The day the country died

[Celtik Militia]

well first of all, not only germanics were oppressed by christians.
also christianity is still part of our society's mentality, it is way too present everywhere. so being antichristian isnt only for what they did in the past, its for their ideals which are stil omnipresent around us, ideals we happen to not agree with.

the main reason why i'm antichristian is that i find it too weak, it weakened my people, and its ideals are totally lame (turn the other cheek, excessive tolerance, dont fuck for pleasure, dont use condoms... god will protect you from aids..etc..). christians are also full of hypocrisy, they say adam and eve were just an image, but at the time the bible was written they really thought this story to be true. they deny now because of the scientific studies on evolution, they are more believable now that they say the bible is just one big image. many christians nowadays still say that we wont go to heaven if we dont accept God, i dont need their preach, they still excessively try to convert everyone. i also dont believe christianity to be part of my ancestral culture (ok thats going back to the past, but still, christianity is extra european culture which doesnt belong here). to speak of nowadays, bush's christianity doesnt really do much good for the world, and pedophile priests dont either.
but above this, i can obvioulsy still appreciate someone who is of christian faith, as long as its not excessive faith, the person would break my nerves too often if that was the case.

 

[víkingr]

Well I've never had a problem with christians and where I live I actually know noone who is really christian, so what is the need to be so antichristian? It is the way of life they chose, so it's their loss if they lead a life lead by the bible. They are not harming me or anyone I know.
Second thing, I never said all germanics were oppressed by the christians.
And all those bands and people don't say they hate christians because of what they do today (yes I know there is some, but I'm talking the majority), but because of what they did to their ancestors, and well that's just bullshit.
But in most ofl your arguments you are actually more saying the christians harm themselves through their belief, than you or other non-christians. . And I don't see why their ideals should do anything to you, because they sure as hell don't do anything to me. If they want to believe bullshit, well they should just go ahead and believe it, I don't need to hate them because of it.

 

[Celtik Militia]

it is true that most bands are antichristian talking about what they did in the past.
but i will tell you what harm the do to me now, and i did talk about it on my previous post but whatever :
they weaken my people, weakening them with their excessive tolerance on other people invading the shit out of my country, and that is harming me, in a sense that i dont appreciate it and dont want that. also i said they dont want us to use condoms, ok i'm not christian so i use them, but it just shows how stupid they are and they are not open to nowadays problems... it doesnt affect me but i'm not totally selfish, it affects other people and just shows they are totally unaware of reality. i was never raped by a priest either, but being not selfish, i dont appreciate that either. christians also affect me by their preach which was personnally given to me and their threats to me that i will go to hell. and bush of course harms the whole world including me indirectly with their conservative christianity.
but i am not a fervant anti christian, i'm not a militant of anti christianity, i shouldnt be answering the question cause i'm probably not the best one to answer this here.

 

[TheLastWithPaganBlood]

Read Vargsmal or die!!!1

WE are not selfish and because our people are weakkend by the chrissies and perhaps our our offspring will bé too we hater them and their stuopid fucking copycat cocktail religion, a big piece of judaism, altered, plus some germanic, a little celtik and some mediterrainian and you have it: Shit! fuck

Svaaaake krissssstne
döööööööööö
i natt!

I must return to my before party!

 

[DemonsAndLies666]

this thread is stupid =\

yeah :/

 

[Valkyre_28]

Read Vargsmal or die!!!1

WE are not selfish and because our people are weakkend by the chrissies and perhaps our our offspring will bé too we hater them and their stuopid fucking copycat cocktail religion, a big piece of judaism, altered, plus some germanic, a little celtik and some mediterrainian and you have it: Shit! fuck

Svaaaake krissssstne
döööööööööö
i natt!

I must return to my before party!

What are you celebrating?

 

[TheLastWithPaganBlood]

anyone know Defleshed? my mother tipped and said they were good.

 

[víkingr]

Wow I can't believe it, Celtik Militia your second post with arguments that are complete bullshit and the last with pagan blood sets one right on top of it. I am not trying to offend you in any way, but for all your arguments the only thing is that I can say: it's the peoples own fault if they believe in it, and I feel no pity what so ever for them if it weekens them. And coming back to something you wrote in your first post: The part with Adam and Eve... you know at the time the bible was written noone knew how everything was created, so they resorted to believing god created it. Nowadays however there is the evolution theory, so they were proven to be wrong, so why should they still say people were created by god? Anyway none of your arguments justifies in any way to hate christians, so we'll just leave it at that and you can go back to thinking it's cool to hate christians. And now don't start flaming at me, because I did not offend you.

