In a recent interview, Anders said that TJR is his favourite album from the band.
New album Foregone out February 2023
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The Grayfox
Nija
Crowds in the past have enjoyed Moonshield and Artifacts just fine - why they play Graveland nonstop instead of those is beyond me. Whilst Graveland is a fine song, in the context of TJR it's a pretty mid track. Almost any other song would be more interesting.
The 'crowds don't react' excuse has always been that, an excuse. In the end it became a self-fulfilling prophecy. The band ignored their older catalogue for literal decades, those older fans then drifted away, so of course crowd reactions will lessen over time on the rare occasion they throw in a really old track. The majority of the scene kids who got into IF through CC or ASOP aren't going to care about or like TJR, especially if those songs are never played live.
I guarantee if Moonshield, Artifacts, Episode 666, Jotun, etc had been regulars on the set over the years they would get great reactions now. If they started putting them in from now they would get solid reactions soon enough, because they are inherently fantastic tracks and sound awesome live.
It was sad seeing Stand Ablaze get barely any reaction at Borgholm Brinner, but that's just what the IF fanbase is nowadays. 95% of people who still care about the band won't ever have heard Lunar Strain or Subterranean, and would probably recoil in horror if they did listen to them.
The reason TJR songs haven't been played live historically is simply because the band kept releasing increasingly commercial albums that brought in increasingly commercial fans, and they catered to that audience in a live environment. Fans of their best music were left in the dust. Anders may well like TJR and maybe it is his favourite album, but the commercial success of the band has always come first. I'm not saying they were right or wrong to do that, but it is what it is.
The 'crowds don't react' excuse has always been that, an excuse. In the end it became a self-fulfilling prophecy. The band ignored their older catalogue for literal decades, those older fans then drifted away, so of course crowd reactions will lessen over time on the rare occasion they throw in a really old track. The majority of the scene kids who got into IF through CC or ASOP aren't going to care about or like TJR, especially if those songs are never played live.
I guarantee if Moonshield, Artifacts, Episode 666, Jotun, etc had been regulars on the set over the years they would get great reactions now. If they started putting them in from now they would get solid reactions soon enough, because they are inherently fantastic tracks and sound awesome live.
It was sad seeing Stand Ablaze get barely any reaction at Borgholm Brinner, but that's just what the IF fanbase is nowadays. 95% of people who still care about the band won't ever have heard Lunar Strain or Subterranean, and would probably recoil in horror if they did listen to them.
The reason TJR songs haven't been played live historically is simply because the band kept releasing increasingly commercial albums that brought in increasingly commercial fans, and they catered to that audience in a live environment. Fans of their best music were left in the dust. Anders may well like TJR and maybe it is his favourite album, but the commercial success of the band has always come first. I'm not saying they were right or wrong to do that, but it is what it is.
In the end, people will listen to what the band wants them to listen at. If they were regularly playing songs from their old catalogue, people knowing that, would take a listen at it and know and understand what to expect.
Then, when they've been neglecting the most of it, fans going to a show cannot react to something that they don't know. It's like going to a show from a band that you've never heard of. You must pay attention and even appreciate the music but you cannot be excited simply because you don't know it
Then, when they've been neglecting the most of it, fans going to a show cannot react to something that they don't know. It's like going to a show from a band that you've never heard of. You must pay attention and even appreciate the music but you cannot be excited simply because you don't know it
The Grayfox
Nija
They used to make the excuse that because of the amount of guitar tracks on TJR, they couldn't play those songs live. And then when that stopped holding water, they went with the "well, it's really the crowds..." It absolutely was a self-fulfilling prophecy though. I think even now, a song like Moonshield would get a decent reaction. Lord Hypnos or Dead Eternity would probably be nonexistent though.
