taking of ones own life

If one wishes to take their own life, it is their business (i.e. to the willing there is no injury) and the extent of mine or anyone else's would be whether they were mentioned in the will.
 
He said exactly what he believed. Don't get upset because he's able to say how he feels in less words than you are.

I dunno... if a Christian simpleton turned up and waded in to every discussion with 'such and such is wrong because God said so' it'd seem a little tiring and beside the point. I don't really see much difference between Cipher's 'natural rights' and a Christian's 'God' at the moment. Both seem arbitrary fairy tale justifications of specific modes of thinking, with no grounding of their own...
 
I dunno... if a Christian simpleton turned up and waded in to every discussion with 'such and such is wrong because God said so' it'd seem a little tiring and beside the point. I don't really see much difference between Cipher's 'natural rights' and a Christian's 'God' at the moment. Both seem arbitrary fairy tale justifications of specific modes of thinking, with no grounding of their own...

Well, I'm probably biased. I find the idea of natural rights to be far more appealing than the Gospel. I see what you're saying though Blowtus.
 
There is somewhat of a fundamentalist fervour to the approach i.e. as this is a natural right, then Y, Z &c, but it is more of a blend of common sense and Enlightenment-era philosophy.
 
First of all, yes it is a personal choice, that is a no brainer, therefore shallow if thats all that is said. The statement regarding "no harm" is not always true as some discussion was already had in that area. Then as Blowtus indicated this seems to be the typical blanket responce of Cypher... and yes it is amusing and shallow, nearly robotical.

Secondly Einherjar you are so fixated on our personal war you seem incapable of letting Cypher and myself go at it alone, we can do a good job of it all by ourselfs, so lets apply some maturity and fixate on your own viewpoints and represent yourself, not others.

The gospel and natural rights coincide in many instances, at times more closely than modern law. However both modern law and the bible condemn me of my natural right to slay those of greed who negatively impact life, so some no doubt should get on their knees and pray
 
Secondly Einherjar you are so fixated on our personal war you seem incapable of letting Cypher and myself go at it alone, we can do a good job of it all by ourselfs, so lets apply some maturity and fixate on your own viewpoints and represent yourself, not others.

You're actually right about that. I probably shouldn't have said anything.

My apologies. Carry on.
 
I think suicide is pointless. Everyone has to go through pain and struggles. But you need to take it and move on.

Obviously the person committing it doesn't want to 'take it and move on'.

In my opinion, there is nothing cowardly about suicide, nor will you go to hell just because the Bible says so. Suicide is commonly a last resort for people, when things really hit rock bottom. It is that persons decision to take their life, and most suicide deaths have been meditated over for some time before committing to it.

I honestly have no objections to it. It's devestating to lose someone close to you yes, but it is not anyone else's choice but the person wanting to end their life.
 
If you want to kill yourself, go ahead. I just think it's a really lame way to get attention. And even then, once you are dead, you probably won't be able to witness it.
 
I believe that Suicide is acceptable and a reasonable solution for some. However there are many people who commit suicide wrongfully or irrationally, especially ones who have responsibilities etc...

I believe suicide is an extension of free will in a sense and a biproduct of an imperfect world.
 
Suicide should be more accepted in our culture. I don't really understand how we can let ourselves believe that suicide automatically means someone is depressed and messed up. There's nothing wrong with killing yourself for those reasons, but those aren't the only reasons.

The truth is, suicide can be an invaluable tool in life. If you're truly ready and willing to kill yourself, then 90% of the world's burdens are obsolete to you. Your boss wants you to do some shit you don't want to do? Fuck it, test him, if you lose your job, so what? No money to eat, so what? People trying to pressure you into things with mindgames, screw them, what can they do? You can still live as normal a life as you want but you're immuned to the thing that forces most people into lives they don't want. If things ever get bad, you can just die. And death isn't a bad thing, all pain goes away forever. And pushing limits like that has yet to land me in the gutter.

Everyone can do what they want with their life, but I'd much rather live a fun, carefree life of excess. I don't personally understand the value of living a grueling 80 year life where you're holding back every day and working your ass off as a slave to the system. I'd much rather use up those resources quickly and have my life be a truly amazing and satisfying experience for me.

I'm also with Winter 100%. Just because somebody else thinks they ought to "move on" doesn't mean that it's the right choice for them, and just because everybody experiences pain doesn't mean that suiciders don't have a more than fair reason to kill themselves. It really is their life to do with as they please, and anyone who would want somebody to live a joyless pain-filled life just so their family won't have to go through the inconvenience of losing them is being as selfish as they're accusing the suiciders of being.

P.S. The vatican also decided a year or two ago that suiciders no longer go automatically to hell because of their suicide.
 
Suicide should be more accepted in our culture. I don't really understand how we can let ourselves believe that suicide automatically means someone is depressed and messed up. There's nothing wrong with killing yourself for those reasons, but those aren't the only reasons.

The truth is, suicide can be an invaluable tool in life. If you're truly ready and willing to kill yourself, then 90% of the world's burdens are obsolete to you. Your boss wants you to do some shit you don't want to do? Fuck it, test him, if you lose your job, so what? No money to eat, so what? People trying to pressure you into things with mindgames, screw them, what can they do? You can still live as normal a life as you want but you're immuned to the thing that forces most people into lives they don't want. If things ever get bad, you can just die. And death isn't a bad thing, all pain goes away forever. And pushing limits like that has yet to land me in the gutter.

Everyone can do what they want with their life, but I'd much rather live a fun, carefree life of excess. I don't personally understand the value of living a grueling 80 year life where you're holding back every day and working your ass off as a slave to the system. I'd much rather use up those resources quickly and have my life be a truly amazing and satisfying experience for me.

I'm also with Winter 100%. Just because somebody else thinks they ought to "move on" doesn't mean that it's the right choice for them, and just because everybody experiences pain doesn't mean that suiciders don't have a more than fair reason to kill themselves. It really is their life to do with as they please, and anyone who would want somebody to live a joyless pain-filled life just so their family won't have to go through the inconvenience of losing them is being as selfish as they're accusing the suiciders of being.

P.S. The vatican also decided a year or two ago that suiciders no longer go automatically to hell because of their suicide.

I don't think suicide should be used as an excuse to live a reckless life without thinking about the consequences. I don't think it is right to abandon ones responsibilities by committing suicide especially if they have children.
 
That's not what I'm saying at all. I didn't say anything about living recklessly. I just think it makes more sense to live a shorter life rather than trying to stretch your body and resources for 60-100 years. Someone who's making these kinds of decisions is not being reckless, they're thinking through all of the consequences. I'm also not promoting having kids and then abadoning them. I'm promoting a life of autonomy, with no reponsibilities that will suffer after your death.