 

[Celtik Militia]

why would i flame you for a difference in opinion?
and i dont think its "cool" to be antichristian. as i said, i'm not a militant of antichristianity, so i dont really give a shit about them in reality. i was mainly trying to explain the different aspects of antichristianity today, which means not related to what they did in the past.
and i said christianity weakens people, with that weakness they are too tolerant and it affects me, cause i dont want my country to be blindly tolerant. it doesnt only affect them, it affects me cause i live in the same god damn weak country they created. thats what you dont understand. also i said they preach AT ME, and i fucking hate that. period. and i also hate their hypocrisy in saying the bible is just considered as an image now whereas it was considered to be the truth before. i hate that when i get into an argument with a christian and he doesnt want to accept it. but then again, its true it doesnt affect me much if they blindly follow it, as you say, its their choice, and i would accept it if they didnt harm anyone with their beliefs which isnt the case. lower taxes for churches in a supposedly non religious society doesnt affect me much either... but its damn stupid. pedophile priests affect me for i feel sympathy and i am sad for the victims.
but you may find my arguments totally irrelevant, and thats an opinion. its normal that some people think an argument is good whereas others may think it sucks. but know this; i am not antichristian just to be cool. and i dont "hate" christians, i tolerate them..... lol

 

[Tyra]

It amazes me, that so many people hang on to something that happened so long ago. It's as much history as the whole bible thing. And history has happened and can't be undone. So why keep bringing up something that has passed long ago? I can't understand that so many bands/people still bring it up, it almost seems to me that it is cool to hate christians for something they did long ago. For me it's ok to sing about killing christians if you're singing a song about history, but all those 08/15 bm and vm bands sing "oh were gonna' kill christians for something they did to our ancestors many centuries ago". And many of those bands don't even have any idea about what exactly happened, and maybe dont even have germanic ancestors.
But anyway this wasn't meant as a "real" response to your post, and maybe I even misunderstood it, but I'm really drunk and really having trouble writing this without making too many mistakes, so well fuck it :/, but I have seen so many posts about that here and on other forums already and just thought i might give my 2 cents to it. Feel free to tell me what you think on that matter too

OK, valid points. Generally I agree with you that hate begets hate. However, I live in a very Christian society. My children and I are harrassed on a daily basis for not conforming and going to church. It is not something that "happened long ago", it happened this morning, today. Asatru is alson notm ancient history. Most of the time I ignore it, because I know that it's their own insecurities or whatever, and I also realize that they have a mandate according to the Bible to convert as many of us pagan souls as they can. I do not have a mandate or even a dogma to follow, so most of the time, I could care less. Again, however, when they for example choose to attack my children in a most un-christian like manner, I can get more pissed off than thou. I generally deal with this by way of telling my brother or someone likeminded (some of whom are on this forum) just exactly how pissed off I am and why. I do not retaliate in this life. Getting even is for suckers. Revenge is much more satisfying, and I know that without hateful acts on my behalf, what goes around comes around. I also do have a clue as to what happened. It is my job to know. I feel that one should honor ones ancestors regardless of what religion they are, as they are the reason why we have basic human right etc today. I do not feel the need to kill Christians, because it solves nothing, but I reserve the right to occasionally rant to likeminded. I also occasionally get sick of being the "morally better one" just to proove that I, as a pagan, is not an "evil devilspawn", while they erase thier own dirty history. They have chosen to be nasty to me long before I chose not ignore them. Can you understand my thinking?

 

[víkingr]

I understand. I guess it's your opinion and I see you're not one of those typical Metalheads who hate christians because the music is about it. And somehow I can't believe that your country is as blindly tolerant as you say, I mean they almost voted Le Pen :/. I mean my country is really not as tolerant, the right wing parties have the majority in Parliment. But anyway, maybe I misunderstood what you actually exactly meant by that, I'm really tired
And trust me, many people would have flamed at me for what I said in my earlier posts, because many of todays Metalheads are kids, who started listening to Metal with Black Metal and Death Metal bands instead of the way most of the Metalheads did, that listen longer - by starting out with good old heavy metal . They're also the ones who think it is cool to hate christians, I mean the bigger part of Bern's(Switzerlands capitol for all who don't know ) Metalscene are people like that, so I'm really fed up with these people, because they only listen to shock
And I just noticed that I really got off from the topic ^^

