Rock Harvest
- Thread starter Justin G
- Start date
PromisedLand
Master of Corgis
- Sep 3, 2013
- 729
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I'd love to see Reverence live.. they released a great album and a couple of cheesy videos, and didn't even tour.
Jasonic
Doom On!
They just completed a short European run.
From every pic I saw tho, it didn't seem like Doc did the tour.
I had heard that his ability to tour is VERY minimal.
I agree, it was a solid rocker from start to finish.
J. Golden
Heaven and Hell Records
The thing is with this festival is with all the conflicting information about who is playing no one can be sure who will and will not be there.
Yesterday I spoke with one of the bands scheduled to play and they are pulling of because that just don't feel good about being associated at this point. I'm guessing the bands that are holding on think that might be known as "The Band that played on" or something. HA
Still like the band I spoke to two days ago they did not entirely have a full idea of what is going on, nor does a lot of the ticket buyers. Imagine that surprise of all the people who show up to see a line up mentioned months ago when they bought their tickets and now that line up is completely different. Sure shit happens and bands drop off of fest, but basically the whole line up?
People should get their refund and it should not be justified with "it goes to a good cause". If a business offers something and can't pull through with that then the buyer should be refunded simple as that. A band or several pulling out should not be the buyers problem and they should not have to gamble on some promoter's possible product. This goes for all these fest. I personally did not lose much on this fest, just to tickets but from what I'm told people have lost plane fair. Just seems sleazy for promoters to pull this shit; you offer an "exclusive" euro band and people from California fly across the country to a fest to see that one band but now can't because the fest can't deliver, well those people should get their cost back back. They did not come to see all those other shitty bands, they came to see the one, you know the one advertised in hopes to grab more attention.
Hell they lost enough just flying across the country.
The worse thing here is not that so many bands have dropped of of RH, the bad aspect is still no one knows for sure what is actually going on with the line up, or anything. The only responses have been vague sentence fragment answers; "the show must go on", what the hell? HAHA
Yesterday I spoke with one of the bands scheduled to play and they are pulling of because that just don't feel good about being associated at this point. I'm guessing the bands that are holding on think that might be known as "The Band that played on" or something. HA
Still like the band I spoke to two days ago they did not entirely have a full idea of what is going on, nor does a lot of the ticket buyers. Imagine that surprise of all the people who show up to see a line up mentioned months ago when they bought their tickets and now that line up is completely different. Sure shit happens and bands drop off of fest, but basically the whole line up?
People should get their refund and it should not be justified with "it goes to a good cause". If a business offers something and can't pull through with that then the buyer should be refunded simple as that. A band or several pulling out should not be the buyers problem and they should not have to gamble on some promoter's possible product. This goes for all these fest. I personally did not lose much on this fest, just to tickets but from what I'm told people have lost plane fair. Just seems sleazy for promoters to pull this shit; you offer an "exclusive" euro band and people from California fly across the country to a fest to see that one band but now can't because the fest can't deliver, well those people should get their cost back back. They did not come to see all those other shitty bands, they came to see the one, you know the one advertised in hopes to grab more attention.
Hell they lost enough just flying across the country.
The worse thing here is not that so many bands have dropped of of RH, the bad aspect is still no one knows for sure what is actually going on with the line up, or anything. The only responses have been vague sentence fragment answers; "the show must go on", what the hell? HAHA
Jasonic
Doom On!
Jeremy,
While I see your point, what would you truly do if you put on a festival?
It's always "Lineup subject to change"
I am sure people bought tickets for Prog Power based on Dream Evil, Vanden Plas, Nevermore, Arcturus, etc in the past. It happens. It REALLY REALLY blows, but it happens.
I understand there is a difference here because of the lack of explanation.
Though let's get real. You are in this business too.
You wouldn't realistically offer refunds based on bands dropping off.
It just isn't going to happen.....anywhere.....
While I see your point, what would you truly do if you put on a festival?