That will always be the ultimate lineup, at what was the band's peak with Come Clarity's success. I'm glad I got to see them quite a lot in the mid-to-late 2000s. Their sets were still a good mixture of the older stuff and the more modern stuff. But back then the modern stuff was still good - songs from Reroute, STYE (mainly TQP and MSS) and Come Clarity. No Siren Charms, no Battles, no Howard Benson, no conspiracy theory eejits on bass. Just some good ol' Swedish lads playing top tier melodic metal.
mindd
Faithless by Default
Saw this on reddit:
Does anyone here understand Swedish? Did Anders really say so or is it his regular silliness? That would be super dumb, if true. I mean, let's play fucking Everything's Gone every show, but retire Trigger lmao
Does anyone here understand Swedish? Did Anders really say so or is it his regular silliness? That would be super dumb, if true. I mean, let's play fucking Everything's Gone every show, but retire Trigger lmao
ThePhobiac
be at ease
Jester Slave
Narcissist
Anders is the human embodiment of being non-committal, so he would never seriously say such a thing. When was the last time he made any statement at all? Everything is "this time", "we will see", "changes happen", "it depends", "be open". Ask him jokingly whether he puts cereal first in the bowl, like a sane person, or milk, like an absolute lunatic, and he will hit you with "whatever works for you, it doesn't matter either way".
Edit: also, they played it later that November, so... https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/in-flames/2023/el-teleferico-quito-ecuador-23a1b0c7.html
Edit: also, they played it later that November, so... https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/in-flames/2023/el-teleferico-quito-ecuador-23a1b0c7.html
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The Grayfox
Nija
Yeah, Anders says shit like that and I'm pretty sure he's just messing around. In the early 00's, he said they were retiring Jotun too and that didn't happen. Granted, they haven't played it much, but it certainly didn't get retired. Been almost a decade since it was last played though.
Jester Slave
Narcissist
That was a solid first rendition, despite Anders forgetting the first couple of lines to the second verse (I don't blame him for that, the man sings twenty songs a night). It'll get better if they keep it in the set. I found it kind of adorable that you could very clearly hear the crowd filling in with the "Push to the end" backing vocals.
This interview may have already been posted, but I just read it again recently and laughed. It's with Bjorn:
newnoisemagazine.com
This opening paragraph is so strange that I'm not sure where to start. "One of the most popular bands to EVER come out of Sweden, regardless of genre" ? I'm not so sure about that. Ask most In Flames fans and they'll probably know who Abba are. I don't think it'd be the same in reverse. "what is considered to be their best album in decades, Foregone". Okay, firstly, considered by who exactly? Is there a community of In Flames scholars that have agreed this? Was there a vote I missed? Also, in decades? As in, more than one? The band have only been active in three decades, discounting the current one, and I wouldn't even say Foregone is better than SOAPF which came out in the 2010s. That's one decade. It certainly isn't better than Clayman, Reroute or Come Clarity. I'm not even going to dignify the idea that it's better than anything from the 90s (discounting LS/Sub). At best it's the greatest album they've released in this decade, but that's just by default, if we ignore the disgrace that was Clayman 2020. What a stupid thing to say.
I'm also not really sure about calling this a 'first concept album'. Wasn't I, the Mask technically a concept album with a story as well? TJR, Whoracle and Colony tell a story as much as Foregone does, too. I honestly don't even know what to say to the idea that they've "pushed their sound way past the melodic death metal boundaries in which they’ve been caged since the band began in 1990". Are you fucking joking? Half of this album is trying to go back to that sound by copying other bands from the MDM genre, including themselves. The other half is the same Benson-infested pop-metal shit they've been churning out for ten years now. They haven't been 'caged' in anything - they've lost the vast majority of their older fanbase precisely because they refused to keep the same sound.
I genuinely don't think I've ever seen a single paragraph that gets so much so wrong. Literally everything. It's almost impressive.
As far as the second paragraph...
"Indeed, In Flames drew new attention with the 12 songs featured on Foregone, in particular the five singles it spawned: “State of Slow Decay,” “The Great Deceiver,” “Foregone, Pt. 1,” “Foregone, Pt. 2” and “Meet Your Maker.” Critics and fans alike cheered the band’s decision to explore alternative metal while shirking the “bro” attitude that plagued the subgenre in the late 1990s and early 2000s."