 

[víkingr]

OK, valid points. Generally I agree with you that hate begets hate. However, I live in a very Christian society. My children and I are harrassed on a daily basis for not conforming and going to church. It is not something that "happened long ago", it happened this morning, today. Asatru is alson notm ancient history. Most of the time I ignore it, because I know that it's their own insecurities or whatever, and I also realize that they have a mandate according to the Bible to convert as many of us pagan souls as they can. I do not have a mandate or even a dogma to follow, so most of the time, I could care less. Again, however, when they for example choose to attack my children in a most un-christian like manner, I can get more pissed off than thou. I generally deal with this by way of telling my brother or someone likeminded (some of whom are on this forum) just exactly how pissed off I am and why. I do not retaliate in this life. Getting even is for suckers. Revenge is much more satisfying, and I know that without hateful acts on my behalf, what goes around comes around. I also do have a clue as to what happened. It is my job to know. I feel that one should honor ones ancestors regardless of what religion they are, as they are the reason why we have basic human right etc today. I do not feel the need to kill Christians, because it solves nothing, but I reserve the right to occasionally rant to likeminded. I also occasionally get sick of being the "morally better one" just to proove that I, as a pagan, is not an "evil devilspawn", while they erase thier own dirty history. They have chosen to be nasty to me long before I chose not ignore them. Can you understand my thinking?

Ok so you must have posted while I was writing my other post. Anyway I see your point, I think those are ok reasons not to like them, but I must say it really must have something to do with the places you people live in, because where I live most people are not very religious. Many of my friends were baptised, as was I too, and then left the church after their confirmation(most just do it to get money, because here in Switzerland you usually get a lot of money from your relatives when you have your confirmation). I don't think there really is anyone I know who believes in God. There are though some christians I also can not stand, and those are the fanatics. At the high school I went to there were these Members of a group called the Jesus Freaks. I never got to know them, and in any means didn't want to know them of course, but only seeing them talk about how great Jesus is made me sick. And I guy I knew, who went to school with them, told me that in Biology they wouldn't believe the teacher when they were tought things about the evolution theory. Well I just thought to myself: What idiots!

 

[TheLastWithPaganBlood]

I understand. I guess it's your opinion and I see you're not one of those typical Metalheads who hate christians because the music is about it. And somehow I can't believe that your country is as blindly tolerant as you say, I mean they almost voted Le Pen :/. I mean my country is really not as tolerant, the right wing parties have the majority in Parliment. But anyway, maybe I misunderstood what you actually exactly meant by that, I'm really tired
And trust me, many people would have flamed at me for what I said in my earlier posts, because many of todays Metalheads are kids, who started listening to Metal with Black Metal and Death Metal bands instead of the way most of the Metalheads did, that listen longer - by starting out with good old heavy metal . They're also the ones who think it is cool to hate christians, I mean the bigger part of Bern's(Switzerlands capitol for all who don't know ) Metalscene are people like that, so I'm really fed up with these people, because they only listen to shock
And I just noticed that I really got off from the topic ^^

Great, a socialist 'viking' (from Switzerland, lol.)

 

[Tyra]

Yes, I agree that it has to do with where you live, as I have lived in more than one country and in more than one place in each of them. If I had a choice to live elsewhere, I guess I may have considered moving, but at this point, I can honestly say this: if you live in Scandinavia and some of the European countries, you really have no clue how deeply this issue permeates North American society. Even in our city, where most are Mennonite (some even horse and buggy variety) Christians even the Christians are not able to get along because they feel so strongly that their particular denomination is the only true one. My children have been called bastards by my mother-in-law becaue my husband and I were married in a lutheran church (the least irritating choice for us). Lutheran is "not Christian" according to them...
Anyhow, I think it was Celtic's post that was on about blindly tolerant. From my perspective, the Canadian one, and this particular city and province, Canadians are not blindly tolerant, but there is an enormously strong Christian lobby that works against everything that the majority wants. That sucks! Shit, have to run. Be back later to finish my thought.

 

[Belgar]

I am sure most here were baptized (as I was) not by choice because at 1 you can't really understand what is going on, but out of family/country tradition. The line I tend to draw is between people who believe in what they believe and are happy with with it and zealots who wish everyone would be like them or else ... Believe in what you want ... but leave the others alone if they are happy with their own religion .. the world would be a much better place. As far as I know, I have yet to see one single war in this world that does not have any "religious" origin of some sort.

