noob is recording a metal record... critique me!

[solphilcox]

NEW SONG ADDED, PLEASE BE NASTY

I had the vocalist come in and do some tracking in a makeshift vocal booth, mic was an sm7

so here is another track off the record with all vocals finished, it is also remastered.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4165896/POOR GOD finished vocal mix2.mp3


please critique me on everything about this mix, including the vocals and the little post production 'fx' i attempted to add in, like the reverse cymbal and low fi drum sweep etc. I also feel like I have solved the mastering issues too. amp setup is exactly the same as the last track.





my setup is protools LE (not my choice, i prefer cubase for the plugin variety), with a digi002 and a TC powercore firewire. Preamp is just a daking 4 channel, event reference5 monitors and the usual sm57s, pg52s, akgc1000s mics. nothing fancy at all, my main downfall is my recording room; just a concrete walled garage. working on that though.

guitars (7 string) were recorded with an orange rockerverb 100 and an old 5150. I tracked both guitarists twice, so there are 4 tracks of guitar. I don't know if this is a good thing to do but it seemed to work and I am happy with the tones. all drum and guitar editing (still have a lot of work to do) was done manually.

please critique me!! I am not going to attempt to master the record myself, so again, please ignore that aspect of the mp3.

thanks again! please be as nasty about the mix as you like, and at least attempt not to get to technical on my ass.

 

[Ganks]

It might just be me, but these guitars sound kinda fake to me.

I dunno.

 

[solphilcox]

in what sense, tonally or with the editing? they specifically asked for the sumerian records (faceless, BOO, veil of maya) sound with the really harshly edited and stuttered breakdowns, and i haven't got that right yet which is why it sounds weird on those parts. is that what you meant?

 

[Adda90]

is it just me or does this one clip?

 

[solphilcox]

is it just me or does this one clip?

On reflection I noticed this too. Like i said, the 'mastering' on this is just for level purposes. any tips on how to get rid of that clipping and sweeten up the high end a little? that's what i'm here for. also, how much clipping is acceptable on a recording, by the standards of commercial recordings? i hear it all the time on bug-budget records.

 

[arv_foh]

On reflection I noticed this too. Like i said, the 'mastering' on this is just for level purposes. any tips on how to get rid of that clipping and sweeten up the high end a little? that's what i'm here for. also, how much clipping is acceptable on a recording, by the standards of commercial recordings? i hear it all the time on bug-budget records.

clipping on the master bus the acceptable amount is none, others are debatable

but yeah this mix is clipping like crazy, put a limiter or clipper on the master bus

I think it'll sound pretty decent after you get rid of the clipping problem

 

[solphilcox]

A limiter you say? Ok I'll try one out as soon as I get home and report back. Thankyou though, this is exactly the kind of help I need.

 

[mburton21]

As said before, massive amounts of clippage, easily fixable though.

I don't think the guitars sound fake personally.
Not a fan of the snare though...

I'd like to hear it with the clipping issue fixed for further diagnosis

 

[solphilcox]

all fixed! (i think!)

i just added the limiter on the x5 finalizer plugin, which for some unfathomable reason I had turned off originally. doh.

here's the new link:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4165896/ahr mix NO CLIPPING.mp3

 

[xMannequiNx]

song is sick btw

id take some mids out of the snare and add some 200hz...and maybe work out some of the high freqs in the gtr. The gtrs are so gained that you have to find that freq where the fuzz is and cut the shit out of it. Just make sure you dont kill all the highs.

Sorry but I cant stand that kick sample...if you took out some of the low highs and added some upper high end (6-8khz) it would be a lot more appealing I'd think.

 

[solphilcox]

Legit-ass advice xMannequiNx, these are all things I am noticing the more I listen back to it; they seem to make sense when somebody who actually knows what they're doing says it lol. I realise it's a totally noob approach to just try and get the clicky-est sounding kick drum possible, and to want the guitars to dominate all of the high end.

I've been away from the mixing environment for the weekend and cannot wait to try these tips out, so thanks again everyone! I really love this forum, and will make sure it he's a mention in the record's liner notes.

 

[AerialThesis]

The compression on the master bus is really noticable, as if sidechaining was induced at some times, I wouldn't make this mix that loud, leave it to the mastering. use no compression, clipping or limiting on the master bus. Actually i can't feel any dynamics at all...

