weird snare phase....wtf?!?

[bryan_kilco]

Got some phase issues with my 2 snare mics. The bottom mic was receiving the audio after the top mic. I flipped phase, noticed it, and decided to manually move the snare tracks to align correctly. Then, for shits and giggles, I moved the bottom mic closer to the snare.....this would no doubtedly get my 2 waves closer together, right? .....well..... for some strange reason, the bottom mic is receiving the sound even LATER than when the mic was farther away. This just doesnt make sense to me at all and seems bass ackwards.

When flipping the phase on a track, is it basically the same as manually aligning the tracks? Or should I try to be correcting this right from the getgo by getting the mics positioned just right?

 

[pikachu69]

I can't explain why it would move further away when you moved the mic closer but as far as I am aware there is a big difference in just flipping phase verses aligning tracks. flipping phase is about the wave forms traveling in the same direction as each other as much as possible but when you time align you also bring the transients closer together which has an effect on the sound, attack and timbre of the instrument, sometimes good sometimes bad. For metal getting the transients aligned helps cut through the mud but in other styles of music the 'messy' transients adds to the sound of that style.
Cheers.

 

[AudioGeekZine]

When flipping the phase on a track, is it basically the same as manually aligning the tracks? Or should I try to be correcting this right from the getgo by getting the mics positioned just right?

No it's merely inverting the polarity of the voltage. I would never fuck with the timing of individual drum tracks. It's not the same as moving a mic.

A plug like Betabugs Phasebug that can rotate the phase by any degree may be helpful in this case.

Usually the bottom mic will be opposite polarity of the top mic, but that doesn't mean that you always have to invert the bottom, sometimes it's top.

Start with the overheads and check polarity of each mic related to those.

I explain it better in this podcast:
http://www.homerecordingshow.com/20...drums-in-phase-and-making-a-dramatic-trailer/

 

[greyskull]

yeah. check the polarity against the overheads.
Sometimes the top needs be inverted, sometimes the bottom.

 

[bryan_kilco]

checked with the overheads as well and everything seems ok.

I just cant grasp how the wav is hitting the bottom mic later as I definitely moved the mic closer. Did I defy physics?!

 

[Dimaura]

No it's merely inverting the polarity of the voltage. I would never fuck with the timing of individual drum tracks. It's not the same as moving a mic.

Does that mean you disagree with Post #77 from this thread? "Acoustic Drums for Metal: A Guide "

 

[AudioGeekZine]

I guess I do, however Glenn did say he doesn't do it for every song and sometimes it's better to have the distance between. It's not something I've messed with personally and it's not something I would associate with a Natural drum sound, it's not something I've ever felt I had to do. The snare should be reaching the overheads a few ms later than the mic only an inch away.