Opeth/Katatonia - One of the Worst CROWD Experiences Ever

Palabra de Dios

Heavy Metal Weatherman
Mar 22, 2005
2,959
9
38
St. Joseph, MO
Not every show has a crowd as courteous as ProgPower. I get that. The Maryland Deathfest crowd is rowdy as hell - and rightfully so: there's a lot of rowdy death/grind/black metal going on up on stage.

But at the Opeth and Katatonia show in Kansas City last night, I was confused and annoyed as fuck by many people in the crowd for various reasons, so allow me to vent just a bit (I'll try not to go on too long).

Let me first say both bands were fantastic. Katatonia sounded tight and every bit as atmospheric, heavy, and melancholy as they do on their albums. Opeth's set, while unorthodox, was also extremely well played, and enthusiastically delivered. There is no more charismatic frontman in metal than Mikael Akerfeldt.

That said, there were more than a handful of people in the crowd of nearly 1,000 that made it very difficult to watch. There were typical metalheads, atypical fans, women and men both who might be unaccustomed to a metal show, and just plain assholes. All these folks were amidst a greater number of passionate people who were extremely courteous and grateful for the performances on stage.

But the aforementioned folks made it worse.

The "typical" metalheads were the meathead types that just wanted to mosh and crowdsurf - even during the calm parts. That's certainly welcome at many shows, but what if there was a pit during Riverside?

Second, atypical fans. These include indie rock fans, prog rock fans, nu-metal/metalcore fans, and also significant others of guys/gals who are legitimate fans. These guys were there and paid the same price as the rest of us, but otherwise looked uninterested in what was going on on stage. I can understand there being some stoic folks that just wanna "soak it in", but it made it difficult for even mild-mannered headbanging when these people would glare at anyone who would accidentally knock into them.

So this is where it made it difficult: I was annoyed by the "typical" meathead metal guys but I was also annoyed by the people who weren't rocking out at all. I didn't know where my allegiance stood. I was somewhere in the middle I think: I wanted to rock out, but I didn't want to get in anyone's way.

The assholes were the worst, though. These guys were the ones constantly heckling the bands, particularly Opeth, or just being rude in general. Opeth played a more somber, clean set. They had the acoustic guitars out for several songs. Despite this, cries for "BLACK ROSE IMMORTAL!" or "BLEEAAAKK!" rang out during the middle of songs. Mikael was getting visibly annoyed at times. I applauded his effort to continue with the set as planned and not actively acknowledge the unreciprocated douchebaggery coming from the crowd.

So to sum this up, maybe Opeth is one of those iconoclastic metal bands that just draws in a crowd with no cohesive identity. They attract metalheads looking to fuck shit up. They attract metalheads who want to stand there and soak it in. They attract guys to bring their girlfriends, try to protect them when things get rowdy, and ultimately fight back too hard when someone accidently slams against them.

This is a wall of text I know. But any commentary on this is appreciated. What have you guys seen on this tour?
 
Second, atypical fans. These guys were there and paid the same price as the rest of us, but otherwise looked uninterested in what was going on on stage. I can understand there being some stoic folks that just wanna "soak it in", but it made it difficult for even mild-mannered headbanging when these people would glare at anyone who would accidentally knock into them.

They attract metalheads who want to stand there and soak it in.

I'm sort of "this" guy. Minus the glaring. As long as you aren't a meathead who is just randomly shoving people and windmilling your arms, if I get bumped when I'm up front at a show I don't mind. But I don't jump up and down, banging my head around like crazy during an entire show, either.

Frankly, my C3-4 and C4-5 can't take that anymore - and no one wants to see a short, overweight, balding 40-something headbang, anyway.
 
I can't comment on the rest, but the heckling's been there from the beginning -- I have a friend who went to their kickoff in Worcester who also saw and heard people shouting, "Where's the heavy stuff?!" and leaving halfway through their set. I've been glancing at their Facebook periodically, and some of the comments are pretty brutal.
 
Opeth is in a tough position. Clearly they are less interested in the Orchid days, and are more interested in this softer exploration of music. Thus, they will alienate fans, and perhaps they should just make it clear that they will not be playing from their earlier recordings, and thus keep some of the expecting ticket buyers away. But obviously, they still appreciate people purchasing tickets and they do not want to distant their fan base.

