New album Foregone out February 2023
- Thread starter TheJestersDoor
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Jester Slave
Narcissist
There’s nothing wrong with it [THE’s recording], it just doesn’t hit as hard or sound as good.
Jester Slave
Narcissist
You could've noticed that I am somewhat of a... *puts glasses on* jester. Exaggerating for comedic effect is my MO. Saying "it sounds aged" is not nearly as funny as saying it sounds like it was recorded with a chinese mic or whatever, I actually forgot about that line of mine and made me smile. Finally someone could make me laugh on this board! Thank you, me!
The one drawback of it is that when I am talking about something which is actually, no joking, total garbage, like Lunar Strain, people may assume I am just joking around.
As for THE sounding just like mdm, and not like IF... I listened to some early or mid 90s mdm; liked Skydancer, absolutely love The Day I Buried, even if it's just a song, and love a lot of Dan Swanö tracks, though I have no fucking clue when he released those exactly. But sure, I wouldn't call myself an expert. But I listened enough mdm to have the opinion that DotL is not really imaginative, while still holding out on the opinion that some of its best moments are very, very similar to IF's stuff - again, think about the bridge on the title track which is really fucking good, but how can I give 10 out of 10 to it, when it's pretty much inspired by Swim? And to that you may say well it's his fucking riff and you are right, but that is where I would draw the line between giving out 8s and more.
It just doesn't feel inspired. The best parts of the record are heavily nostalgic (there are exceptions, like Conditional), with some very high points, but there are a lot of dull, dime a dozen moments as well.
Pallbearer
Passive Member
Apparently neither Björn nor Jesper know much about music theory. I found this post I initially made in 2019:
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btw, a few days ago I was reading the book "100 greatest metal guitarists" by Joel McIver. I noticed Björn was ranked #34. Niclas and Jesper didn't make the list (or if they did, I managed to completely miss it.)
Here's the main part:
"Björn doesn't consider himself a good player. When I interviewed him in 2008 he said 'I don't know any scales save for the E minor scale and the pentatonic one. We just play whatever sounds good over the rhythmic parts. I am not very spontaneous in my solos, because I have to think them through and arrange them. Even though sometimes they may sound improvised, but they aren't. I am not some Chris Amott, Alexi Laiho or Zakk Wylde who just make stuff up as they go and somehow it always rocks. I have to think about things and write them down on paper.'
He adds: 'Jesper has a great understanding for melodies, it's almost insane how good he's at rearranging the rhytmic parts. He knows music theory even less than I do, and I practically don't know anything about it. He can barely even tune his guitar - that's something I at least am able to do. I have been forced to work on my speed and technique because I've took up playing solos since the last couple of records, but Jesper hasn't done that because there has not been a need to. We're not the most technical or progressive guitarists, even though we like it when music sounds progressive.'
This is a rather good overview of In Flames's attitude - or of lack of any consistent attitude. Gelotte and Strömblad want to expand their musical expression on every new release. It doesn't matter that deep down it's a death metal band, they just might take any direction they feel like taking. Gelotte doesn't have much technical knowledge, but his ability to play fluent solos is apparent, and he's helped in that by his choice of guitar: Gibson Les Paul and its EMG 85 microphones. The guitar gives out a warm, thick sound, which supplies sensitivity for harmonic solos played together with Strömblad, and enough power for the hard riffing parts."
It was mentioned that In Flames received the "Swedish Music Export" prize in 2006 and that it was at least partially because of Gelotte's songwriting skills. And that whatever direction they take with their albums, some people are always complaining, usually about the same issues. (Now that's surprising... I mean, at least no-one of us has been doing this, right?
)Björn also said he suffers from nickel allergy, and it was a long haul to find nickel-free electric guitar strings. Before he finally found suitable strings he used to attach contact lenses to his fingertips with super glue to prevent bleeding blisters from developing. 'The only problem with that workaround was that it took two months to get them removed.'
Well, I can understand saying DotL isn't very imaginative, but I don't think that was the point of the first album. It's a base to build from, putting down a marker for what's to come. For me as a traditional MDM album it's a solid 8 or 9/10, based on the criteria and expectations I personally had for it. If I was expecting something more creative or unique then sure, I'd rate it lower, but I wanted something original which at the same time felt familiar. DotL achieved that for me.
Next album I do expect more. Would like to hear something with some folk inspired elements, as one example, but also a bit more variation in tempo and style.
Next album I do expect more. Would like to hear something with some folk inspired elements, as one example, but also a bit more variation in tempo and style.
At this point in life, I don't need imaginative or innovative albums. I just want to listen to good music or to music that makes me feel something. There are bands enough doing experimentation and innovation. I also don't think that both things add to the quality or value of the music. Not from a personal perspective where I think of music as something that is directed towards people's feelings.
I will die happy if Jesper can somehow find a way to produce one more TJR style track, with those sweet, folk-inspired melodies making a long-awaited return. I don't think it will happen, but a man can dream.