It's always "Lineup subject to change"
I am sure people bought tickets for Prog Power based on Dream Evil, Vanden Plas, Nevermore, Arcturus, etc in the past. It happens. It REALLY REALLY blows, but it happens.
I understand there is a difference here because of the lack of explanation.
Though let's get real. You are in this business too.
You wouldn't realistically offer refunds based on bands dropping off.
It just isn't going to happen.....anywhere.....
AngraRULES
Member
When you buy tickets for a festival, there's a reason why you're not buying a separate ticket for each of the bands participating (or each of the bands you want to see).
It's simple... You're buying a ticket FOR THE FESTIVAL. You're not buying a ticket to see "Headliner with special guests co-headliner, co-headliner, co-headliner, mid-tier band, mid-tier band, opener, opener and opener". Therefore, you should absolutely NOT be entitled to a refund based on one of the bands canceling. You are committed to the festival when you make that transaction - not the bands you want to see at that show.
Does it suck? Yes. Absolutely. It's fucking AWFUL to go through buying tickets and making travel arrangements to see ONE band at a festival and find out they canceled. It still doesn't justify you asking for a refund. Never did, never will.
It's simple... You're buying a ticket FOR THE FESTIVAL. You're not buying a ticket to see "Headliner with special guests co-headliner, co-headliner, co-headliner, mid-tier band, mid-tier band, opener, opener and opener". Therefore, you should absolutely NOT be entitled to a refund based on one of the bands canceling. You are committed to the festival when you make that transaction - not the bands you want to see at that show.
Does it suck? Yes. Absolutely. It's fucking AWFUL to go through buying tickets and making travel arrangements to see ONE band at a festival and find out they canceled. It still doesn't justify you asking for a refund. Never did, never will.
dcowboys311
Member
Interesting because that happened just last month with Wardruna dropping off Stella Natura...
dcowboys311
Member
You are indeed buying a ticket FOR THE FESTIVAL, not HALF THE FESTIVAL INITIALLY PROMISED.
AngraRULES
Member
I agree with you, and again, it sucks a LOT.
Problem is, if it says "lineup subject to change", there's your disclaimer that makes it difficult for you to fight that in a court of law, as far as I know...
(though I could be wrong when it comes to the legal part)
Jasonic
Doom On!
Dude, seriously?
I don't even always know if you are serious or just pulling band names out your arse!!!
All kidding aside, I obviously know nothing of the fest or band you speak of.
What is the magnitude of this fest though?
Are we talking a 5 to 6 figure fest, or a smaller scale one or two day type of thing?
There are many festivals which, well let's face it, are really just two regular shows put back to back and called a festival.
Jasonic
Doom On!
This is what is stated on the page for tickets:
ALL SALES FINAL (REFUNDS ONLY GIVEN IN THE EVENT OF TOTAL CANCELATION).
Once again, it blows, but tickets were purchased for the festival, not one band.
There would be VERY few festivals left, esp here in the States, if promoters gave refunds everytime a band pulled out
Once again too, I do not know the exact circumstances here, and no one else does either. I can speculate that the promoter realized his losses were to be HUGE and possibly asked bands to drop off, or even offered them a small percentage of their guarantee to stay home to cut such losses.
Conversely, maybe one band caught wind of something else going on, and they talked to a band, and they talked to a band, and they talked to a band, etc,etc, etc, and that spread like wildfire creating mass hysteria, resulting in the number of bands dropping.
dcowboys311
Member
Dude, seriously?
I don't even always know if you are serious or just pulling band names out your arse!!!
All kidding aside, I obviously know nothing of the fest or band you speak of.
What is the magnitude of this fest though?
Are we talking a 5 to 6 figure fest, or a smaller scale one or two day type of thing?
There are many festivals which, well let's face it, are really just two regular shows put back to back and called a festival.
A 3-day festival held in the woods. About 1/2 Metal and 1/2 Neofolk/Noise/Industrial/related styles. Lots of int'l acts but Wardruna was one of the big ones (Gaahl is involved). I also don't think refunds were issued for 3-day pass holders but only for people who had the 1-days on the date Wardruna was supposed to play.
