Signal chain....ideas?

[006]

Ok, my friend dumped off a bunch of stuff at my house because he never used it, in the box was:

Boss NS-2 Noise Suppressor
Boss CS-3 Compressor Sustainer
Boss TU-2 Chromatic Tuner

Now, I never really have used pedals too much, but when I did it was just a tube screamer or a wah before the amp. I'm curious as to how/where I should put these other pedals. This is what I had in mind though...

Boss TU-2 -> Dunlop Wah -> TS9 Tubescreamer -> Boss CS-3 -> Input on amp

Boss NS-2 Noise Suppressor in the FX Loop of my 5150 combo

Good or no? I've never hooked a bunch of crap up before so forgive my goofyness. I'm assuming that I would want to compress the non-noisy signal, instead of compressing the signal and THEN noise gating it? Then, shoudl I have the wah before or after the screamer? I'm also assuming that the tuner should have no specific point in the path, that's why I'm putting it first..but I could be wrong of course.

I'm using an ESP/LTD EC-1000 with dual EMG-81's into a 5150 combo. The settings I have on my 5150 are to where it's pretty damn quiet, Pre is at 6 (1 o'clock), and that keeps the noise down while giving me distortion and clarity since we have another guitarist in the band. However, when I use the TubeScreamer it obviously cranks the signal as if I've turned the Pre up to like 8, which gives it noise. I use the TubeScreamer and Wah only for lead parts, so they aren't used a whole lot really. BAH! I'm getting myself confused. Help please! Thanks in advance guys.

~006

 

[Noumenon]

Get that tuner out of the chain, sucks tone as hell.

 

[006]

Alright, and what about the other pedals?

~006

 

[Noumenon]

seems good, might wanna try the compressor in the fx loop, before the noise supressor.

the best thing is just to add effect after effect and see what fits where

 

[Hopkins-WitchfinderGeneral]

if you have anything with multiple outs, shove the tuner on one of em, that way you can use it as a mute/tuner option and not have the tone killing.

Generally tho, if you ain't using it, don't leave it there, it all degrades the tone eventually.

 

[Exsanguis]

I haven't found much use for pedal compressors unless I'm playing something a little more country-oriented. Maybe for leads, but it's not at all necessary. Basically, I'd say that you should use the Noise Suppressor in the chain and thats it. Run an extra out or a tuner out into the tuner to avoid its signal degradation, and nix the compressor unless you MUST have it.

 

[black sugar]

FWIW, I use a TU-2 in my live rig and I think it's fine. I also use a modded TS-9 which isn't true bypass. People get all obsessive over true bypass, but most of the time it's a non-issue with the whole band playing.

It depends on the pedal. Some are tone suckers, some are fine. The bottom line is whether or not you can really tell a difference.

Recording is another matter. I agree with the others, take it out if you don't need it for the track.



For the other pedals you mentioned, I've used a Boss NS-2 for heavily distorted bass, but that's about it.

I have a Boss CS-2 which I also run on bass since my bass head doesn't have a built in comp. Running the CS-2 into an MXR Super Comp then into the head gives a monster tone. Not incredibly dynamic, of course, but freaking huge -- great for finger-style players.

I'll run that after a DI split when I record bass. The DI is recorded dry, the miced signal is pre-compressed by the pedals.

 

[Hopkins-WitchfinderGeneral]

I haven't found much use for pedal compressors unless I'm playing something a little more country-oriented. Maybe for leads, but it's not at all necessary. Basically, I'd say that you should use the Noise Suppressor in the chain and thats it. Run an extra out or a tuner out into the tuner to avoid its signal degradation, and nix the compressor unless you MUST have it.

If you wanted to do some finger picking ala opeth it'd be a nice thing to have, but other than that yeah really.

 

[006]

Hmm, good point, the compressor isn't really something I *need* since the TubeScreamer is set to boost my volume and add some more juice to the distortion. I was going to use the compressor mainly so that when I go to do leads, whatever the sound guy has my mic at, they are the same volume at least so that I'm not being drowned out by accident. But nevermind then. As far as the tuner goes, I don't feel like spending a couple of bills on a rackmount Korg, as much as I've always wanted one, the Boss pedal seems to be really convenient especially for live applications when I need to tune quickly.

So what should go in the FX Loop and what should go between the guitar and the amp input? No compressor now. Just the NS-2, TU-2, TubeScreamer, and Wah.

~006

 

[black sugar]

Typically, the wah should come before the TS-9, and the NS-2 should go in the effects loop.

The TU-2 can go before the amp or in the loop, depending on how much cabling you want to run.

If you don't want to run effects loop cables to and from your pedal board, get some patch cables and put the NS-2 on top of the amp and run the TU-2 before the wah and TS-9.

 

[006]

The only reason I am thinking of putting a noise suppressor in the fx loop is because if I remember correctly it puts something between the amp and the speakers...basically affecting the sound in between the output and the speaker cab, correct? So using the NS-2 would kill out the signature 5150 hiss by putting it in the fx loop....right? Correct me if I'm wrong, as I'm not 100% sure on any of this, lol.

So basically like this...

Guitar -> wireless system -> Wah -> TS9 -> TU-2 -> Amp

5150 -> (fx loop) NS-2 -> Speakers

Right?

~006

 

[black sugar]

Looks good to me!

Yeah, the NS-2 can really lock things down if you have hiss or feedback problems. The effects loop is definitely where you want it, if possible.

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

Can you put the Wah, ts9, and tu-2 in the effects loop?

 

[black sugar]

You could... But wahs are better pre-distortion IMO. They seem to interact with the guitar and the distortion more naturally that way.

A TS-9 is typically used to overdrive the preamp section of the amp, which it can't do if it's in the effects loop.

The TU-2 can go in the loop, but it's just extra cabling for nothing unless you're already running a loop for other pedals like delay, chorus, etc.

Generally speaking you'd run wahs and distortion/overdrives before the amp and modulation effects (chorus, phaser), harmonizer, delay, and noise supressors in the loop.

But having said that, there aren't any absolute rules, and you can get surprisingly different results by playing with the order of the pedals. Whatever works, really.

 

[Hopkins-WitchfinderGeneral]

ah black suger, you honour me

 

[Matt Crooks]

Get that tuner out of the chain, sucks tone as hell.

The TU-2 is buffered, and will not suck any tone out of your signal. The wah pedal, on the otherhand, will

 

[black sugar]

ah black suger, you honour me

No, no. The honour is all mine.

 

[black sugar]

The TU-2 is buffered, and will not suck any tone out of your signal. The wah pedal, on the otherhand, will

This brings up a good point... I'm pretty sure all BOSS pedals are buffered, as is the TS-9.

So if you're running a bunch of them together, you're potentially dealing more with noise buildup in the chain, rather than some kind of tone sucking due to non-true bypass capacitance.

Some wahs are buffered, too. The Crybaby From Hell and Bad Horsie wahs are buffered, and I think the newer standard Crybabys are as well.

Ok, that's about all I got. /BLATHER

 

[James Murphy]

I'm thinking those pedals are not the appropriate operating level to be in the chain post preamp.. i.e., in the fx loop. And buffered schmuffered, those tuners suck tone, a simple a/b test proves that, regardless of what the manual may claim. Heard it too many times and fixed it by removing the tuner from the path too many times to be told otherwise.

 

[Hopkins-WitchfinderGeneral]

No, no. The honour is all mine.

Lets do a thrash metal song ala the haunted "no compromise" about the mighty cowbell!

James: thats true although on a lot of amps now you can get switch between the required levels for rack gear and pedals in order to use either.