Room Micking When Recording Guitars

[Brett - K A L I S I A]

Hi again,

I've read something in a past post that made me wonder a lot of things. Andy said not to use a room microphone when recording guitars, that SM-57 was (were ?) enough. I've read that this kind of micking helped a lot to get a lot more beef and bottom, was this all crap ? I'd tend to believe Andy more than anyone else of course , but this surprises me a lot and I'd like to understand the reason why . Or is it a phasing problem to have a condenser mic a few meters away ? Also, when I tweak my amp, I do so to have a good sound from where I am (a little higher than the speakers obviously, and a few meters away), so I guess that the sound right in front of the speakers must be horrible ! In fact, I'm almost sure it is, because when I sit down in front of the amp, I get a lot of trebles in the face ! So should I tweak the amp right in front of it and don't care about the room sound or fix it later in the mix with eq (knowing the less the eq, the better it is) ?

Thank you for your answers or thoughts !

Cheers

Brett

 

[Andy Sneap]

well i dont think the low end you get from room micing is particually tight, probably all 250 and not great, Ive been adding a sennheiser 609 in occassionally which can add....something, but you have to be careful with the low end, bass players have there place (on a photo usually!!)

 

[Brett - K A L I S I A]

Hi Andy and everyone,

First of all thank you very much for your answer ! I just have to say : "Uh !". I did not think about this low end "untight" problem ... Actually since I thought that the low end frequencies needed more "space" for the waves to develop from the speaker, I thought that listening, and recording, at a more distant point would allow the low frequencies to develop more fully and be clearer. Then I was hoping to use this source as a possibility to tweak the guitar sound without eq, by putting more or less "room" (bass and body) and "close" (high and tight) mics in the mix... I guess it's worth giving a try anyway...

I also thought that the sound would me more natural since, as I explained before, putting my ear right in front of the speaker (as if it was a microphone) was giving me a lot lot of trebles (more than I could bear ;o) So, does the cab have to sound good at room listening (as it is) or at close listening (lowering the trebles, maybe boosting the lows...) ?

Could I also ask you at what level you do record guitar amps ? I mean, how loud must the amp be ? I guess the answer could be "At the level your amp sounds the best", hehe, but then again, "Sounds best from the mic point of view or from the place I stand usually when playing ?"...

Concerning the bass players and there "place", where do you think a "low cut" on the big guitar sound is advisable to allow these poor "unheard" fellows to be heard clearly (well, actually, most "non musician people" couldn't differenciate a guitar from a bass most of the time ) without losing power (though I do hardly believe that the bass guitar gives a lot of power to the whole sound, I just guess that guitars don't have to sound thin to allow it to cut through) ? Moreover, as far as I am concerned in my band, the bass player and the guitars often play different parts, so it's really important to hear them all clearly...

Thank you again and take care everybody,

Brett

 

[Quintus]

Hi Brett,
well I made some good experiences adding a NT2 about 2 meters away to the 57, cause it adds some warm punch around the lower frequences. It makes the sound more fat, also because of the small but already hearable phasy effect. I like that sound!

Greets, Quintus

 

[Hopkins-WitchfinderGeneral]

Too much low end on guitars just adds sludge and rumbling. If you want that then cool. But i don't.

 

[Hopkins-WitchfinderGeneral]

Sorry pressed enter too quick... I was going to add:

There aren't any real rules anyway so experimentation is the way to go, if you can get a good and interesting sound out of it then use it. Playing is fun and profitable in the long run.

 

[egan.]

Concerning the bass players and there "place", where do you think a "low cut" on the big guitar sound is advisable to allow these poor "unheard" fellows to be heard clearly (well, actually, most "non musician people" couldn't differenciate a guitar from a bass most of the time ) without losing power (though I do hardly believe that the bass guitar gives a lot of power to the whole sound, I just guess that guitars don't have to sound thin to allow it to cut through) ? Moreover, as far as I am concerned in my band, the bass player and the guitars often play different parts, so it's really important to hear them all clearly...

When you talk about cutting the lows on the guitar you should consider the notes you are talking about and they're corisponding frequencies. For example the lowest note on a guitar tuned to E standard is 80 hertz. There will be information below that in the form of sub harmonics and cabinet resonence (especially with palm mutes). But you might not need all of it. Another thing to realize is that the part of the bass sound you are most likely to hear (not feel) occurs in the low mids anyway....especially if you want any inteligibily during fast bass sections. So you can cut the guitars there and give bass a boost.

 

[Cooperman]

On the project I'm working on at the moment I seem to be getting good results by rolling off the guitar below 100-150Hz with an additional small cut at 1000Hz. I then boost the bass at 1000Hz to fill the gap.