But yeah, I do know, and mostly agree with what you're saying. You know me, I just like to argue...
J. Golden
Heaven and Hell Records
I find it so interesting how you, Claus, and so many others know how I run my business and what I would do. HAHA Well let me let you in on this; if something is bought from me and I don't have it then the folks are refunded. If a business advertises something and takes people's money then they soon get that in return. Not ask you customers to gamble on your product is asking them to be investors and not customers.
By the way I have bought plenty of tickets to concerts and been refunded due to similar situations.
In the situation of Rock Harvest it is not even one or two bands it is most everything that has been announced.
J. Golden
Heaven and Hell Records
Jason you would be singing the same tune if you had bought a ticket. Also i never saw this before buying my ticket since I purchased directly from the promoter. And going by that if every single band pulls out and they set up a karaoke machine then I guess that is still satisfactory?
It also states that this fest is a benefit for a charity a charity that gives good reason to be questionable.
Jasonic
Doom On!
Jeremy,
This can not at all be correlated in an "apples to apples" sort of way in comparison to you selling a CD and refunding if it is out of stock.
I agree this is a LOT more than just one or two bands dropping off.
Still, it is the risk any person takes in buying tickets for a festival.
Many venues actually will only refund tickets to a regular event if the headliner cancels. I called the venue when Overkill dropped off the Dark Roots of Thrash tour. Nothing at all against Testament but Overkill were the main reason I was going. I was going to still go regardless, but called out of curiosity to see if refunds were given. They said its their policy that refunds are only given in the event of a headliner cancelation.
So, compare that to the festival situation.
In that example, the venue would say you are buying tickets to "TESTAMENT" the support bands are just that. Support.
For a Festival, you are buying tickets to the festival.
If the festival itself is canceled, then of course tix would be refunded.
Anyhow, I am sure throughout time some promoters have offered refunds if a particular band in a fest lineup dropped off. I can't say this is common practice, as we ALL can name MANY festivals where bands have dropped off and refunds were not on the table.
This can not at all be correlated in an "apples to apples" sort of way in comparison to you selling a CD and refunding if it is out of stock.
I agree this is a LOT more than just one or two bands dropping off.
Still, it is the risk any person takes in buying tickets for a festival.
Many venues actually will only refund tickets to a regular event if the headliner cancels. I called the venue when Overkill dropped off the Dark Roots of Thrash tour. Nothing at all against Testament but Overkill were the main reason I was going. I was going to still go regardless, but called out of curiosity to see if refunds were given. They said its their policy that refunds are only given in the event of a headliner cancelation.
So, compare that to the festival situation.
In that example, the venue would say you are buying tickets to "TESTAMENT" the support bands are just that. Support.
For a Festival, you are buying tickets to the festival.
If the festival itself is canceled, then of course tix would be refunded.
Anyhow, I am sure throughout time some promoters have offered refunds if a particular band in a fest lineup dropped off. I can't say this is common practice, as we ALL can name MANY festivals where bands have dropped off and refunds were not on the table.
Jasonic
Doom On!
Would I be pissed? Absolutely!
Would I expect that a refund were on the table? Realistically, not at all.
I will not argue against the fact others HAVE offered refunds in the past.
Though I think almost EVERY US based fest within the past 10 years have experienced at least one if not more cancellation during its existence.
Finally, I understand that with Rock Harvest, there seems to be some "questionable" tactics taking place which I am sure has increased your sensitivity to the situation, as opposed to other band cancelations where the reasoning may appear more transparent.
nomisofsiman
Member
Wow! Talk about the wheels coming off. At this rate, it wouldn't shock me for this thing to be cancelled in full.
I think it's still going to happen (and I'll be there if it does), but a lot of the appeal is gone.
nomisofsiman
Member
Was this stuff going on at the first one or did they just get too ambitious for this year's?
The first one was a smaller, one day event with minor league acts. I think he got way too ambitious without having the money needed to pull everything off.
