Question about Phase

Tachy

Senior Fuckers
Dec 9, 2005
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In Italy
Hey guys I have a question, and for this question exuse my ignorance.:erk:
I hear and read in this forum a lot of people speack of phase and about signal out of phase, but wath is the phase?
And when a mic signal is out of phase what is the effect?
Thanks!
 
Thanks Razorjack.....If I record a guitar track and then copy it in my sequencer and delayed it of some ms I have this guitar out of phase respect the first....It's right? and hear some flanger or chorus effect......
 
I wouldn't say it's completely "out of phase" if you do that, unless your guitar waveform is a sinusoid or so... But if you copy it on another track, reverse it's phase, then you'll have it out of phase and you will hear nothing as both tracks cancel each other.
 
Not very noticable. That's why you can double guitar parts and why you can fake doubling guitar parts by copying and shifting over. Phase is a constant thing it's just that it's only paid attention to when it reaches a certain degree of fuckedupness. You'd have to shift it over quite a bit to really cancel out anything. In my expierience, it will be some kind of bass loss. Try it!
 
Old thread up!

I have 2 tracks of guitar (L-R) playing through Voxengo Boogex and impulses.
Then I add 2 more tracks (L-R) (not re-recorded, but the same tracks copies pasted) with diferent impulse.
Both pairs of tracks sound ok indepently, but all together have phase issues.
I invert phase and it sounds better but not as it is supposed to.
What the fuck?

Another question, what is that realtime graph that have many mastering tools like Ozone, t-Racks, that says "Phase - Correlation -1,0,1), what does it mean? What is it for?

tracks3.jpg
 
those IR files are just like any other wav-file phase dependent.
imagine one IR was recorded with the mic 1cm from the cloth and one with the mic 1.5cm from the cloth...of course they're outta phase.
IF they would be in phase it'd be one big coincidence.

run an impulse (talking about an actual impulse now...like just a one sample click or one cycle of a sinewave or something) through both instances of boogex (just boogex, not your amp/modeller), print them and see how the phase of the outcome is related to each other.
move one of the tracks accordingly.
your two guitartracks should now be in phase.
 
Good tip Lasse!
I had this problem before, and I solved it moving the tracks, but this tip is awesome to know how much the tracks had to me moved.

About the Phase Correlation Meter, it shows how "phasier" is the signal. Near to -1 = bad :erk:, near to 1 = good :headbang:
Sometimes, using Stereo Expanders causes that the whole track goes below 0 in the meter.
 
"Out-of-phase" is a somewhat ambigious term. The reason I say this is because an engineer can use phase to sculpt sound. That's the whole reason behind using multiple microphones for tracking. The result of that sound depends on the relationship of time arrival of the frequencies for each microphone i.e. their phase. Therefore, phase is a time relationship and if two sources simply don't sound good combined, one can think of this as their time relationships not complimenting each other or as habit has come to form the phrase "out of phase". You can see how it can be somewhat misleading because it scultping sound, sometimes we set mic's just so that certain frequencies are actually not in phase together for each mic and some are. It's really about the combination of in and out of phase that in totality creates "the tone".

FYI, the 180 degree flip on consoles or DAW are more akin to polarity which one can think of as direction (-/+) rather than time. Polarity is kind of an on/off thing where as phase has fine increments of time. Both however can interplay within signals of course. Both are important. Both take time to learn and understand and ultimately your ear tells you everything you need to know.