One World Government/Illuminati/Etc.

[razoredge]

I try to avoid the evil route except for the extremes. I just chalk it up to human flaws and self interests without compromise.

It is well known that its a fine line between fear and respect, this is why I support most laws/rules, though I do feel more recent legal trends have been to pick away at straws (nit picking). Then again legal issues are a tuff call because they aim for that compromise I refered to. It still seems one side ends up eating crow to dance to the tune of the loudest whiners... naturally serving their self interests.

My best guess is that the human race really has no answers yet pursues them and makes a big mess in the process.

 

[Ink_Wirey]

You think that humanity is capable enough to have planned and executed the events of the last century? What a baffling thought -- this spans generations. Are there many people around who were initially 'in' on this, who are now trying to expose it after having doubts? Could links be provided to interviews with such people? If such a conspiracy is true, it would be far from watertight.

I also don't follow how an illuminati would be an 'inevitable' progression from Hobbes' thought. Interestingly, most Philosophers were positive about the world, Hobbes being an exception.

 

[Dak]

Look up the writings of Albert Pike (A high ranking Mason, probably Illuminati). He predicted all 3 world wars quite specifically, and the 3rd we haven't had yet.

 

[Quantum Foam]

Look up the writings of Albert Pike (A high ranking Mason, probably Illuminati). He predicted all 3 world wars quite specifically, and the 3rd we haven't had yet.

i looked it up and various people have said there is no conclusive proof the letter where pike predicts 3 world wars ever existed. something about a guy named carr who says he heard about the letter from some cardinal who wrote a book in 1925. is the letter from pike supposed to be in the 1925 book by the cardinal or does carr just claim that the cardinal told him the letter existed in 1925? if the letter isn't in the 1925 book, then what year did the cardinal supposedly tell carr about it? i can't seem to find any information on these conspiracy websites to resolve this question. could you direct me to some actual proof of whether the letter actually existed in 1925? is there anything to indicate the whole story wasn't made up by carr after wwII?

 

[Dak]

I like that the only information claiming it is a fraud is on actual masonic websuites. Of course they are trying to cover their own ass. Even if the letter was a fraud (or never existed), even the masonic websites says it was a continuation of a hoax perpetrated between 1885-1897. Sounds like someone knew something to me.

A letter that is supposedly 140+ years old, and a personal correspondence that was not, and no reason to be, archived, has probably little chance of still being in existance.

 

[Quantum Foam]

Sounds like someone knew something to me.

To me it sounds like you are basically admitting you know of no evidence that a letter by pike written in 1871 predicting three world wars ever existed. the first question that needs to be answered to get to the bottom of this is does the book The Mystery of Freemasonry Unveiled by Cardinal Caro y Rodriguez published in 1925 quote the letter pike supposedly wrote in 1871? have you read this book? like i said, these websitse i'm looking at are not very clear on some of these key questions. i mean, the book by rodriguez is still in print so if the letter is mentioned in the book why can't i find quotes from the book talking about the letter? the only thing i find that references the letter is william guy carr's book pawns in the game published in 1958, but this is well after wwII and could easily have been made up by him. do you see what i'm trying to get at here? do you have any answers to these questions? we have to be precise about how to discover the truth here or we are left with little else then what we want to believe.

 

[The_Walrus]

Conspiracy theories are a virus like anti-Semitism. I notice they are prominent among metal fans and especially online. There is no evidence to support these theories, just conjecture and circumstance. It diverts attention away from meaningful global political issues.

It's fascinating how the meme of the "conspiracy" works to perpetuate itself. It rewards those that believe it by including them in a number of the "elect" who are privy to special knowledge that normal people ("sheep") lack. It adopts itself well to fit the ideologies of those who are aggrieved with the supposed conspirators (muslims, leftists) or extremists in their own right (the extreme right, religious fundamentalists), or those who feel they are in some way held down, or that their life is miserable because of the government.

Isn't it fascinating how conspiracy theories are completely immune from criticism because if you criticise them you are either 1 - IN ON THE CONSPIRACY yourself or 2 - unworthy to criticise because of your social status (i.e. a clueless "cool aid drinker" or an "elitist" highly educated academic etc).

The internet is the perfect medium for paranoia like this because it allows for its instant propagation. Because people often lack a sense of meaningful political engagement, they turn to such things as a means of protest.

 

[monoxide_child]

You think that humanity is capable enough to have planned and executed the events of the last century? What a baffling thought -- this spans generations. Are there many people around who were initially 'in' on this, who are now trying to expose it after having doubts? Could links be provided to interviews with such people? If such a conspiracy is true, it would be far from watertight.

