Vocal Tracking Help (SM7b,Brick,RNC)

Zombietakeover

Zombietakeover

Member
Jul 15, 2006
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Kenton, OH
www.myspace.com
SM7b>Groove tubes the brick>RNC>Delta 44
I have been experimenting for about a year now with this vocal chain
Listen to results thus far here:
http://www.myspace.com/zombietakeovermedia

sorry for the myspace player but the hosting is down ....

Anyways i feel like i should be getting better reults
i feel like im not using the RNC correctly....
Anyone use the RNC before the track is printed? on the way in?

my last project i used a setting of
thers -11.5
ratio 4:1
atk 0.5
rlse 0.1
gain +6

and i noticed i have to really crank the brick to get enough gain for the SM7b. which i have read that they need alot of gain.

also i was wondering if anyone uses the rnc like a limiter....I record mostly screamers so all im really worried about is those crazy loud clippy screams....
any info you guys have would be sweet thanks...
 
If memory serves I think I read somewhere that you can try and remove the foam from the SM7b and see if that
gives better results.
I dont own the mic myself so Im not sure. This is all just second hand info.
 
If you think it doesn't make the cut, then the mic just not might work for your/vocalists voice, try something else. Try something more hifi and also something a lot more lofi or try something isn't even remotely meant for vocals, like a tom, sax or kick mic. Also try different things, don't always work the same way. I've used a distortion pedal, like big muff or tubescream, to give a little more grit to cookie monster vocals. Also the Digidesign LO-FI plugin (from D-FI pack, only for protools) used with 1-5% distortion gives a nice grit.
 
I don't have my RNC yet (it's on it's way) but my experience with compressors is to set a longer release time, and with screamers, squash them more, try a ratio of perhaps 6:1 to 8:1 and lower your attack time to something like 20 ms, so you don't amplify the breathing, then bring up the gain accordingly. When I listen to modern screamers, I notice an absurd amount of compression, to the point where the compressor is literally being used to create a little bit of it's own distortion, sounds cool, but unnatural. I know that in ProTools, there is a compressor that will emulate that sound nicely, called "Smack!" but I have not yet heard any other compressor pull that off as nicely. Not sure of the RNC is capable if recreating that, but I know there is a "megasquash" technique on FMR's website, you could try that. If you think it has anything else to do with the RNC, take it out of the chain, or just use it to tame the peaks, then you will know if it's your compressor/techniques.
 
the more i research i keep reading that "Its 24bit , just dont clip the light and you should be good" so i think i might just leave the RNC off for a few projects, i just need to maybe face the fact that just because i bought it might not need to use it everytime.

and yeah i have seen the SM7b recorded with the foam cone off

What do some of your guys Wave Forms(the wav event thingie's) look like on your Screaming vocals?
You want them Fat and tight right? You dont want alot of those stray spikes correct? how the hell do i do this , i can only do so much.......To a point its up to the performer to have some sort of control correct?
And also i have learned to tell the vocalist to break up the song with there different voices so i can get a good volume check before.
Also im recording digital so i should be shooting for -0.6db on the way in right?.....for safety
 
Zombietakeover said:
What do some of your guys Wave Forms(the wav event thingie's) look like on your Screaming vocals? You dont want alot of those stray spikes correct?
Click to expand...

Like John Holmes' wang. Long, fat and thick, because I really haven't found any use for dynamics on screaming vocals. I use two compressors when tracking. One with high threshold (eg. -6db) and 4-8:1 ratio, fast attack and release and one with low threshold (say -30db) and small ratio like 1.5-2:1, medium attack and release. First one kills the unnessecary spikes, other one smoothes it out. dbx 166XL does a good job for the fast one, use some opto compressor for the slower one, I used Joemeek SC2.2. I used Röde NT1 with popfilter (highpassed at 70hz) as a mic and then the Yamaha ML8 as preamp. Minor clipping from the compressors don't really matter if it sounds good, we don't want the shouts to sound too polished, don't we? ;) The result should be something like -6..-3dbFS if done correctly.

In the DAW I use 3 x De-esser + Waves rVox to thicken it up does the job for me. No EQ needed unless it doesn't fit in the mix.
 
Zombietakeover said:
the more i research i keep reading that "Its 24bit , just dont clip the light and you should be good" so i think i might just leave the RNC off for a few projects, i just need to maybe face the fact that just because i bought it might not need to use it everytime.

and yeah i have seen the SM7b recorded with the foam cone off

What do some of your guys Wave Forms(the wav event thingie's) look like on your Screaming vocals?
You want them Fat and tight right? You dont want alot of those stray spikes correct? how the hell do i do this , i can only do so much.......To a point its up to the performer to have some sort of control correct?
And also i have learned to tell the vocalist to break up the song with there different voices so i can get a good volume check before.
Also im recording digital so i should be shooting for -0.6db on the way in right?.....for safety
Click to expand...

As long as they're not clipping, you're all good. what they 'look like' is kind of irrelevant.

If you're just doing mic > pre and added compression and EQ later through a plug or whatever, your waveform will look pretty dynamic, but, it should, because that's what vocals are. It's up to you to tame those dynamics. If you don't feel comfy using the RNC for tracking, dont!

On the way in, for ANYTHING, i shoot for around -12 average. -0.6 is cutting it way too close for me. keep your levels all hovering around -12db and you'll be straight.
 
man it most of been late when i wrote that message becuase i meant to say i record at -6.0 going in not -0.6

Damn CJ isn't -12 a little low.... you would have to really crank the faders to get so volume.....your stuff is great.....so i guess i will give that a try
you even record bass and GTR at -12 going in?
 
I aim for minus 12 also.
IME the rnc is best used as a transparent compressor best suited to the two buss.
The SM7 is great on screams, try using a comp with more color. Blockfish is good and free

And reef that brick and get it distorting
 
everybody's x said:
And reef that brick and get it distorting
Click to expand...

hey X whats up? did you mean beef the GT Brick up by cranking the gain......or atleast till im getting -12 going in?

ANd james yeh now that i think about it . It makes no since. I got some tips off a friend of mine and he said the low release would give it some grit... Thanks for eveyones help really appreciate it
 
yeah i got +55db of gain with the brick but whats sucks is there no lights so i got to watch about clipping

And then what would i use to trim the output ? im using Nuendo so use the Trim knobs there?

but no matter what keep it at around -12 going into Nuendo correct?

So if i was recording these vocal's at -6.0 . Then that would cause my vocals to sound very harsh sounding correct?
 
this is what CJ said in an above post

"On the way in, for ANYTHING, i shoot for around -12 average. -0.6 is cutting it way too close for me. keep your levels all hovering around -12db and you'll be straight."

It sounds like he goes -12 in to me


We really need to make a thread of this......It seems like everyone is split down the line of recording either -6 or -12 going in.....

i record at -6 going in .....so on my next round of songs im gonna try the -12

where are you at going in?
 
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