Mixing Clean WITH Distorted Guitar

[outbreak525]

Hey folks, just wondering
How would I go about mixing both clean guitar and distorted guitar, playing simultaneously throughout the entire song?
The weird part is that the clean is the lead, and the distortion is the rhythm.
I'm having problems blending them and making everything clear.

I have double-tracked both guitars.
Distortion 75L, 75R
Clean 35L, 35R

Distortion has limiter on it
Clean has compression, delay, and reverb.
I guess EQ is my problem? Doesn't sound clear or full to me :/

 

[bryan_kilco]

I'd think you would need to lower the volume of the distorted tracks significantly in order for the clean lead to be present enough. What comes to my mind right now is "Crystal Mountain" by Death, where the acoustic comes in at the end of the track. But the acoustic is way loud in the mix to cut over the main rhythms.

 

[outbreak525]

kind of pointless without samples/hearing first...

Sorry, I'm on my laptop and this crossed my mind so I had to post!
When I get access to my studio computer I will definitely post a clip.

 

[egan.]

I use clean over heavy all of the time and it's mostly an issue of crushing the cleans and then EQ'ing some holes to get them to cut.

 

[outbreak525]

This is what I'm working with.
I gotta get the guitarist back here to redo that rhythm track. It's a bit sloppy, so please look over that.
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13291790/Tasteless Food Nowhere Near Finished mst.wav

 

[shoelessjoejackson]

needs eq for sure. the rhythm track sounds really washed out to me. maybe open up the panning for the rhythm track to 100% to open up the track and create a bit more space for the leads?

 

[Arsenu,]

i can't remember the name for it, but a well known trick is cutting certain frequencies from one track (let's say, clean GTR) and boosting them on the other (dist GTR)
and vica versa (cutting other freqs. from track two and boosting them on the other)

so you kind of create holes in both and fill them up with each other, or just create holes in one in fill them up with the other

 

[bryan_kilco]

i can't remember the name for it, but a well known trick is cutting certain frequencies from one track (let's say, clean GTR) and boosting them on the other (dist GTR)
and vica versa (cutting other freqs. from track two and boosting them on the other)

so you kind of create holes in both and fill them up with each other, or just create holes in one in fill them up with the other

Surgical EQing?

This is something I still get a bit overwhelmed by as I still have a hard time finding the "problem" frequencies when I sweep my EQ. It seems almost every frequency will sound bad or stick out and I have a tough time finding what is actually "bad".

 

[Star Ark]

I find a parametric eq helps in these situations, with a graphic you have too many options. Try using parametric and finding the bands that really make certain elements of the guitar tracks pop out, you may find the low 120 band gives good note definition on the clean but the 500 - 2000 bands only add useless mids where the 4- 10 region sounds great, and you can fit the heavy guitar around the cleans using the same plugin. That isn't called surgical eq though, surgical is removing problem frequencies with notch eq.

Play really close to the bridge on the clean track too, that might help it sit in a different way to the heavy and normally gives a tighter more compressed take

 

[Arsenu,]

forgot to mention:

IMO the best order to do that is finding the freqs. that compliment the CLEAN gtr track and boost them, only than cutting the dist gtr at those freqs.
clean/acoustic tracks are usually much more subtle hence why you should treat it first.

if above method makes DIST track sound like shit when mixed to together, try boosting different freqs. on the dist track. if that fails, look for other freqs. to boost on the clean track

*i find sugical EQing most useful in the mid frequencies range, because it's the PRESENCE which matters here

 

[agentmetal]

The rhythm guitars sound very "muffled" and lack presence and treble. Unless you really meant this as an effect, I suggest first fixing them (at the source if possible) to get a more defined sound, since you'll have to place your leads accordingly. Then, just position your lead "in front of" your rhythm ; this can be done by boosting the upper-mid (like 1k-2k) and/or presence (like 2k-4k) range on your clean lead, according to taste, and cut accordingly from your rhythm as explained above.

You may also want to turn up your lead a bit and/or automate, since the lowest notes tend to disappear.

Highpassing the clean lead (at least at 200 Hz, but possibly as high as 500-600, experiment !!!) can also help sorting out both guitars : you want melody and (I guess) some "aerial" feeling there, no boomy low-end that would ultimately conflict with the rhythm tracks.

edit : and yeah, spread those rhythms to 100% L/R, it will definitely help.

 

[outbreak525]

You may also want to turn up your lead a bit and/or automate, since the lowest notes tend to disappear.

Wouldn't enough compression do the same, in terms of helping the weak notes sound louder?

 

[Folkrav]

Crystal-clear lead sounds tends to poke out easier for me. Listen to all those uber-deep doom and doom/death metal with clean over disto, you'll hear with I mean.

 

[egan.]

I'd EQ my rhythms to sound great first and then EQ the (already squashed) cleans in place listening to them over the rhythms. What they sound like solo'd is completely irrelevant in this application. You also don't a section here or there with cleans to dictate the entire rhythm sound.
Also, doubling the cleans can help even out the dynamics and create some more thickness.