Recording a live amp at low volumes...

[Black neon bob]

Is this really a "not done" ?

I am ready to make a step up from the POD XT now.. the XT is very cool, but for me, it lacks something called air.. bit digital as well here and there.. fine for demo's though, but i think we all agree when i say that recording a real amp has the edge over a POD XT, right?

Well, i live in a crowded house here.. and there is no way i can crank up a mesa or peavey up till 6-7 on the master dial... that's why i have the XT in the first place.. however, is recording those amps an option at lower volumes? i have read and heard that it's not a good idea to record at lower volumes at all, but is it really that much of a difference then?

thanks!

 

[Grave Desire]

I never had much sucess with tube amps recording at a low volume. I have a hard time getting the low end to sound tight and nothing seems to hold together well. It would be pretty hard to have the amps loud and really keep it from going throughout the house but maybe just track during the hours of the day when you can be loud. A fair warning might help!

 

[adrianvillan]

Is this really a "not done" ?

I am ready to make a step up from the POD XT now.. the XT is very cool, but for me, it lacks something called air.. bit digital as well here and there.. fine for demo's though, but i think we all agree when i say that recording a real amp has the edge over a POD XT, right?

Well, i live in a crowded house here.. and there is no way i can crank up a mesa or peavey up till 6-7 on the master dial... that's why i have the XT in the first place.. however, is recording those amps an option at lower volumes? i have read and heard that it's not a good idea to record at lower volumes at all, but is it really that much of a difference then?

thanks!

I use use this when I want the "cranked" sound at low volumes. STill not as good as cranking the amp, but it will get that saturation you get at higher volumes. Just make sure you get the one that match ohms in your speakers
http://www.zzounds.com/item--THDHP

 

[Kazrog]

If I turn up the post gain on my 6505+ to 3.5 out of 10, it is absolutely deafening. I can't imagine turning it up louder, even live or with a drummer.

 

[adrianvillan]

If I turn up the post gain on my 6505+ to 3.5 out of 10, it is absolutely deafening. I can't imagine turning it up louder, even live or with a drummer.

Same here Kazrog! But I cant help doing it because it makes me feel so big and powerful!

 

[AmirH]

You might try a thd hotplate as suggested, or a Dr. Z airbrake which apparently colors the sound a little less. I imagine you still wouldn't be moving enough air to get a "true" cranked sound though.

 

[~BURNY~]

See also weber mass.

 

[kelch]

a power soak will help but only to a degree...

the more it soaks, the more tone loss/change you'll get...

but they're nice to have and are very handy.

 

[kaomao]

this is a 5150 with volume set on 1
I did something similar with a dual rectum frier and was just shit.
5150 at low volume when recorded is really good, live sucks.
the great sound of 5150 is past 3 on the post gain

Maurizio

 

[James Murphy]

i would just record with the pod and capture a d.i. at the same time... then just find a friend's house or rehearsal space where you can re-amp... you will only be making noise for a less than a half hour per song usually, once you get the sound right.... and that's if you have 4 rhythm. tracks per song.... you can maybe even do it at home with this scenario.. just wait until you are there alone.

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

How well does the attenuator preserve the sound? Pros? cons?

 

[kaomao]

If I turn up the post gain on my 6505+ to 3.5 out of 10, it is absolutely deafening. I can't imagine turning it up louder, even live or with a drummer.

I played live with my 5150 with post gain on 5, it was really hell on earth

Maurizio

 

[Flat Fifth Fury]

I'm not Andy Sneap, I only play him on TV but I can say this: In my experience the sound that you are looking for is a combination of power tubes pushed hard and the sound of the speakers working hard. That means deafening volume. Something like a THD Hot Plate will help with the power tubes but the speakers aren't going to react the way that you want unless there is real wattage being fed to them. Speakers that are built for guitar don't even produce their full range of sound unless you put one watt into them. If you have V30 speakers that means that the sound level coming out is nearly 100db and that is LOUD. I suggest you build a speaker isolation box. Basically you build a big plywood box that is nearly airtight with a hole for the mic and speaker cables with the whole box covered in 4" Auralex to keep it quiet. The last recording that I did was at a small studio that was built for pop and vocal oriented stuff. They had an isolation box built for my cabinet because they couldn't tame the volume that my dimed 100watt Marshall put out. It worked just fine. The box was huge and ugly but the results are what matters. If you are only putting your amp on, say, 2 then an iso box should do the trick.