Maybe Opeth hasn't realized that if the band had only recorded their last 3 albums, they would be playing to far fewer people.
 
There is no more charismatic frontman in metal than Mikael Akerfeldt.

WHAT?!!! I mean he's a decent frontman, don't get me wrong, but I can probably list at least 20 more charismatic than him.

Anyways, as for the fans not liking the softer side...I really don't think Mikael really gives a shit. He strikes me as the type that makes the music he wants to make. Let's be honest here too, no one should have gone into this tour thinking he was going to play a lot of the heavier stuff. Considering the album they just put out and that they're touring with Katatonia, it just wasn't going to happen. Having said that though, I don't think we've seen a permanent change in Opeth. I don't think we're never going to see them do really heavy songs again, it's just them doing something different for now, sort of how Damnation was. That's my 2 cents anyways.
 
Not every show has a crowd as courteous as ProgPower. I get that. The Maryland Deathfest crowd is rowdy as hell - and rightfully so: there's a lot of rowdy death/grind/black metal going on up on stage.

That's also just how people in Baltimore/Maryland act. People here suck. They'll beat the shit out of each other at a Tony Bennett concert. :lol:
 
The last Opeth show I bothered to go see was nearly 8 years ago, which I sometimes think is very strange given that the band released two of my all-time favorite albums ('Morningrise' and 'Orchid'). So I was thinking, "what they heck, they're with Katatonia this time, who I wouldn't mind seeing, maybe I should just go and I wouldn't end up hating it too much." So thanks for talking me out of that stupid idea!

(and no, I wouldn't have been one of the dumbasses shouting 'BLACK ROSE IMMORTAL!!' I know they basically gave that stuff up a decade ago; I was thinking of going even knowing what the setlist was like, but now knowing I'd be there with a crowd full of dumbasses just wouldn't make it worth it for me.)

Neil
 
Maybe Opeth hasn't realized that if the band had only recorded their last 3 albums, they would be playing to far fewer people.

Their last 3 albums, regardless of what we think of them, are their best sellers so uhhh no man. And I do get it, they had to get from their beginnings to get to this point, but by and large most of the fans care about the new stuff, most fans of Opeth don't care about Morningrise or My Arms Your Hearse.
 
The comments about Mikael being "the most charismatic frontman in metal"...

First, I am NOT an Opeth fan. I like Orchid, Morningrise, & Still Life. Saw Opeth 3 times between 2002 and 2004, always went for the openers & checked out Opeth, hoping something would change. They still rank as the worst band I have ever seen live. I have never seen a band look & perform so bored. Everyone always says "well the music is so complex that they have to concentrate.." Ok. Maybe so. But looking extremely bored, acting like you don't want to even be in that room playing your songs, making "jokes" about heroin (which is not something to fucking joke about, not to mention that was the only dialogue during the set), doesn't make one "charismatic". But everyone has their own opinion of what "stage charisma" is.

Two of the times I saw Opeth was when Moonspell (touring The Antidote) was opening and they upstaged Opeth both nights! Fernando Ribiro (I think is his name, Moonspell vocalist) had enough charisma to make up for Opeth! That guy knows how to conquer a stage!
 
Here are the number of listens to each Opeth album in the last 6 months from last.fm (it's too early to include 'Heritage'):

1. Damnation: 52,066
2. Blackwater Park: 49,526
3. Ghost Reveries: 30,889
4. Watershed: 30,777
5. Deliverance: 26,699
6. Still Life: 21,574
7. My Arms, Your Hearse: 20,579
8. Orchid: 15,419
9. Morningrise: 15,280

I knew the old stuff would be way at the bottom, and knew 'Blackwater Park' was their big album, but I'm surprised it's *twice* as popular as the albums that were released on either side of it ('Still Life' and 'Deliverance') since I don't really hear a big difference between the three. Also a bit surprised that 'Damnation' is able to assemble a big enough coalition to put it on top, especially given how far 'Deliverance' falls on the list. Though maybe Mikael was looking at these stats when he decided to go all-clean for 'Heritage' (not that the two albums really have anything in common musically).