What does this even mean? Cheered their decision to explore alternative metal on Foregone? What? No, they cheered the idea that the band moved away from the alternative metal sound, back to a supposedly more melodic death metal sound. Obviously when you listen to the album that isn't actually what happened, but still, those singles appeared to be a change in sound, not a continuation. I genuinely don't understand what the "bro attitude that plagued the subgenre in the late 1990s and early 2000s" even means. It literally seems to be something totally made up. if it was on wikipedia almost the entirety of these paragraphs would have "[CITATION NEEDED]" warnings plastered all over them.
"In Flames appear to have absorbed the feedback and are taking pride in Foregone"
Yeah bro, so much so that they barely played any of the songs live. Very proud.
The interview with Bjorn is nothing special, the standard boring questions and answers for the most part, but this section was hilarious:
It's literally like Anders is sitting right behind Bjorn, glaring at the back of his head as he gives the answers.
"How do you feel about The Halo Effect?"
Bjorn: [Looks surprised, gulping nervously and tensing up] ... h-how do I feel about it?
Anders: [Scowling behind Bjorn]
"Well, it’s interesting to have a band with five members that were formerly from your band. They’re not going out and doing covers, obviously …"
Bjorn: [nervous laugh, interrupting] Haha, that'd be funny. [eyes dart behind to the menacing figure of Anders]
Then the standard lie about not hearing any of the THE, being fully focused on IF and not needing anything else in his life, as Anders slowly nods approvingly.
What a load of shit.
Interview: In Flames Guitarist Predicts "The Future Will Be Better"
Björn Gelotte, longtime lead guitarist for In Flames, discusses staying optimistic in dark times, literally playing with fire and much more.
newnoisemagazine.com
This opening paragraph is so strange that I'm not sure where to start. "One of the most popular bands to EVER come out of Sweden, regardless of genre" ? I'm not so sure about that. Ask most In Flames fans and they'll probably know who Abba are. I don't think it'd be the same in reverse. "what is considered to be their best album in decades, Foregone". Okay, firstly, considered by who exactly? Is there a community of In Flames scholars that have agreed this? Was there a vote I missed? Also, in decades? As in, more than one? The band have only been active in three decades, discounting the current one, and I wouldn't even say Foregone is better than SOAPF which came out in the 2010s. That's one decade. It certainly isn't better than Clayman, Reroute or Come Clarity. I'm not even going to dignify the idea that it's better than anything from the 90s (discounting LS/Sub). At best it's the greatest album they've released in this decade, but that's just by default, if we ignore the disgrace that was Clayman 2020. What a stupid thing to say.
I'm also not really sure about calling this a 'first concept album'. Wasn't I, the Mask technically a concept album with a story as well? TJR, Whoracle and Colony tell a story as much as Foregone does, too. I honestly don't even know what to say to the idea that they've "pushed their sound way past the melodic death metal boundaries in which they’ve been caged since the band began in 1990". Are you fucking joking? Half of this album is trying to go back to that sound by copying other bands from the MDM genre, including themselves. The other half is the same Benson-infested pop-metal shit they've been churning out for ten years now. They haven't been 'caged' in anything - they've lost the vast majority of their older fanbase precisely because they refused to keep the same sound.
I genuinely don't think I've ever seen a single paragraph that gets so much so wrong. Literally everything. It's almost impressive.
As far as the second paragraph...
"Indeed, In Flames drew new attention with the 12 songs featured on Foregone, in particular the five singles it spawned: “State of Slow Decay,” “The Great Deceiver,” “Foregone, Pt. 1,” “Foregone, Pt. 2” and “Meet Your Maker.” Critics and fans alike cheered the band’s decision to explore alternative metal while shirking the “bro” attitude that plagued the subgenre in the late 1990s and early 2000s."
