Using a DAW as a FOH console

[arv_foh]

Hey guys... so tomorrow should be interesting. I'm mixing a band at a local TV station. We have to bring all our own gear, monitors, mics, everything. They basically told us they will just take a L/R feed from whatever we bring. So, I'm bringing in my recording rig and basically using Logic as a FOH mixing console. I'm just going to arm the tracks, and not record anything, and set up 4 separate busses to use as monitor sends.

My question is, will I be able to use my plugins without latency? I want to use some sort of EQ on each channel, and a de-esser and autotune evo for the vocals. The band also has a studio armed with Waves, so I think I will be using G channel EQ for the individual channels and the GSSL compressor on the master bus. I know Logic has a low latency mode but I didn't know if my plugin choice would affect that. This performance is going to be LIVE on the air Monday morning during a local morning show, so any latency will be unacceptable since the audio will not sync up with the video. I am thinking the inputs will end up being around 14 channels.

 

[alan1990]

ive used cubase for FOH with a firepod before but only ever used eq gates compression ( the stock ones to keep it as light as possible) and one instance of drumagog I never really had time to test it out alot so I tried to keep in to a minimum to prevent crashes but in the end it worked out great even with me recording the show at the same time as mixing it.

 

[fade_2_black]

I have done this on a very small scale with PT, but the risks are phenomenal.. With a decent rig you should be alright with most plug-ins - try not to go too over the top though..
Just hope it doesn't crash on you man..

 

[LeSedna]

Not sure but i think autotune can induce a big latency.

Not to do my reaper fan, but for FOH, Reaper seems a good idea : it's light, stable, the stock plugins are really really light, and the routing possibilities are infinite. I guess you don't have time to check it before the event but if there are other occasions you should definitely try reaper at least for this specific use.

 

[HeadCrusher]

What interface are you using? I really hope you have something that can route inputs right back to the outputs without have to go through the DAW!
As far as plugins go I would really stay with the stock ones if at all possible. Pretty sure that SSL EQ would be kinda slow.

 

[John_C]

Pendulum are doing this on tour now. 8 massive computers all linked up giving them roughly the same mix as on album.

 

[arv_foh]

I am using a pretty decent computer... Macbook Pro Aluminum 2.4gHz Core 2 Duo w/ 2GB ram. My interface is a MOTU 828mkii and I'm lightpiping in a Digimax FS. The guys in the band are also bringing an M-Audio Octane for me to use for additional pre's.

We are only playing one song on the air so I'm not too horribly worried about it crashing. We have a 3 hour soundcheck tonight so I will be able to dial everything in and stress test to make sure nothing is going to happen.

So you guys think the SSL EQ is a bad idea? That I should just use a lightweight, stock EQ?

 

[DanLights]

Pendulum are doing this on tour now. 8 massive computers all linked up giving them roughly the same mix as on album.

that sounds longer to set up than an Iron Maiden concert

 

[Jind]

Pendulum are doing this on tour now. 8 massive computers all linked up giving them roughly the same mix as on album.

Is there somewhere to read about this? I'd be interested in seeing how they are doing as far as backup systems and such - using a system like that would have to have some serious redundancy to make sure it keeps going if problems occur.

 

[John_C]

I read it in an interview in the Big Issue

no idea whether they've explained it better elsewhere

 

[joeymusicguy]

I've ran bands live in the studio with cubase

Tons of plugins and even drum replacement live

Best low latency you can get is ~2ms on Anything that exists today. Tdm is the only thing slightly faster.

2 ms isn't noticeable with video vs audio

The vst version of auto tune runs in real time (at5, not evo)

 

[HeadCrusher]

So you guys think the SSL EQ is a bad idea? That I should just use a lightweight, stock EQ?

I would say so, yes. I would focus on making it work rather than getting out those last 5% in audio quality.

that sounds longer to set up than an Iron Maiden concert

Actually I don't think so. The DAW session is all set up anyway so all that needs to be done is set up the triggers on the drumkit plug into those DI boxes and you're ready to go.

I'd be interested in seeing how they are doing as far as backup systems and such - using a system like that would have to have some serious redundancy to make sure it keeps going if problems occur.

I read somewhere that Madonna has a backup-system that activates itself in a matter of Milliseconds in case something went wrong on the main rig.

 

[DanLights]

I apologize, I was reffering to skeksis´s post about Pendulum, I will never feel lazy to use the quote button again

 

[ttrentt]

Look into SAWstudio. Bob did a port of his DAW just for this reason, as a FOH version. SAWstudio is stupid fast and can run 32 channels packed with everything in the world on it and not even sneeze.

 

[arv_foh]

I've ran bands live in the studio with cubase

Tons of plugins and even drum replacement live

Best low latency you can get is ~2ms on Anything that exists today. Tdm is the only thing slightly faster.

2 ms isn't noticeable with video vs audio

The vst version of auto tune runs in real time (at5, not evo)

Thanks for the heads up on AT5, I just tested EVO and there was definitely noticeable latency, but there was none with 5

A new DAW (the SAWstudio suggestion) isn't really an option right now because I have to be at the TV station in 5 hours

 

[arv_foh]

Ok I have a new problem, Logic won't let me record enable 2 tracks from the same input simultaneously. I need the Autotuned vocals to go to the main output and the raw vocal track to go to a separate output for monitoring. What would be the easiest way to accomplish this?

 

[HeadCrusher]

I apologize, I was reffering to skeksis´s post about Pendulum, I will never feel lazy to use the quote button again

Sarcasm or what?
Sorry if something came across the way it wasn't intended. I know you refered to the Pendulum post but so did I.

 

[arv_foh]

So I spent 4 hours setting up everything and dialing in the mix, and 10 seconds into the performance the TV station changed the mix from stereo to mono. I was pissed.

 

[ahjteam]

Ok I have a new problem, Logic won't let me record enable 2 tracks from the same input simultaneously. I need the Autotuned vocals to go to the main output and the raw vocal track to go to a separate output for monitoring. What would be the easiest way to accomplish this?

I use this kind of thing with my vocal preamp so I can split the dry signal for monitor feed.

http://www.thomann.de/gb/cae_90074_yaudiosplittkabel.htm

 

[arv_foh]

I use this kind of thing with my vocal preamp so I can split the dry signal for monitor feed.

http://www.thomann.de/gb/cae_90074_yaudiosplittkabel.htm

That's pretty much exactly what I bought. It worked perfect, I was just wondering if there was a way to do it without one but apparently there is not.