The News Thread
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The Ozzman
Melted by feels
Dak
mentat
So what's the point of the law then if the only way someone gets caught is if they are doing something else that's already illegal?
Yeah, larger caliber handguns (eg, .45ACP) often come with 8 round magazines. I guess that's what they want people to buy?
Einherjar86
Active Member
To restrict the buying and selling, obviously. Although it won't work, people will just buy/sell them among one another.
I wouldn't know (inb4 "so you admit you don't know what you're talking about").
My main point of criticism is that we're talking about a Breitbart article, which is transparent jet fuel for national outrage and paranoia. The right-wing media quite often blows the scope of firearm regulations way out of proportion.
Since we're entertaining fantasies, I'll go ahead and cite personal experience. My hometown is a small little place outside Buffalo NY (NY, yes), and my family's business is in an even smaller village next to that town. People there complain about gun laws all the damn time, yet they all have them (guns, that is), and they have lots of them. No one's getting rid of them, and I don't want them to get rid of them. They have them, it's fine. There's no federal agency coming to break down their doors and take them. They're upset because it's something to be upset about and accuse the left of tyranny.
Dak
mentat
So why not ban the sale and transfer? Why make possession a felony?
Separately, why have unenforced or unenforceable laws on the books?
There's more to tyranny than active SWAT teams. There's a term from the neoreactionary theory that describes the political environment that spawns this type of legislation: anarcho-tyranny - Criminalization of the law-abiding and innocent through exorbitant taxation, bureaucratic regulation, the invasion of privacy, and the engineering of social institutions, with concomitant impotence regarding or support for truly criminal activity. It's a felony in NJ to own a standard piece of equipment (not aftermarket) legally purchasable nationally in most cases. Meanwhile:
https://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2018/09/nj_gangs_are_evolving_experts_say_theyre_recruitin.html
https://patch.com/new-jersey/newarknj/166-arrested-massive-new-jersey-gang-fugitive-bust
http://nj1015.com/gangs-of-new-jersey-investigator-says-theyre-in-all-21-counties/
Blurry_Dreams
Active Member
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Einherjar86
Active Member
I assume it's more difficult to pass something that goes after distributors.
Because it looks like something's getting done.
I don't really know what to say. There's so much embedded in this comment that would require essays to unpack.
What you're describing are just basic social functions that have been around for centuries. It's not anarchist or tyrannical; it's merely social forms and governance struggling to organize itself. And there's no disregard for criminal activity (or support lol), criminal activity simply will always exist.
Privacy isn't a stable principle; it's something that societies are always in debate over. When one version of privacy changes, the traditionalists clamor that it's unlawful.
EDIT: don't mistake me for thinking there's no such thing as invasion of privacy; I simply think it depends on how society defines and values the individual. I would not be pleased if I knew my home was under constant surveillance, but that's because I've been acculturated to value my privacy, and our social/personal existences depend on that. If we can't imagine that humans might develop new sets of values, then we've really given up on the idea of social evolution.
Blurry_Dreams
Active Member
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my problem with this new law
is really just the weird way that they defined "high-capacity"
you hear "high-capacity" and i think of those specific magazines where the number of bullets in it is way the fuck higher [or maybe even just a little higher] than the "standard-capacity" of the magazine that a particular model of gun holds
so, if the standard magazine holds more than 10 bullets, [almost every freaking gun on the market] you should be able to have that standard-sized magazine
when people try to ban "high-capacity" magazines, it usually sounds like someone trying to ban those "extended-clips" where your [insert gun model here] is loaded with way the fuck more more bullets than the [same model] gun that someone else is holding
banning those extended clip things makes sense, but banning "any clip holding more than X-number of bullets" is stupid
and completely ludicrous because the number "10" is too freaking low
if you raised the number 10 up to the number 20, the law might make sense
is really just the weird way that they defined "high-capacity"
you hear "high-capacity" and i think of those specific magazines where the number of bullets in it is way the fuck higher [or maybe even just a little higher] than the "standard-capacity" of the magazine that a particular model of gun holds
so, if the standard magazine holds more than 10 bullets, [almost every freaking gun on the market] you should be able to have that standard-sized magazine
when people try to ban "high-capacity" magazines, it usually sounds like someone trying to ban those "extended-clips" where your [insert gun model here] is loaded with way the fuck more more bullets than the [same model] gun that someone else is holding
banning those extended clip things makes sense, but banning "any clip holding more than X-number of bullets" is stupid
and completely ludicrous because the number "10" is too freaking low
if you raised the number 10 up to the number 20, the law might make sense
Dak
mentat
It's much easier to go after distributors - they are already completely documented. But it requires actual effort because they are already documented. Instead, a law is passed which is not followed up because it cannot be realistically followed up, backs are patted, and then the bureaucratic bulldozer slowly, randomly steamrolls helpless individuals. America, fuck yeah.