 

[solphilcox]

ah yeah, like i said I just ran it through the tc electronic finalizer (x5, plugin version) to get a good level for everyone to hear.

so what, using the plugins I have, would be a good way to master this? I like the x5 a lot if i have time to spend on tweaking it, and as mentioned before I have all the other digi complete production toolkit plugs.

 

[AerialThesis]

Consider the mastering session as a new one. Could you post only the mix without anything on the master bus? Then you import that track in a new session and start mastering it. I might give it a try if you post soley the mix without bus plugins. By the way, finalizer is a crappy plugin, it reacts so slowly that this is why you have a clipped sound and a sort of sidechain sound. It is actually very good to use the finalizer on something else then the master bus to compress something since it gives alot of attack (rms wise) due to his slow reaction time. If you have the digi lugins, then import your track, duplicate it as many times as you want, put the same plugins on every track (ex: Compressor, Expander, deEsser, but no EQ) then set them all so they are not working (Ex: treshold: 0) then compress one track with taste, expand another one, and let the original untouched. You can now parralel compress and expand with only two faders. Then you can tweak any subtle EQ, volume and panning automation you desire on the master buss. I suggest a linear phase eq. Anyways i suggest not compromising you audio quality by clipping the sound for the simple purpose of volume. I have a volume knob at home, and i know how to turn it up... good luck dude!

 

[solphilcox]

ah yeah i get what you are saying.

Would anybody be willing to master this record when it is finished? The band are releasing it as a full-length printed cd as well as shopping for a deal from it, they already have a lot of label interest. You will be credited fully for doing it, and your name will be on the cd liner notes. I am doing this free for them, as they have no money so i would expect the same courtesy from somebody, like me, who wants the experience and the ability to say "i produced (or in this case, 'i mastered' that record"

 

[AerialThesis]

I'll do it anytime! Just try me out when your done mixing your stuff, just don't mix them too loud or they'll end up sounding wimpy loud and the sound will close up and won't sound as large as your mix. i'll end up trimming your song and you will lose some bit definition. (if your tracks is allready peaking around -2dbfs i will have to put the gain down and raising the rms volume back up and adding punch won't sound as good as simply doing it without bringing the track down first. I fucking like your songs and the tonal balance is allready almost right where it should be. If you make sure that every song peaks around -7 dbfs or less we can probably make this record sound so fucking kick ass!

 

[solphilcox]

I'll do it anytime! Just try me out when your done mixing your stuff, just don't mix them too loud or they'll end up sounding wimpy loud and the sound will close up and won't sound as large as your mix. i'll end up trimming your song and you will lose some bit definition. (if your tracks is allready peaking around -2dbfs i will have to put the gain down and raising the rms volume back up and adding punch won't sound as good as simply doing it without bringing the track down first. I fucking like your songs and the tonal balance is allready almost right where it should be. If you make sure that every song peaks around -7 dbfs or less we can probably make this record sound so fucking kick ass!

dude that would be killer! i'll send you an untampered mixdown for you to mess around on.

i just finished another song, complete with vocals. please critique!

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4165896/POOR GOD finished vocal mix2.mp3

 

[nwright]

I like the second clips kick slightly more than the first...Is there a difference between the 2?

 

[AerialThesis]

Unless some clipped sound here and there, that other song is freaking awesome! Sounds so natural and i simply adore the tonal balance of your productions. One last thing i normally ask before i master a mix is that you bounce a seperate track of the 808 and mute it in the mix so i can make it kick without all that distortion and lack of definition it has when bounced in the mixing process. How do you wish to send me an unmastered mix? you could probably email me a drop box link of it in Wav. format 24 bit, 44.1 khz so i can get the best sound out of it. My non-professionnal mail is Power_ader@hotmail.com. Can't wait to work on your stuff!

 

[solphilcox]

I like the second clips kick slightly more than the first...Is there a difference between the 2?

thanks! i did exactly what was advised and took some of the high midrange out. you got any other advise that might help? i'm thinking of blending in a more traditional kick sound for some added dynamics.


aerialthesis, thanks so much for the kind comments; i really appreciate it! i will get a mixdown to you right away. what exactly will you be doing to the 808 just out of interest? this is my first experimentation with subdrops and have no clue at all what i'm doing so it would be awesome for you to tell me what you are doing. same goes for the actual mastering process. i really can't thank you enough dude, this is seriously cool of you to help me out like this.