What do you think about people who dont want to learn any covers?

[[KOTNO]Narrot]

i never covered stuff, so i can understand that your bassist and drummer are not motivated. i see no point in replaying other ppls stuff. i like to look at tabs and get ideas by them which i use but covering is too much reproducing for my taste.

 

[SevenString]

okay, i'm probably inviting some flames here, but here goes:

learning covers, especially if they're challenging, can only be a good thing, since this will accelerate your growth as a musician and a writer.

if you're a garage player who's never played anybody else's material, do you think that, out of the blue, you're going to just magically write and play as good or better than your favorite band, who's been recording and touring for years? that's nonsense.

being influenced by a band or individual musician doesn't mean that you dress like them, or that you rock out to their music on the stereo.

it means that you have to ACTIVELY participate in the process so that you can pick up on their writing style, or soloing style, or whatever their doing musically that speaks to you. But this is just a fancy way of saying that you're learning someone else's songs.

any player worth a damn HAS to have, at one point or another, learned and played material written by someone else, and maybe even performed it live for fun or profit.

 

[FrostGiant]

I learned guitar by playing other peoples shit. Would I be in a cover band, no. Would I be willing to play some covers in practice, sure. It's a good way to get a feel for the other members of the band. But if you are trying to get em to play covers, try to make em easy shit that everyone can learn very quickly. Don't try to do some complicate song that'll take everyone a while to learn, cuz if you're going original it's kind of a waste of time. But doing an easy cover or two, even if it's Godsmack or something (I don't know any godsmack but I'm sure I could learn a song or two in a day) it would be a good thing to warm up with.

 

[dmisalive]

okay, i'm probably inviting some flames here, but here goes:

learning covers, especially if they're challenging, can only be a good thing, since this will accelerate your growth as a musician and a writer.

if you're a garage player who's never played anybody else's material, do you think that, out of the blue, you're going to just magically write and play as good or better than your favorite band, who's been recording and touring for years? that's nonsense.

being influenced by a band or individual musician doesn't mean that you dress like them, or that you rock out to their music on the stereo.

it means that you have to ACTIVELY participate in the process so that you can pick up on their writing style, or soloing style, or whatever their doing musically that speaks to you. But this is just a fancy way of saying that you're learning someone else's songs.

any player worth a damn HAS to have, at one point or another, learned and played material written by someone else, and maybe even performed it live for fun or profit.

That's exactly what i mean by learning covers.
Good job with the explanation dude

 

[dmisalive]

Also that drummer guy, think evrything will be his way. He think the whole music will be based on drums. That's bullshit.

 

[EmperorMalignus]

SevenString said it, you have to cover a few songs before writting your own stuff. You gotta "learn" how to play with the others members too, after a while you're gonna be very tight in rythm with them, because you played alot of songs. and cover songs already sounds good, so it's cool to jam to. Cover bands are another story,I think it's pointless, maybe playing a cover (only one) at the end of a gig is cool, sometimes not really. When I jam with one of my friend (who play guitar too) we usualy play some children of bodom, or just some cool random riff and the other solo over it... it's really cool, and you become better.

for the drummer thing, get rid of him, seriously. and make him listen to Quo Vadis or Cryptopsy, he won't say anymore that blast beat doenst show a drummer's ability, hell, its kinda like alternate picking! or even "thrash picking" (gallops)

 

[SoulSlaughter]

covering songs can really give each member of a band good insight to to their peers style. like anything else, covering other peoples work can be a big waste of time, though.

 

[enchanted_nightmare]

i suppose 1 cover song would be ok.
but i think gereally people who want to do cover songs should be in cover bands.

 

[TekChef]

Jamming covers in practice is a good way to get going as a band. It not only lets you get synched up, it also is a good warm up before tackling some insane riff that you have in your head. Then as time progresses, you will only be doing a cover here or there for fun as you have lots of your own material.

As far as playing live, I would not do any covers really. I would want to bring my own material out and kick ass with it!

 

[demondeath]

mudvayne sux!!

