Low end troubles...

Gelatin

Gelatin

Boob inspector
Jun 10, 2002
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Stockholm, Sweden
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I find it incredibly hard controlling low end in my mixes.. this results in me cutting the low frequencies of a lot of things and the mix ends up lacking low end. Bass & bass drum are usually the main problems..

Do you guys have any tips for taming the low end without just cutting it. Compression? Eq? I've heard of plugins that turn the low end into mono helping with the low end dyndamics..

I'm very grateful for all tips no matter how small:worship:
 
unfortunately I'm in the same boat (dragon ship?) as you ... low end is the hardest thing for me to even hope to get right. So far I haven't managed to get it the way I imagine it should sound ... instead I find myself just doing whatever I can to keep it as clear and balanced as I can, leave a little something in there for mastering if it can help. I'm mostly using just EQ to cut lows off everything based on what I think needs less and maybe some multiband comp sometimes .. Andy's C-4 setting are a good enough STARTING point but anytime I've used it I always have to adjust things to suit my ears but the idea of what it does is good.

I also try to mess with the panning of things a little. For instance, I usually pan my bass off to the side just a hair, maybe 5% and usually to the opposite side of when I have a floor tom panned. If I have anything with more than 2 tracks of backup vocals, I'll have them spread out a little instereo as well ... like 10% L & R while keeping the main vocal centered. Add a low cut to the backing vox, after any reverb, and it usually keeps things pretty clear.

Anyway, those are just some of the things I've tried to help with this problem. Looking forward to more people throwin their ideas in

That beer in your pic looks fucking awesome! hahaha

Cheers!
 
Here ya go!

c4.gif


(from this thread btw: http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/andy-sneap/262441-useful-links-faq-please-read.html ;))
 
Gelatin said:
I find it incredibly hard controlling low end in my mixes.. this results in me cutting the low frequencies of a lot of things and the mix ends up lacking low end. Bass & bass drum are usually the main problems..

Do you guys have any tips for taming the low end without just cutting it. Compression? Eq? I've heard of plugins that turn the low end into mono helping with the low end dyndamics..

I'm very grateful for all tips no matter how small:worship:
Click to expand...

I can recommend you perhaps a better set of monitors? I think most engineers have a problem getting the bottom end right (in particular) at the beginning.

I don't think plugins that make the bass mono is the answer (I don't even know of anyone using this). Don't expect that a plugin is going to resolve your problem, nor Andy's c4 setting... I think the issue is more to do with your monitoring and room acoustics... hoewver, mastering these things take a bit of practise. You could try doing A/B comparisons to get an idea as you go.

I hope this helps.
 
Low end is very troublesome and Ive treated my room and also upgraded to 8in monitors and sub. I'm in a totally square room for mixing 9x9x9 and it cant get any worse as i have to sit in the middle of the room basically. Well maybe it could be worse.....

Anyhow just buy a bunch of cdr's and burn away and listen in car or home stereo and just keep at it. Eventually you will get it dude! Also high pass everything that does not need to be in the lows. Sometimes a multiband compressor and work wonders on things but it can also be a band aid for a problem in your mix you should fix. Thats about all i got and maybe post a sample for us.
 
like others have mentioned, room treatment will definitely be your friend here...stick as much rigid fiberglass as you can in the corners and on the ceiling, and get your monitors as far as possible from the walls

and it almost goes without mentioning...but hi-pass everything!
 
Room treatment, as mentioned, will help you hear things better. But, I would say that the mindset of "taming the low end without just cutting it" is not quite the right approach. If there is too much low end, and then you cut some, and then there's not enough low end, then wouldn't that mean that you just cut too much? As long as you've compressed the bass guitar to sit the way you like, rolled off the guitars, and you don't have general low end problems in regards to dynamics, I would say it's really just a matter of setting levels and carefully sculpting out the EQ. It really can be a pain, but with enough care, a monitoring setup you trust/are familiar with, and practice, you will get it eventually.

Also, use reference CDs. Listen to something for a bit that represents the low end that you would like to have, and really focus on that low end and listen to how it sounds on your setup. Then, play your song and adjust things accordingly! You might realize immediately, "Wow, my crap is way off!".
 
Also I think it is interesting to lowpass whole mix and match it with lowpassed reference CD... I was surprised how muddy and unclear was bottom end in my mixes compared to reference :(
 
Aaron Smith said:
Room treatment, as mentioned, will help you hear things better. But, I would say that the mindset of "taming the low end without just cutting it" is not quite the right approach. If there is too much low end, and then you cut some, and then there's not enough low end, then wouldn't that mean that you just cut too much? As long as you've compressed the bass guitar to sit the way you like, rolled off the guitars, and you don't have general low end problems in regards to dynamics, I would say it's really just a matter of setting levels and carefully sculpting out the EQ. It really can be a pain, but with enough care, a monitoring setup you trust/are familiar with, and practice, you will get it eventually.

Also, use reference CDs. Listen to something for a bit that represents the low end that you would like to have, and really focus on that low end and listen to how it sounds on your setup. Then, play your song and adjust things accordingly! You might realize immediately, "Wow, my crap is way off!".
Click to expand...

Well said...
 
I also had problems with bass in my mixes, everything always turned out too bright and thin for some reason. After I put my monitors on stands, it just disappeared somehow :lol: I guess having the monitors on a table with no isolation just messed with the bass a lot (or my head :lol:).
 
Surgical EQ can work very well here. Also see where the tonic (is this the right word?) of the song is.. if its in D, for instance, the tonic is at around 77Hz. So boost your bass guitar there, and cut the kick drum there with the smallest possible band. Similarly, if your kick's thump is at 50Hz, boost there and cut there at the bass. If they're both around the same frequency and you can be bothered, try pitching the kick around the bass.

I've got some MASSIVE bass recently by using sidechain compression on the bass and then a multiband compressor on the master buss, compressing <70Hz by a couple dB, then raising by a couple dB.
 
Try EQing with the mikes you use first and getting used to their response. A balance of right mikes and good placement will do a lot of the job for you. Listening in a bass-rich environment you're familiar with, such as a car with good speakers.

Generally I cut guitars below 50 hz just to ensure that area isn't mucked up.

To get everything in place EQ it first and see how it turns out until you're pretty familiar with what response you're getting. Then mess around with compression. The fewer elements you use the easier it will be to get an idea of what is lacking and what is overbearing in your mix.

When I first started mixing I would run computer speakers with a subwoofer out of the headphone jack to get an immediate idea of how much bass there was compared to what I usually listen to on my computer.
 
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