 

[Black neon bob]

And this is why i love this place! you guys rock!

So much anwsers, so many ways to get around a problem like this.. i will try them for sure...

Man, i sold my 5150 a year ago, when i started recording, and bought the POD XT instead.. so i could use the money for the PC as well... kinda miss it right now though... when i had that baby on 3 or 4, i would get "complaints" about two blocks further.. haha...

Kaomao, that sounds good man! at 1 you say? i can get away with that here..

James, you are probably right, will just have to wait for those moments when i am alone and get the job done, and in the meanwhile record pre-guitar tracks with my good ole XT... bless that thing! you can't re-amp with the normal POD XT version can you? i think one would need the XT pro version for that, right?

 

[kaomao]

Kaomao, that sounds good man! at 1 you say? i can get away with that here..

Yes I tracked all rhythm guitars at home just solos are v-amp, so I couldn't play at a really loud volume.
As James said, record your guitar direct at home than reamp at a rehearsal room, it's the only to go to obtain a killer tone.
My tone is not bad, but 5150 sounds good just passed 2 or 3 on the post gain

Maurizio

 

[Machinated]

With an XT Pro you can definately record the direct signal, and the clean guitar, as there are outputs for both. I currently record the direct and clean signals at the same time. With the regular XT I think if you record through USB you can choose to record the clean signal, and then you can reamp later.

 

[Bob Savage]

i would just record with the pod and capture a d.i. at the same time... then just find a friend's house or rehearsal space where you can re-amp... you will only be making noise for a less than a half hour per song usually, once you get the sound right.... and that's if you have 4 rhythm. tracks per song.... you can maybe even do it at home with this scenario.. just wait until you are there alone.

James, how do you rate the DI side of the POD XT? I don't have an XT (would like one), but I do have the Radial Engineering JDI and X-Amp. I'm thinking once/if I get another modeler for laying the tracks quietly initially, I would probably split the signal through the JDI instead of the modeler. Any thoughts?

 

[James Murphy]

James, how do you rate the DI side of the POD XT? I don't have an XT (would like one), but I do have the Radial Engineering JDI and X-Amp. I'm thinking once/if I get another modeler for laying the tracks quietly initially, I would probably split the signal through the JDI instead of the modeler. Any thoughts?

yeah, i don't use my pod's "d.i." output... i use my Radial JDVmk3. i just connect the Thru output of the Radial to the input of the pod and the balanced XLR out to the console/pre. i get much better results this way.. of course the JDVmk3 is Class-A Discrete and costs 3 times as much as a POD, so that's not surprising at all.

 

[Bob Savage]

yeah, i don't use my pod's "d.i." output... i use my Radial JDVmk3. i just connect the Thru output of the Radial to the input of the pod and the balanced XLR out to the console/pre. i get much better results this way.. of course the JDVmk3 is Class-A Discrete and costs 3 times as much as a POD, so that's not surprising at all.

Yeah, I figured even with the passive Jensen transformer in the JDI, it would exceed the quality in the XT.

Do you have to make any track adjustments to compensate for latency once you reamp? I've this nice reamping gear, but haven't taken advantage of using yet, mostly because I don't have a modeler to lay the tracks quietly.

 

[sah5150]

yeah, i don't use my pod's "d.i." output... i use my Radial JDVmk3. i just connect the Thru output of the Radial to the input of the pod and the balanced XLR out to the console/pre. i get much better results this way.. of course the JDVmk3 is Class-A Discrete and costs 3 times as much as a POD, so that's not surprising at all.

So James, you are saying that you can hear a clear difference between the pod's "d.i." output and your Radial AFTER you have reamped it through a screaming tube amp? I've got clips of my guitar recorded direct through my amp live and reamped from a pod di out and honestly, I can't tell the difference between those, nevermind a different di for the original guitar pickup ouput... Maybe I just dont have very good ears...

Steve