 

[ADS]

I have been playing guitar for about 20 years now... and the last song of someone else's that I ever learned how to play was Metallica's "For Whom the Bell Tolls"... when it was a brand new song of theirs

I don't think that being a good musician requires learning other people's stuff. Some may disagree, but I really don't. I hope I don't make myself sound all bigheaded here, but I think I'm proof of that, and a pretty damn good guitar player. And honestly, I could argue that some of my uniqueness comes from the fact that I've never tried to learn what anyone else was doing, thereby never contaminating my creativity subliminally with someone else's ideas (that's just my opinion, mind you... could be irrelevant). But seriously... ever heard Chopin or Beethoven do covers? I think it really depends on the individual. Everyone's different. For me... I feel I have been *influenced* by a lot of people throughout my years of playing, but have just never sat down to try and figure one of their songs out, or figure out what they were doing and how they did it. I base the foundation of my skill and knowledge on a book of scales I had when I was younger. I learned all the scales in that book, and the rest, as they say, is history.

HOWEVER... I am not in a band (being that it's difficult to call one's solo efforts a "band"). If I was in a band, especially one just starting out (assuming that previously created material was not brought into the band by one of its members), then I think it could be important to learn a few covers... most importantly being ones in the same genre as the band itself, but others also... a couple songs of varying styles to help the band members develop the skill set required to function harmoniously as a single unit. Could be fun as well, maybe?

But yeah, ditch that drummer... he sounds like trouble

That's just my $0.0025.

~Robert

 

[SevenString]

I have been playing guitar for about 20 years now... and the last song of someone else's that I ever learned how to play was Metallica's "For Whom the Bell Tolls"... when it was a brand new song of theirs

ah, but even if it was 20 years ago, you DID at one point learn someone else's songs.

so no matter how much you've avoided being unduly influenced by anyone, you STILL learned someone else's material in your formative period. Heck, I can REALLY hear the metallica influence in your material.

but in listening to your stuff, i have to say that's a GOOD thing. nice stuff!

 

[Release]

I think it can be good and bad for a band to do this. When I was playing in bands, we'd have a few covers we'd jam on to get everyone on the same page. But on the other hand, the other guitar player would always jam to CD's and in turn, the material he brought to the table sounded like what he was listening to and we had to throw out 90% of his riffs.

When I play now, 99% of the time it's all original material.

 

[SevenString]

Yeah, that's just inexperienced songwriting. When I first started writing songs (a LOOONG time ago), my stuff sounded like whatever I was into at the time, which included scorpions, queensryche, sammy hagar, and priest.

It's something you eventually grow out of, but most people's early material (including mine) reeks.

Another thing I've noticed is that after having developed my playing all of this time, if I have to learn a new song for a cover gig or something, I find that it has NO effect on my overall style, whereas back in the day, pretty much EVERY song i learned would have an effect.

I guess the moral of THAT story is to choose your influences wisely in your formative years because THAT'S who will come out in your playing for years to come.

 

[ADS]

ah, but even if it was 20 years ago, you DID at one point learn someone else's songs.

so no matter how much you've avoided being unduly influenced by anyone, you STILL learned someone else's material in your formative period. Heck, I can REALLY hear the metallica influence in your material.

but in listening to your stuff, i have to say that's a GOOD thing. nice stuff!

Well, I certainly can't argue your point But really though... Metallica influence in my stuff? Ya think? I guess it could be... if you think about someone who was influenced by them many years ago, and what that person might sound like now. Thank you for the compliment, BTW... your work is excellent as well!

Well, one thing that playing someone else's material DID teach me... all those many years ago... "For Whom the Bell Tolls" taught me what a power chord was I really can't believe it went beyond that, though. The rest was just influence in the strictest sense, and not a result of learning any of their material.

~Robert

 

[SevenString]

"Seismonic" at 7:03

but that's okay. i'm guilty of it too. check out this thread:

http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2750915#post2750915

 

[lord667]

And honestly, I could argue that some of my uniqueness comes from the fact that I've never tried to learn what anyone else was doing, thereby never contaminating my creativity subliminally with someone else's ideas (that's just my opinion, mind you... could be irrelevant). But seriously... ever heard Chopin or Beethoven do covers? I think it really depends on the individual. Everyone's different. For me... I feel I have been *influenced* by a lot of people throughout my years of playing, but have just never sat down to try and figure one of their songs out, or figure out what they were doing and how they did it. I base the foundation of my skill and knowledge on a book of scales I had when I was younger. I learned all the scales in that book, and the rest, as they say, is history.

