The News Thread

Privileged, east coast educated white guys assert that they understand more about how minorities think than actual minorities.

Nowhere did I say I actually knew how black people felt, much less that I know more about how they feel than they do. In fact, I said I couldn't have firsthand knowledge about that. Feel free to hop off Breitbart once in a while and ackchyually read a conversation.

We all know if it had been a black guy who got pushed by a white guy and he shot him in retaliation, we'd have next to nothing to say. And for the record, I'd be on the black guy's side.

If that happened, the black guy would already be arrested and convicted.

Anyway, you originally posted about this story as an example of "good ol' boys on the right jumping at the first chance to shoot black boys" and I fail to see how this story is what you characterized it as. Pretty weird tangent considering it was your response to my post about someone offering $500 on Twitter to anybody who kills an ICE agent.

More often than not, the people who use their firearms prematurely like this aren't in an appropriate mental space to judge whether they should actually use them. They're more thrilled by the chance to do so.

It was mostly just a bit of news for the news thread, and an appropriately alternative story, I felt.
 
Feel free to hop off Breitbart once in a while

Yep, I lean conservative so I must read Breitbart like a good little neocon boy, right? Get bent. Your privilege is showing.

Just as an aside to the shooting thing in Florida, I probably would have merely drawn the weapon to see if the guy backed off. If he continued to advance then all bets are off at that point.
 
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If that happened, the black guy would already be arrested and convicted.

So the same as the white guy? :lol:

More often than not, the people who use their firearms prematurely like this aren't in an appropriate mental space to judge whether they should actually use them.

Prematurely based on what? Should he have waited until his ass was kicked? He had already been pushed to the ground.

They're more thrilled by the chance to do so.

Mkay.

It was mostly just a bit of news for the news thread, and an appropriately alternative story, I felt.

It was just completely irrelevant. Did I miss something in the article that said he was right-wing btw? Or are you just inserting random political bias like you did racial bias?
 
Nowhere did I say I actually knew how black people felt,

But you did:

Fuck you, I'm sorry, but I do have some fucking clue.

in response to:

Please spare me, privileged white guy who has no fucking clue about the mentality of minorities.


Which is it, privileged white boy? Do you assert that you partially understand how they feel/think or do you continue to assert that you never said that and continue to have no clue what you're talking about?

In before muh 'you took it out of context'
 
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But you did:

Do I know firsthand? No.

Please try to keep up. What I was saying was that I have some clue how experiences generally differ greatly depending on race. I wasn't saying that I knew how people of color felt during such experiences. So again, you're wrong.

Yep, I lean conservative so I must read Breitbart like a good little neocon boy, right? Get bent. Your privilege is showing.

You've linked Breitbart pieces before. But fine, deny it. It's your only move.

So the same as the white guy? :lol:

Sooner than that even, was my point.

Pinellas County Sheriff Bob Gualtieri previously said Florida's "stand your ground" laws prevented him from arresting Drejka.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/14/us/florida-stand-your-ground-previous-incidents/index.html

Prematurely based on what? Should he have waited until his ass was kicked? He had already been pushed to the ground.

Ozz is right that merely drawing the weapon would have been a much more calculated and rational option. In this case, the guy barely hesitated:

While still sitting on the pavement, Mr. Drejka pulls out a gun and points it at Mr. McGlockton, who takes four steps backward and away from Mr. Drejka. Mr. Drejka then shoots him in the chest, and Mr. McGlockton, clutching the wound, runs back inside the store, where he collapses next to his son.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/13/us/florida-stand-your-ground-shooting.html

Indefensible, in my opinion.

It was just completely irrelevant. Did I miss something in the article that said he was right-wing btw? Or are you just inserting random political bias like you did racial bias?

Oh, I'm inserting. But I'd put money on my money on it. At the very least, the guy has anger issues.