I mean, to my knowledge there's nobody here who only likes Lunar Strain. Most of us like the majority of IF content up until SOAPF, and ITM was fairly well received as well. I don't think anybody here "hates the band" either, there were a couple of posters who definitely did seem to fall into that category but they stopped posting a while back so I guess they did just give up in the end.
Personally I'd rate most of the songs I've heard so far around a 7/10. As already explained I don't care to look back in the distant past because In Flames was a totally different band back then, I'd much rather focus on the present and the albums that the current creative setup have presided over, which mostly spans from SOAPF onwards. In that sense we're hearing something totally different from Anders & Bjorn, likely influenced by the likes of Broderick and Tanner, both of whom are clearly creative types (Broderick saying he was involved in the process for Foregone, and Tanner having his Night Fiends project). You could argue based on the influx of new creative energy we're seeing something completely different to what has existed in the past.
Personally I'd rate most of the songs I've heard so far around a 7/10. As already explained I don't care to look back in the distant past because In Flames was a totally different band back then, I'd much rather focus on the present and the albums that the current creative setup have presided over, which mostly spans from SOAPF onwards. In that sense we're hearing something totally different from Anders & Bjorn, likely influenced by the likes of Broderick and Tanner, both of whom are clearly creative types (Broderick saying he was involved in the process for Foregone, and Tanner having his Night Fiends project). You could argue based on the influx of new creative energy we're seeing something completely different to what has existed in the past.
You claim to have been reading this forum from some years ago. It doesn't seem like that. Nobody here hates IF. We just love different stages of the band.
And I wonder why the "you hate them because you don't like their latest efforts" never applies to the people who doesn't like their first era.
Nobody says that Slave hates IF because he doesn't like LS or TJR. And nobody says that because it would be stupid.
If you think that musicians with or without music studies write in the same way then you don't understand how music is written. It's like saying that not knowing about photography theory doesn't change the way that people takes pictures.
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To me, this album is something like a step back. I think that, despite my initial opinions, ITM was, almost, a step in the right direction. It was not an album of great songs but there were, easily, around 7 listenable songs. This one feels , so far, just a boring attempt to bring again the old times fans to their camp.
ThePhobiac
be at ease
On the other hand, writing music while knowing music theory vs. not knowing it doesn't always mean one will have a better or more consistent outcome than the other.
Different genre, but I'm pretty sure the members of Tesseract don't know a single thing about music theory and just write based on feeling, and their music is every bit as complex, catchy, and developed as any other prog band out there. You'll still have tons of people dissecting their work and applying theory retroactively, of course.
You could even argue that, in some instances, a band that writes music based on vibes and how it sounds would sound worse if they started writing with theory in mind, due to getting too into the weeds and overthinking. Won't always be the case, of course, and the opposite could easily be true (a band that doesn't know theory would improve after learning it), but just an example.
Different genre, but I'm pretty sure the members of Tesseract don't know a single thing about music theory and just write based on feeling, and their music is every bit as complex, catchy, and developed as any other prog band out there. You'll still have tons of people dissecting their work and applying theory retroactively, of course.
You could even argue that, in some instances, a band that writes music based on vibes and how it sounds would sound worse if they started writing with theory in mind, due to getting too into the weeds and overthinking. Won't always be the case, of course, and the opposite could easily be true (a band that doesn't know theory would improve after learning it), but just an example.
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Of course it doesn't. But, they won't write music in the same way. Simply because people who knows the theory will apply it or break it while being conscious of it.
ITM was still below SOAPF for me, but certainly a step in the right direction compared to SC and Battles. Almost anything would have been though.
I can't know for sure about Foregone until I have the entire album. ITM had some 8/10 and 9/10's for me. None of the tracks from Foregone are that high for me. Mostly in the "it's okay" zone. I haven't felt the need to re-listen to any of the singles, and I haven't. It might change when I get the album and listen to everything as a whole.
I write on the side, and if somebody left a review saying they didn't like what I'd written my response wouldn't be "you aren't a writer, you don't know anything about writing structure, therefore your opinion is invalid". I'd take their opinion on board the same way I would anybody elses. If they felt I'd written something derivative or too similar to a previous work I'd say okay, fair enough. Doesn't mean I'd agree with them necessarily, but I wouldn't consider them an elitist arsehole and dismiss their view as worthless. That would make me the elitist arsehole, frankly.
I tried to listen again to them but I just couldn't listen to the full songs again. Not because I hate them but because I find them extremely boring.
SoSD I listened to a fair few times, but a lot of that was when I was splicing it together with the vocals from Blinded By Fear
I’m spinning Come Clarity today.
Our Infinite Struggle has a callback to The Jester Race album for real starting at 2:10. That guitar tone, reverb, harmony, minor key melody is so reminiscent of the bittersweet vibes on TJR. Very good song.
Our Infinite Struggle has a callback to The Jester Race album for real starting at 2:10. That guitar tone, reverb, harmony, minor key melody is so reminiscent of the bittersweet vibes on TJR. Very good song.
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