I also don't follow how an illuminati would be an 'inevitable' progression from Hobbes' thought. Interestingly, most Philosophers were positive about the world, Hobbes being an exception.

what i meant was that, according to Hobbes, self-interest supercedes everything else, as in "we don't break the law because being in jail/prison sucks"
also humans are social creatures, being social causes us to become "clan-ish" because we still feel the instinct to do each of all the things that we're not allowed to do
when the white supremisists kill black people, it's because humans have the instinct of killing people, but because killing humans is socially wrong, the white supremecists feel that killing BLACK people is okay because black people are inferior to white people

illuminatti type structure is inevitable because we are both "evil" and "social" at the same time

a great many of the Philosophers that came AFTER Hobbes wrote a lot of papers that weren't really ORIGINAL thought, many of the philisophical papers written after Hobbes' papers were clearly based on the idea that the reader was familiar with Hobbes' work, when these papers refered to people as being naturally "nice" "altruistic" "good" "noble" etc etc etc
they were basically talking to the people who were familiar with Hobbes' work, and telling them "Hobbes' theory is bullshit"

 

[Dak]

The people who just dismiss any/all conspiracy theories out of hand are being ignorant. I am sure that a large amount of the stuff may be fabricated. But the existance and works of Freemasonry and the "bankster" families are a bit more than coincidence.

 

[monoxide_child]

The people who just dismiss any/all conspiracy theories out of hand are being ignorant.

just the same as the people who just assume all the conspiracy theories to be true

 

[Silver Incubus]

I have got a lot of flak from this subject in the past. Simply because I entertain the idea that there is the possibility and likely conspiracy of the elite to stay elite and they stay that way because they use their influence to continue the bloodlines.

Knowing quite a bit about hypnosis, suggestion, and conditioning as well as a pretty decent knowledge of the brain and the psychology of humans I have to say that whenever I watch television at a friends house, I feel as though the unaware people are being influence beyond their conscious control. For instance, my current job allows me to watch the consuming habits of people.And that is only one example! I watch the behaviour of children and the social interactions. Not only that but the dumbing down of American's especially is quite apparent.

For the longest time and even to this date those whom wield the true power have used religion and its backwards ass thinking to confuse and direct people into somewhat obedience.

Like putting poisoned food in front of a animal you have teased repeatedly with sights, sounds, and emotions of eating will in
almost clockwork manner go for the poisoned food simply because it has no
other choice, not realizing that there still is a choice, but instincts and condition prove a more powerful force.

And clearly anyone who has any debt is a slave. A slave to the debtors and bankers. They own your life. And for most people, you pay for your life to live with some sense of meaning and by the time you own anythink meaningful, you are so sick with the natural progression of man that you can't even enjoy it to its fullest.

Whereas the rich only need to worry about social influence. That and keeping their money and life.

 

[Resonator]

This has been engineered because it is the perfect excuse to strike at the system. Stupidly, we just whine but it's a divine creation.

If you're in a hole, and someone begins to fill the hole, do you yell at the rope for being a fucked up rope, or simply use it?

 

[Silver Incubus]

This has been engineered because it is the perfect excuse to strike at the system. Stupidly, we just whine but it's a divine creation.

If you're in a hole, and someone begins to fill the hole, do you yell at the rope for being a fucked up rope, or simply use it?

Well being a pragmatist I'd obviously use the rope. And yes In a way I strive to be elite, in whatever minor way a musician can.
Nice metaphor btw

edit: My only concern is that the rampant lawlessness of corporations, the corruption of trusted organizations(like the FDA in america). All of these things bring only pain, misery, and suffering to those that really never deserve it.

 

[monoxide_child]

If you're in a hole, and someone begins to fill the hole, do you yell at the rope for being a fucked up rope, or simply use it?

the rope is always there, the rope always fucked up and the problem with America, is that instead of using the crappy rope, we just sit there and bitch about the rope being fucked up and we wait for a better rope that's being used for something else

 

[AtWarWithSanta]

I think the concept of a one-world government is just ludicrous. In America, a great deal of the people warning about it are the evangelical Christians (who ironically support such a system, albeit under Christ as opposed to man).

 

[hexwind]

Did anyone ever asked who's making these documentaries about Illuminati and so on? and how didn't they harm them?

 

[PhantoMPhones]

I have got a lot of flak from this subject in the past. Simply because I entertain the idea that there is the possibility and likely conspiracy of the elite to stay elite and they stay that way because they use their influence to continue the bloodlines.

Knowing quite a bit about hypnosis, suggestion, and conditioning as well as a pretty decent knowledge of the brain and the psychology of humans I have to say that whenever I watch television at a friends house, I feel as though the unaware people are being influence beyond their conscious control. For instance, my current job allows me to watch the consuming habits of people.And that is only one example! I watch the behaviour of children and the social interactions. Not only that but the dumbing down of American's especially is quite apparent.

Couldn't have said it better myself. I wish more people could see those simple truths. Once you step outside the role of the consumer it is ridiculously easy to see the Flynn effect in full course, and it is just as easy to spot out the conditioning, constant bombardment of propaganda and rhetoric.

If anyone doubts that the masses are conditioned and controlled, evoked and manipulated, one need only take a post-secondary marketing program to see clear and irrefutable evidence of such goings on.

 

[derek]

Such contempt for your fellow man.

 

[Death Aflame]

Such contempt for your fellow man.

Seems to me he doesn't have contempt for people at large so much as he despises those few who mislead people by manipulating/controlling information, propaganda, etc.

This is quite a similar position to my own political outlook so I see nothing wrong with it.

 

[derek]

I've never held to the idea that "the masses" are ignorant consumers fit only for exploitation and conditioning.

Presumably we're all above this, are we?