:
further development of the country for whom ?
Mate , I have a mortgage in which I'm fortunate to have that many others here may never have and have to watch every penny , I work hard and I work overtime whenever it is offered to me to get ahead , you see my wife and I in the next couple of years would like to have our first child , yet with all this uncertainty it looks like being pushed further and further behind.
I have freinds who have recently lost their jobs due to the new IR laws and what do they have now , a casual job at the same place with less money , they dont have holidays unless they pay for them themselves,when they are sick then tuff titties they are stuffed financially and they are still sinking further under .
If you are in a good position , thats great , just remember that many people out there are not , actually many people are stressed out with these IR reforms which is not healthy for this country , the whole "competitive" argument just doesnt wash with me , sure there are bludgers on many work sites , but the people who do the work are still being penalised as well.
I think that the criticism is fair and it should be further examined , it makes you wonder how competitive and fair these work place reforms are when the government only gave the opposition 1-2 hours briefing time of the new IR reforms before it was pushed through , something like this should have been discussed and gone over with a fine tooth comb so that everyone (including this government) knew what the laws where .
My rant , nothing against your opinion , just thought to put my two cents in while I have it spare
Goreripper
Metal as fuck
Onya Chris. The problem with HOward's policies is that if you're reasonably well-off, in a good job that it's difficult to be fired from and you have plenty of assets, then everything's apples. But if you're not, then, well, they're not. Howard is ripping the guts out of the workforce and smashing down workers' right that took almost a century to establish. People are being sacked from their jobs for not signing new "contracts" they don't understand because they aren't allowed to have a union rep there to explain them. Others are being forced onto new pay arrangements that trade off paid leave for an extra $0.02 an hour (hello, Spotlite). The unions aren't running a scare campaign, they're showing things that are actually happening to people. People who, until a few months ago, had secure jobs, mortgages, nice cars. And the whole time, Howard is trying to say that this will help the economy? How, exactly, does allowing employers to pay their workers slave-labour wages stimulate the economy? THEY CAN'T AFFORD TO FUCKING BUY ANYTHING! He's already trying to push people onto private health care. How many people here can afford private health care? I can't, and I probably get paid more than most of you. Did any of you watch Morgan Spurlock's special when he and his missus tried to live on the minimum US wage for a month? That's what Howard wants to do to us. If you know what's good for you, you have to get rid of this outdated, imperialistic cunt.
My family exists on a single income because Xena can't get work. Have you seen those ads Wrathy alluded to? "I guess we should hire someone with a bit of experience." WHAT A COMPLETE PILE OF SHIT. She has gone for job after job after job, and despite her experience and qualifications, she always gets passed over for some 18 - 21 hottie. Again and again and again and again. I recently applied for 15 jobs because even though my job is pretty secure, I'd like to move on. I just turned 37 and I have almost 20 years experience in office work including 8 in a specialised customer service centre. I never even got a call back from 14 of them and the 15th would have meant a $15,000 a year pay cut. You can't tell me my age isn't making it difficult for me to find another job. This would be the case no matter who was in, of course, but it doesn't say much for Howard's employment policies. He's trying to push single mothers into work, but how are they supposed to work when no one will hire them? I know women who've been passed over for jobs because they have kids. You're doing ok under Howard's government? You must be single, educated and between 21 and 30, or married, double-income, with grown-up kids, an investment property or two and over 45. Everyone else is fucked.
My family exists on a single income because Xena can't get work. Have you seen those ads Wrathy alluded to? "I guess we should hire someone with a bit of experience." WHAT A COMPLETE PILE OF SHIT. She has gone for job after job after job, and despite her experience and qualifications, she always gets passed over for some 18 - 21 hottie. Again and again and again and again. I recently applied for 15 jobs because even though my job is pretty secure, I'd like to move on. I just turned 37 and I have almost 20 years experience in office work including 8 in a specialised customer service centre. I never even got a call back from 14 of them and the 15th would have meant a $15,000 a year pay cut. You can't tell me my age isn't making it difficult for me to find another job. This would be the case no matter who was in, of course, but it doesn't say much for Howard's employment policies. He's trying to push single mothers into work, but how are they supposed to work when no one will hire them? I know women who've been passed over for jobs because they have kids. You're doing ok under Howard's government? You must be single, educated and between 21 and 30, or married, double-income, with grown-up kids, an investment property or two and over 45. Everyone else is fucked.
chrisvp said:further development of the country for whom ?
Mate , I have a mortgage in which I'm fortunate to have that many others here may never have and have to watch every penny , I work hard and I work overtime whenever it is offered to me to get ahead , you see my wife and I in the next couple of years would like to have our first child , yet with all this uncertainty it looks like being pushed further and further behind.
I have freinds who have recently lost their jobs due to the new IR laws and what do they have now , a casual job at the same place with less money , they dont have holidays unless they pay for them themselves,when they are sick then tuff titties they are stuffed financially and they are still sinking further under .
If you are in a good position , thats great , just remember that many people out there are not , actually many people are stressed out with these IR reforms which is not healthy for this country , the whole "competitive" argument just doesnt wash with me , sure there are bludgers on many work sites , but the people who do the work are still being penalised as well.
I think that the criticism is fair and it should be further examined , it makes you wonder how competitive and fair these work place reforms are when the government only gave the opposition 1-2 hours briefing time of the new IR reforms before it was pushed through , something like this should have been discussed and gone over with a fine tooth comb so that everyone (including this government) knew what the laws where .
My rant , nothing against your opinion , just thought to put my two cents in while I have it spare
You raise some good points, and i appreciate that your not like the normal tools with whom i debate with on political matters who call me a nazi then storm off because they dont know fuck all.
I look at things from an individual perspective, since the IR my pay has gone up and the bludgers at work have lost their job and they cant claim unfair dismissal, which cost the company $ to fight in court, the result a better and more efficient working environment. I understand that it is likely that some will suffer and i dont think that is acceptable, there should be a system whre you can have a full time job and be able to live a comfortable life with your annual/sick leave etc... and im not overly happy with the fact that certain aspects are being taken away from the worker.
I live at home hence dont have a mortgage or any thing else like that so i am lucky atm so alot of those things dont affect me. i Guess its about trying to find a rational middle ground which neither party offers at the present time, it is just as important to have minimum wages high enogh as it is to not have them to high, which merely results in higher UE