HOWEVER... I am not in a band (being that it's difficult to call one's solo efforts a "band"). If I was in a band, especially one just starting out (assuming that previously created material was not brought into the band by one of its members), then I think it could be important to learn a few covers... most importantly being ones in the same genre as the band itself, but others also... a couple songs of varying styles to help the band members develop the skill set required to function harmoniously as a single unit. Could be fun as well, maybe?

~Robert

Chopin and Beethoven were composers, not musicians. In those days, musicians didn't write their own stuff, especially when you're talking "classical" music. Composers usually had to play an instrument so they could write, but an orchestra isn't like a rock band, with everyone coming up with their own "stuff". The majority of classical musicians play and sing nothing but "covers" - so much so that we list classical music by who wrote it, rather than who played it.

As for uniqueness, I'm not sure that learning covers or not would actually affect that. More likely that the more unique you want to be, the less desire you have to learn covers in the first place.

 

[ADS]

Chopin and Beethoven were composers, not musicians. In those days, musicians didn't write their own stuff, especially when you're talking "classical" music.

Well... they were musicians and composers... Beethoven too, but especially Chopin - a huge amount of his work is not orchestra, but just a single piano, or only a handful of instruments. But... I see your point totally. My opinion was coming from my own clouded judgement. I've never really thought about it, but I guess nowadays I'm equally a composer and musician, and honestly, probably shouldn't even be commenting in a thread where the poster is asking band related issues

As for uniqueness, I'm not sure that learning covers or not would actually affect that. More likely that the more unique you want to be, the less desire you have to learn covers in the first place.

You're probably right. For me, I think maybe I was VERY suggestable when I was younger, like Leslie had mentioned. I would "become" whatever I happened to be listening to at the time, and that's what my style was based on. If I would have actually been learning their songs note for note, it would have probably been about 10x worse for me. So I guess that's where my feeling that learning covers would stifle my creativity comes from. Just my own twisted views on the world around me

~Robert, who still vehemently denies any Metallica influence

 

[madcheese9377]

okay, i'm probably inviting some flames here, but here goes:

learning covers, especially if they're challenging, can only be a good thing, since this will accelerate your growth as a musician and a writer.

if you're a garage player who's never played anybody else's material, do you think that, out of the blue, you're going to just magically write and play as good or better than your favorite band, who's been recording and touring for years? that's nonsense.

being influenced by a band or individual musician doesn't mean that you dress like them, or that you rock out to their music on the stereo.

it means that you have to ACTIVELY participate in the process so that you can pick up on their writing style, or soloing style, or whatever their doing musically that speaks to you. But this is just a fancy way of saying that you're learning someone else's songs.

any player worth a damn HAS to have, at one point or another, learned and played material written by someone else, and maybe even performed it live for fun or profit.

What he said! Pretty much of all you guys are right about playing covers. I can cover Hate Tank by M.O.D And ever since have been able to write better riffs when I want something new. There's nothing wrong with doin' some covers, man. I've got a laundry list of songs I'd love to cover, But only for fun and once in a while we'll play'em live when we play live one day in the near future. Fuck your drummer, man, he's an asshole, and you need to have a good talkin to your bassist. later, -RJAIII-

 

[J the TyranT]

Hey man, some of the posts on this thread have been made by total fucking tools and posers who dont even belong on this forum.

I've been drumming for years, and done plenty of sessions and gigs, and I guarantee you, the BEST way to really get jamming with an entirely new group of people is to do a cover or two. That doesn't mean you cant stop writing. That doesn't mean you're a cover band. It just means you've got something to synch up to, and groove on, with parts everybody should quickly learn by heart, to get on the same page. It's like a date, if there's no chemistry, you won't be marrying the bitch.

As far as the drummer's opinions... well, blastbeats really aren't much of a musical measuring stick... they ARE pretty fuckin' easy, but, refusing to do them is a bit... odd. AND, I'm no Mudvayne fan, but they DONT suck, and their drummer IS pretty good. He's not revolutionizing the industry, but deserves many more kudos than half the shithead media boys that gain all the fame and fortune as if they really WERE badass...