A woman drove too slow through a school zone

On December 12, 2012, a woman told a Largo Police Department officer that a man driving a black Toyota truck, later identified as Drejka, pointed a gun at her and the passengers in the vehicle. The woman pointed out the truck to the officer. The officer spoke with Drejka, documents said, and he told the officer the woman was driving too slow through a school zone. Drejka denied pointing a gun at the occupants of the car, documents said, but he did have a gun in his vehicle. Drejka told the officer, according to a review of the police reports by the Tampa Bay Times, that he honked at the people in the other car, and that the people in the car made rude hand gestures at him.

A teen didn't drive through a yellow light

On January 10, 2012, Tyler Smith, 18, was driving with a friend when a traffic light turned yellow. Smith decided not to drive through the light and stopped his vehicle. A truck, driven by Drejka, was behind Smith. Drejka honked his horn, documents said, and yelled at Smith. Drejka held a black handgun out the driver's side window of his vehicle and motioned for Smith to walk back to his truck, documents said. Drejka then followed the teen's vehicle, passed it and slammed on his breaks, the Tampa Bay Times reported. The teens did not press charges, documents said. When officers confronted Drejka about the incident, he said the teen's car cut him off, the Tampa Bay Times reported. He said he neither followed the teen's car nor did he show his gun, but did admit to having one in his vehicle.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/14/us/florida-stand-your-ground-previous-incidents/index.html
 
If Florida weren't such an ass-backwards state, this threat to society would get the second-degree murder charge he deserves. I doubt the inevitably pasty jury and judge will sentence him anywhere near the maximum extent of manslaughter.
 
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But do I know and am friends with minorities, including black people? Yes, most fucking definitely.

"I have friends who are minorities and they tell me stories but I don't have any legitimate proof that I know how they think or feel in these scenarios other than anecdotal evidence"

Try again, sir. It's like saying that I can speak about medical issues I know nothing about because I hear my Dad talk about things he has seen reading CAT scans at the dinner table.

You've linked Breitbart pieces before. But fine, deny it. It's your only move.

How long ago though? I don't deny that I did it in the past.

Ozz is right that merely drawing the weapon would have been a much more calculated and rational option.

Because I have to abide by Ohio laws. Ohio is not a SYG state and you have a 'duty to retreat' here unless it is not at all possible to do so (ie: your own home which no sensible judge or jury would say someone has to retreat from in the event of defending themselves). I imagine 99% of CC holders do not want to kill anyone unless their life is in danger (I know I don't. It would be hard to live with that). This guy's life was potentially in danger had he continued to advance. He probably fired because of the SYG laws in place and knew that recourse was potentially non existent.

Granted, if you're in a 'defensive draw' situation, I imagine fear takes hold and people do things they shouldn't do. How does one know how to react if you're never in the situation? In CC classes, you're taught to know what is beyond your target in the event you miss (is this 'sensible gun education', BO?). You want to minimize casualties in that scenario. They actually offer classes on defensive situations with a handgun and I should probably sign up for one eventually.

Drawing the weapon in Ohio (and no other action) has its consequences as well (I believe it's brandishing the weapon). You could be charged but it would likely be dropped given the circumstances.
 
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Just as an aside to the shooting thing in Florida, I probably would have merely drawn the weapon to see if the guy backed off. If he continued to advance then all bets are off at that point.

Agreed.


If you say so. You really are doom and gloom about black people in America, I'm sure you're a treat to be around.

tenor.gif

Ozz is right that merely drawing the weapon would have been a much more calculated and rational option. In this case, the guy didn't even hesitate:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/13/us/florida-stand-your-ground-shooting.html

Indefensible, in my opinion.

I completely agree with Ozz, simply pulling your weapon is enough with these things, and the man did back up. But at the same time I'm not going to jump to thinking he was acting irrational with his firearm because he also only fired a single shot if I'm not mistaken. Ironically he actually did better than a lot of police officers when they let off a shot under stress or physical threat.

Oh, I'm inserting. But I'd put money on my money on it.

ghostbusters-header.jpg


Agreed. He seems in general like a fucking annoying busybody.

If Florida weren't such an ass-backwards state, this threat to society would get the second-degree murder charge he deserves. I doubt the inevitably pasty jury and judge will sentence him anywhere near the maximum extent of manslaughter.