What does this even mean? Cheered their decision to explore alternative metal on Foregone? What? No, they cheered the idea that the band moved away from the alternative metal sound, back to a supposedly more melodic death metal sound. Obviously when you listen to the album that isn't actually what happened, but still, those singles appeared to be a change in sound, not a continuation. I genuinely don't understand what the "bro attitude that plagued the subgenre in the late 1990s and early 2000s" even means. It literally seems to be something totally made up. if it was on wikipedia almost the entirety of these paragraphs would have "[CITATION NEEDED]" warnings plastered all over them.
"In Flames appear to have absorbed the feedback and are taking pride in Foregone"
Yeah bro, so much so that they barely played any of the songs live. Very proud.
The interview with Bjorn is nothing special, the standard boring questions and answers for the most part, but this section was hilarious:
It's literally like Anders is sitting right behind Bjorn, glaring at the back of his head as he gives the answers.
"How do you feel about The Halo Effect?"
Bjorn: [Looks surprised, gulping nervously and tensing up] ... h-how do I feel about it?
Anders: [Scowling behind Bjorn]
"Well, it’s interesting to have a band with five members that were formerly from your band. They’re not going out and doing covers, obviously …"
Bjorn: [nervous laugh, interrupting] Haha, that'd be funny. [eyes dart behind to the menacing figure of Anders]
Then the standard lie about not hearing any of the THE, being fully focused on IF and not needing anything else in his life, as Anders slowly nods approvingly.
What a load of shit.
It's funny because the use of the term bro, as it's used by the interviewer, has a negative... What's the word? I'm not sure. Let's show some examples so that you can understand.
AI broo
Bitcoin bro.
Burpees bro.
So, we use it to laugh at someone.
Then, asking them about THE is just nonsense at this point. Even if they've heard the music, that they most probably did, they won't concede because it's become a part of their message. Obviously, thinking that Bjorn is only listening to IF these days is just stupid and there's also the point of curiosity. We are curious animals so we need to know. Well, everyone needs to know but, apparently, Bjorn and Anders.
AI broo
Bitcoin bro.
Burpees bro.
So, we use it to laugh at someone.
Then, asking them about THE is just nonsense at this point. Even if they've heard the music, that they most probably did, they won't concede because it's become a part of their message. Obviously, thinking that Bjorn is only listening to IF these days is just stupid and there's also the point of curiosity. We are curious animals so we need to know. Well, everyone needs to know but, apparently, Bjorn and Anders.
Yeah, the term bro is being used as a negative connotation in this instance, but it doesn't make any sense to me. "Bro attitude" in 1990s/2000s Alt Metal? I can maybe understand if he's purely talking about nu metal, as a sub-genre of alt metal, but otherwise... not really. I don't think stuff like Soundgarden, Rammstein, Marilyn Manson, Alice in Chains, Nine Inch Nails, Faith No More, Tool, Living Colour or many other of the most famous bands grouped under Alt Metal have "bro attitude", lmao.
As far as the 2000s are concerned, I'd say "bro attitude" would have been more prevelent in pop-punk like Blink-182 and Sum41 than Alt Metal. Maybe you could count shit like Limp Bizkit, Zebrahead or a few others if you'd even classify them as Alt Metal - but generally, no, I still wouldn't say Alt Metal had any "bro attitude". Hell, In Flames themselves were Alt Metal for most of the mid-2000s. Our American friends Xpyro, Galvanized and Phobiac can correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm guessing the frat boys back then weren't slamming beers, hazing recruits and having wild parties to the soundtrack of March of the Pigs, Angry Chair, Sober, Black Hole Sun, My Sweet Shadow, Freak on a Leash, Du Hast, The Beautiful People, and so on... but it's possible I'm wrong.