 

[Tyra]

OK, I'm back. (I'm putting some bright purple dye in parts of my hair - didn't want the whole fucking thing to go purple just then...). Anyhow, I have, after decades of being at this pagan thing, come to the conclusion that when a person converts to any new religion, or finds a new one in general, that person goes through stages. One of the first stages to occur is almost always the one where one feels the need to visually differentiate one self from the previous religion (say, by wearing a Mjöllner) but also mentally. That eventually leads to a stage that is one where one is often outright angry with the previous religion. That is often where the anger against Christians comes in, and it's often times at that point when people will make nasty hateful statements. It's almost like being a teenager again - you just want to break away from the old (parents, school, society etc) by any means necessary, and it often entails scratching somebody's eyes out verbally. That stage passes for most of us. I see this all the bloody time with the newbies that join my asatru fèlag. Thankfully, we have a really strong core group of members, and also extremely strong clergy, who know how to deal with this and temper it. One has to take ones anger and turn it into something positive.

 

[Belgar]

Yes, I agree that it has to do with where you live, as I have lived in more than one country and in more than one place in each of them. If I had a choice to live elsewhere, I guess I may have considered moving, but at this point, I can honestly say this: if you live in Scandinavia and some of the European countries, you really have no clue how deeply this issue permeates North American society. Even in our city, where most are Mennonite (some even horse and buggy variety) Christians even the Christians are not able to get along because they feel so strongly that their particular denomination is the only true one. My children have been called bastards by my mother-in-law becaue my husband and I were married in a lutheran church (the least irritating choice for us). Lutheran is "not Christian" according to them...
Anyhow, I think it was Celtic's post that was on about blindly tolerant. From my perspective, the Canadian one, and this particular city and province, Canadians are not blindly tolerant, but there is an enormously strong Christian lobby that works against everything that the majority wants. That sucks! Shit, have to run. Be back later to finish my thought.

With some American history you quickly learn that the colonies and what made America what it is today is the freedom the colonists had. Many came to the middle colonies because of religious persecussion in Europe, mainly in the Anglican church. Followed by the germans, dutch, french,....
America managed to establish a revolution for religious toleration and separation of church and state. Sad enough that it is no longer the case when a proclaimed president is launching a crusade against the enemies of American under the guidance of god.

 

[víkingr]

Great, a socialist 'viking' (from Switzerland, lol.)

When did I say I am a socialist? Only because I said right wing parties have a majority? I'm not giving my opinion there you know :/

 

[víkingr]

Yes, I agree that it has to do with where you live, as I have lived in more than one country and in more than one place in each of them. If I had a choice to live elsewhere, I guess I may have considered moving, but at this point, I can honestly say this: if you live in Scandinavia and some of the European countries, you really have no clue how deeply this issue permeates North American society. Even in our city, where most are Mennonite (some even horse and buggy variety) Christians even the Christians are not able to get along because they feel so strongly that their particular denomination is the only true one. My children have been called bastards by my mother-in-law becaue my husband and I were married in a lutheran church (the least irritating choice for us). Lutheran is "not Christian" according to them...
Anyhow, I think it was Celtic's post that was on about blindly tolerant. From my perspective, the Canadian one, and this particular city and province, Canadians are not blindly tolerant, but there is an enormously strong Christian lobby that works against everything that the majority wants. That sucks! Shit, have to run. Be back later to finish my thought.

Yes I see that, I myself am for a part Canadian, and all my relatives who live in Canada are actually devout catholics and they donate a lot of money to church every year- something I never could quite understand - but anyway I have never lived there and when I go there on holiday I don't go see churches or anything like that, so I don't really know how religious the people are there.
But judging for instance by speeches George Bush holds, I guess it should be very easy to see what a high position religion really takes in peoples lives in North America.

 

[Billy Steele]

This isn't anywhere near the case for all Americans. In fact, Bush has seen his all-time lowest approval rate which was voted on by the American public. Despite his 'by the will of God' bullshit, people (even those dumbasses who voted for him) are starting to see him for the poor politician that he really is. I can only hope that the same people who voted for him due to his religious affiliation and who subsequently change their opinion on his performance can come to understand the importance of separating church and state thanks to Bush's example.