Why would it be 2nd degree murder?
 
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Why would it be 2nd degree murder?

Because the armchair attorney says so

But at the same time I'm not going to jump to thinking he was acting irrational with his firearm because he also only fired a single shot if I'm not mistaken. Ironically he actually did better than a lot of police officers when they let off a shot under stress or physical threat.

To be fair, some of the distances at which they engage targets under stress have a high rate of failing to hit the target. I sometimes have trouble hitting a target from 20 yards with a handgun in a non-stressful environment. And when I say 'hit the target', I mean land a round in the silhouette of the body on the target and not the white space. The white space, to me, means a miss and a potential innocent bystander maimed or killed.

If it's within 7 yards, then it's honestly inexcusable. This guy was probably within 15 feet from a position below the target. 99% of people who practice even occasionally should hit the target 100% of the time from that distance.
 
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Because the armchair attorney says so

Doesn't make sense, 2nd degree murder requires ill-intent before the death but not premeditation. The shooter was arguing with the woman when the man ran outside and pushed him and then got shot, so it would make no sense as far as I'm aware for him to be charged with 2nd degree because any aforethought of malice would be directed at the woman.

To be fair, some of the distances at which they engage targets under stress have a high rate of failing to hit the target. I sometimes have trouble hitting a target from 20 yards with a handgun in a non-stressful environment. And when I say 'hit the target', I mean land a round in the silhouette of the body on the target and not the white space. The white space, to me, means a miss and a potential innocent bystander maimed or killed.

If it's within 7 yards, then it's honestly inexcusable. This guy was probably within 15 feet from a position below the target. 99% of people who practice even occasionally should hit the target 100% of the time from that distance.

Oh sure, but I'm talking less about accuracy and more about firing multiple bullets. The chaotic element in a shooting basically. Going by the Vox article it seems like he shot the man once and that's it.
 
I would support manslaughter charges in this case, primarily because the guy backed up. Drawing was a legitimate response, but shooting at a guy who was then stepping back and had only shoved you seems an overreaction. Now, one shot was, like CIG pointed out, a lot better than police tend to do when they get scared (even at close range).

I don't know where this idea among anti-gunners comes from that people who own/carry "just want to shoot someone". I hope I am never in a situation where I need to kill someone, and the overwhelming majority of gun owners would share that sentiment.

Back to the original point though: Nothing about the incident as revealed there suggests armed white men are looking for "any excuse to shoot black people".
 
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I don't know where this idea among anti-gunners comes from that people who own/carry "just want to shoot someone".

Because they don't understand why someone would want to defend themselves in such a violent manner if the opportunity presented itself. We should use our words or our fists instead. Better yet, just call the police and wait 10 minutes for them to respond.

Because anti-gunners don't see any real difference between mass-shooters and law-abiding firearm owners. It's a severe lack of benefit of the doubt for their fellow man.

Well, they see a difference only if race is involved
 
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We all know if it had been a black guy who got pushed by a white guy and he shot him in retaliation, we'd have next to nothing to say. And for the record, I'd be on the black guy's side.

Anyway, you originally posted about this story as an example of "good ol' boys on the right jumping at the first chance to shoot black boys" and I fail to see how this story is what you characterized it as.

Why the heck is a guy with a CC harassing people who park in handicap spaces like he is some undercover officer? Plus he drew and fired surprisingly quick. It almost seems to me like this guy picks fights hoping to escalate a situation in order to use his gun. As for the racist agenda, idk. The lefties love to make every interracial altercation a racial issue, and considering this guy targets handicap space violators, im willing to give the guy the benefit of the doubt (unless for some reason only black people do this, and my personal experience tells me it isnt).

I don't know where this idea among anti-gunners comes from that people who own/carry "just want to shoot someone". I hope I am never in a situation where I need to kill someone, and the overwhelming majority of gun owners would share that sentiment.

Agreed, but this guy seemed like he was part of the minority then. Gets pushed down, guy backs away, so you draw and shoot as fast as a cowboy from a western?