But yeah, thank god for In Flames taking the 'bro attitude' out of 1990s and 2000s alt metal on Foregone, I guess. Is there nothing that album can't achieve? Not only going back to the roots in the rootsiest possible way, but also managed to redefine alt metal from not one but two entire decades, ripping down the patriarchy somehow. Little did we know Foregone is actually, amongst other things, actually a set of definitive Feminist anthems.
As far as the 2000s are concerned, I'd say "bro attitude" would have been more prevelent in pop-punk like Blink-182 and Sum41 than Alt Metal. Maybe you could count shit like Limp Bizkit, Zebrahead or a few others if you'd even classify them as Alt Metal - but generally, no, I still wouldn't say Alt Metal had any "bro attitude". Hell, In Flames themselves were Alt Metal for most of the mid-2000s. Our American friends Xpyro, Galvanized and Phobiac can correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm guessing the frat boys back then weren't slamming beers, hazing recruits and having wild parties to the soundtrack of March of the Pigs, Angry Chair, Sober, Black Hole Sun, My Sweet Shadow, Freak on a Leash, Du Hast, The Beautiful People, and so on... but it's possible I'm wrong.
But yeah, thank god for In Flames taking the 'bro attitude' out of 1990s and 2000s alt metal on Foregone, I guess. Is there nothing that album can't achieve? Not only going back to the roots in the rootsiest possible way, but also managed to redefine alt metal from not one but two entire decades, ripping down the patriarchy somehow. Little did we know Foregone is actually, amongst other things, actually a set of definitive Feminist anthems.
Xpyro125
Active Member
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I know that particularly nu metal in the 90s and early 2000s and early 2000s basic/alt rock were incredibly fratty (Shit, Fred Durst “sang” about sniffing panties in Eat You Alive), but I wouldn’t say that Americans completely devolved to have that culture— A lot of TV certainly did, i.e. early Big Brother, but it wasn’t completely common outside of that. Of that list I could see frat boys liking Freak on a Leash, but that’s mainly because Korn was just ‘in’ back then, and in fairness, they’re absolutely one of the better nu metal bands, opinions on JD’s vocals be damned. My Sweet Shadow definitely wasn’t on anyone’s minds back then as far as I know, but I didn’t have nearly as much exposure to diverse music as I do now, so I could be wrong there. I only really knew of classic rock, alt rock/metal, nu metal, and thrash back then. Really, the only bro thing In Flames has done that I can think of is Touch of Red’s music video, which isn’t that great to me anyways. It certainly didn’t become an American mainstay with that.
The Grayfox
Nija
Seeing Limp Bizkit mentioned reminded me that I had to sit through that terrible, terrible band once. I went to Summer Sanitarium in 2003 strictly to see Metallica. It was a long day for me, as I had to sit through Mudvayne, Deftones, Linkin Park and Limp Bizkit (in that order), none of whom I enjoy. At all. I would, however, watch any of the first three over sitting through Limp Bizkit again. You couldn't pay me to do it. I will say that I have a strict "do not boo the live act" rule. I think you should respect the fact that there is a live band playing and have a little bit of class even if it's not your thing. I broke my own fucking rule one time and this was it. No excuses, but I boo'd the shit out of Limp Bizkit along with like 50,000 other people. When they played their cover of Sanitarium, something which they clearly thought would get the crowd on their side, we all boo'd harder. It was absolutely brutal.
Xpyro125
Active Member
- Dec 1, 2021
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Genuinely surprising to see Mudvayne at their peak in that list. I do decently enjoy Deftones and Linkin Park, but I absolutely get why people would say their music isn’t as good as people say it is, though that was before Mudvayne went full basic rock with Lost and Found. But yeah, fuck Limp Bizkit— Fred Durst specifically. I think the other guys are actually genuinely talented musicians, but the fact that they willing put up with and enjoy making music with Fred Durst makes the band shit to me. I’d absolutely recommend Borland’s side project, Black Light Burns though, it’s a really cool industrial project whose debut I rather enjoyed. Haven’t listened to BLB’s other stuff, but the debut album was good.
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