Not all of them are basic, and by support I didn't necessarily mean explicit support (although there is arguably some of that). I think people will continue to be fine with increasing surveillance as long as the state is willing to come down hard on actual crime. Instead we have statements like "criminal activity will always exist", a sholdershrug to the innercity warzones - providing implicit support. This shouldershrug, at the bureaucratic level, is the problem - supported by a mix between a shouldershrug in the constituency and (im)moral outrage whenever there's a crackdown on inevitably "marginalized" groups. Singapore is an example of what can happen when governance is guided by efficacy rather than feelz. Extreme levels of "Broken window" policing and intense surveillance. Of course, there's also a distinct lack of Arabs, Africans, and South/Central Americans, so that probably doesn't hurt either.
https://alvinology.com/2018/01/24/c...rime-rate-can-leave-belongings-public-places/
https://www.internations.org/singap...urity/safety-law-and-crime-in-singapore-16092
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/01/16/sin...so-low-that-many-shops-dont-even-lock-up.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Singapore
TechnicalBarbarity
Poser Disposer
The nerve of you to say this when 99% of your links are from the liberal propaganda machine.
Classy. You're turning into a Mort.
rms
Active Member
the complaint in buffalo regarding guns is how lengthy and bureaucratic the process is, which is coming off as an indirect way to restrict gun ownership -- by lulling them into forgetting.
TechnicalBarbarity
Poser Disposer
High capacity magazines have been banned(at least buying and selling) in California for almost 20 years now.
Einherjar86
Active Member
I was literally repeating Ozzman's phrase.
TechnicalBarbarity
Poser Disposer
Einherjar86
Active Member
Are 99% of my links really from liberal propaganda machines? I tend to avoid HuffPost, Salon, etc. I may have shared things from Vox now and then. I almost never post things from NYT or WaPo because they're behind paywalls, although I do read them.
The most recent thing I posted was from Aeon, which is a nonpartisan platform. Hell, one of its most recent pieces was in defense of Francis Fukuyama. Prior to that, I think I shared a link from Quanta in the weird science thread.
The most recent thing I posted was from Aeon, which is a nonpartisan platform. Hell, one of its most recent pieces was in defense of Francis Fukuyama. Prior to that, I think I shared a link from Quanta in the weird science thread.
TechnicalBarbarity
Poser Disposer
ok i might have been exaggerating by saying 99% but im fairly sure you've posted numerous articles from HuffPo, Salon, WashPo etc.
And while Breitbart does have some good contributors and articles and do indeed focus on stories that tend to get washed away and ignored by the mainstream media(which btw is indeed 99% leftist and is the largest part of that propaganda machine) .. they also have turned into a shitstorm lately by posting some truly cringworthy stuff(some that have nothing to do with politics). Andrew is probably rolling in his grave right now.
And while Breitbart does have some good contributors and articles and do indeed focus on stories that tend to get washed away and ignored by the mainstream media(which btw is indeed 99% leftist and is the largest part of that propaganda machine) .. they also have turned into a shitstorm lately by posting some truly cringworthy stuff(some that have nothing to do with politics). Andrew is probably rolling in his grave right now.
TechnicalBarbarity
Poser Disposer
regardless though, most of the articles/sources/links that you post here are indeed written be people who tend to lean left and share your opinions and viewpoints on said topics, even if they're not from those bullshit sites we mentioned.
Einherjar86
Active Member
Wouldn't you know it that I used to read right-wing material and agree with a lot of it? I know you think I've been corrupted or brainwashed by the liberal left, but in fact I see it as a legitimate change in perspective. I'm familiar with a lot of right-wing arguments, and have no desire to go back to them.
Also, I'm exposed to right-wing opinions every time I visit my hometown, or family in Virginia or the Carolinas. It's not as though I'm cut off from it. I'm dealing with it all the time.
Also, I'm exposed to right-wing opinions every time I visit my hometown, or family in Virginia or the Carolinas. It's not as though I'm cut off from it. I'm dealing with it all the time.
Satanstoenail
My Larpstyle determines my Derpstyle
https://www.churchmilitant.com/news/article/cardinal-pell-found-guilty-on-all-counts-of-sex-abuse
News outlets in Australia have been suppressed from reporting the news that our Cardinal George Pell has been found guilty on all counts of sexual abuse of children in the 90’s. Major papers are posting front-page stories about how something significant has happened to someone very high profile but they’re not allowed to talk about it.
News outlets in Australia have been suppressed from reporting the news that our Cardinal George Pell has been found guilty on all counts of sexual abuse of children in the 90’s. Major papers are posting front-page stories about how something significant has happened to someone very high profile but they’re not allowed to talk about it.
Satanstoenail
My Larpstyle determines my Derpstyle
Also interested to know what people here think about Cohen getting 3 years for lying to Congress and paying women off to influence the election..
https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-13/donald-trump-ex-lawyer-michael-cohen-gets-three-years-in-prison/10613480
https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-13/donald-trump-ex-lawyer-michael-cohen-gets-three-years-in-prison/10613480