Neil
 
7. My Arms, Your Hearse: 20,579
8. Orchid: 15,419
9. Morningrise: 15,280
Wow...I knew that a big chunk of Opeth's fan base was newer, but I didn't realize it was THAT significant. I guess we won't be seeing them play MA,YH in its entirety anytime soon. :lol:
 
I think part of the frustration with the crowd is not so much that there are no songs with death vocals, but that the clean songs they chose to play are not what most people want to hear. There are so many other great clean songs that should be played and a lot of folks including myself are frustrated with the setlist in general. In my case it also doesn't help that I think the new album is complete dogshit, and the fact that there is a good chunk of new tunes in the set. I'll still be going to see them later this month because I had already bought my ticket months ago. But I'm no longer going to blind buy any of their CDs or a ticket to their shows without first hearing the album and seeing the setlist. They are without a doubt my biggest dissapointment so far this year; and they were also my most anticipated :(
 
I couldnt tell you how many people came up to me last nite and was like "wheres the metal?" and my response was "welcome to PrOgpeth". William thats how KC metal shows usually are surprised you havent noticed that yet.
 
I kind of wish I wouldn't have included that comment about Akerfeldt's charisma. That is not the focus of this thread. I think he's an extremely charismatic and funny guy on stage. Simple as that. I guess I implied he's #1, but I was really just saying he's up there with any of the top frontmen in my opinion.

That said, I guess I'm used to smaller KC metal crowds. But I did have a similar "WTF is up with this crowd" moment at Motorhead. There were a few people rocking out, but most were just standing there. I said that that was likely because the show was cheap and many just don't go to metal shows all that much.

But the Opeth heckling seems to be a common thread at all shows so far on this tour, from what I've heard and read. That Worcester show must have been brutal in that respect, because no one knew this "clean" set was coming. They could have warned us with a press release... And that's not to imply I didn't enjoy their set. As someone who's seen them multiple times I was ecstatic to see them shake it up a bit...but I can see how some Opeth n00bs would fucking hate it.
 
Honestly, the band should have known this was coming. If they waited a little bit for the album to come out and be digested by the fans then they might expect what they were going to see. i specifically DID NOT go to the show here in NC because the new album hasn't really struck me yet. I totally get what they were going for, but it's just not hitting me like i wanted it to after hearing the first advance track released.

But, throwing this huge a curve ball at your fans and then not expecting some sort of lashing out would be naive on their part. But it sounds like Mikael and crew are soldiering through it all regardless of the bad apples in the crowd each night, but hey that is what it takes to be an artist. have to take some of the criticism on the chin and move forward.
 
...Let's be honest here too, no one should have gone into this tour thinking he was going to play a lot of the heavier stuff.
They played mostly heavier/growling songs all summer on the festival circuit. They were playing them up to a month before the tour for the new album.

Considering the album they just put out
The album wasn't released before the first show of the tour. The Worcester crowd had no idea what to expect other than a few songs released earlier. If the album was streamed online beforehand, I was unaware

and that they're touring with Katatonia, it just wasn't going to happen.

I have seen Opeth tour with Paradise Lost, Lacuna Coil, Nevermore & Dream Theater. They still played their heavier stuff. I've seen Katatonia with heavier bands. It is not like they are touring with a band whose fans are not familiar with heavier music.
 
I couldnt tell you how many people came up to me last nite and was like "wheres the metal?" and my response was "welcome to PrOgpeth". William thats how KC metal shows usually are surprised you havent noticed that yet.

I think what upsets me the most is that I read an interview with Mikael in which he said that he wrote an entire Blackwater Park sounding album, preproed it, demoed it to the band and nobody liked it so they scrapped it. Okay fine, I don't think a band should necessarily be FORCED to hash out material they don't want to write just because fans will eat it up, but the fact that Heritage is the direction they chose to go in upsets me. It's a sign that Opeth may have lost its inspiration/direction if one giant plodding musical circle jerk is what excites them these days.
 
The album wasn't released before the first show of the tour. The Worcester crowd had no idea what to expect other than a few songs released earlier. If the album was streamed online beforehand, I was unaware

No it wasn't; however, they released the first track and Mikael also gave PLENTY of warning in terms of the album not going to be a typical Opeth album and that it certainly wasn't metal.