What does Blackguard do when not touring? (aka the thread that won't die)

[AeonicSlumber]

You know, you're probably right - they stink. They used to tour all the time when I was living back in Denmark, and there's just something about that which bothers me ... you know that feeling that a band is just "too much around"? That's not "troo" enough, so I probably should stick with them being a sucky band.

c.

They don't tour much in the US! They were actually banned from playing here because I think years ago they illegally tried to get into the country and it wasn't until recently that they were finally able to get visas. So that's what makes them tr00 in the eyes of elitists. But you being from Denmark, having seen them alot -- you are within your rights to to excerize your metal elitism and hate them because you've seen them live a million times!

 

[Claus / Intromental]

X 10000000000000000000000

Damn, that was the best thing you have said this thread.

Thanks, I needed a good chuckle.

You're welcome. I'll be here all week

 

[Claus / Intromental]

They don't tour much in the US! They were actually banned from playing here because I think years ago they illegally tried to get into the country and it wasn't until recently that they were finally able to get visas. So that's what makes them tr00 in the eyes of elitists. But you being from Denmark, having seen them alot -- you are within your rights to to excerize your metal elitism and hate them because you've seen them live a million times!

I'm so elitist that in my very secret club I only allow myself to be ... and only on Fridays!

 

[AeonicSlumber]

I'm so elitist that in my very secret club I only allow myself to be ... and only on Fridays!

I believe that's called having a man cave.

 

[Jasonic]

Alot of metal fans just don't care about metal bands making money. It's a taboo. The reality of bands needing to earn a living to satisfy their scene is a reality that is ignored by them so they can perpetuate the sentimentalism that comes with being "tr00". Not pointing fingers or say all truesters are like that, but it's definitely a common trait exhibited by the most seasoned elitist dungeon master.

Well, this definitely goes back then to many of the bands mentioned in this thread has having different goals. A band like Blackguard has a different mission statement and goal setting document than Agalloch. Their measurement of these goal's achievements would be different as well.

Each would have a much different viewpoint of success than the other.
I would rather be in Agalloch's shoes, where success would be best measured by increased sales release to release through releasing quality metal that gets a LOT of buzz. Being on a smaller label results in smaller operating costs, and less concern about making specific sales figures. Of course, sales figures matter to all bands, but a modest sales figure would still satisfy all parties.

Next take Blackguard. As Claus himself had mentioned, they have to tour their asses of to make enough $$$ to pay back the label (Nuc Blast I believe right) for all their up front expenses for recording, promotion, touring, etc. They hope to accomplish that through playing as many shows as possible, moreso, than as opposed to having a quality album that is well received.

So, I suppose it's all in what you hope to accomplish as a band.
As a "true metalhead" I am most concerned that a band I like be in a position to comfortably create kick ass music!

That's not to say that Blackguard can't get there, but I have RARELY heard anyone say, HOT DAMN, what an amazing disc. Its more that they put on an enjoyable show. Hopefully they will translate that to a solid sophomore effort.

 

[Claus / Intromental]

Each would have a much different viewpoint of success than the other.

I would rather be in Agalloch's shoes, where success would be best measured by increased sales release to release through releasing quality metal that gets a LOT of buzz.

Next take Blackguard. They hope to accomplish that through playing as many shows as possible, moreso, than as opposed to having a quality album that is well received.

You're probably getting used to hearing this by now, but you're wrong again ...

I honestly do not believe there's any band that isn't trying to deliver a QUALITY album each time they release something. Why on earth would anyone strive for releasing something of lesser quality? That just doesn't make sense.

Who are you to tell Blackguard that their music isn't quality compared to a band like Agalloch?

I don't like either, but that doesn't mean that I go around saying "Agalloch isn't quality" or "Agalloch doesn't strive to put out a quality release".

 

[Jasonic]

Claus - No, no, no.
That is NOT at all what I am saying.

My point was that Blackguard is making a name for themself more from touring than through buzz about their album.
Agalloch, for example, has buzz based primarily about their recorded output.

As I said, different methods to obtain a goal.

That isn't to say that BG doesn't try to put out quality material.
Their known now more for their live shows than their recorded output.

Many reviews of their albums have showcased that.
This isn't just my viewpoint, as I honestly never heard their album.
Whenever BG has been mentioned, its in regard to their live shows.

 

[Claus / Intromental]

Claus - No, no, no.
That is NOT at all what I am saying.

Actually, I quoted your comments above and it was exactly what you were saying

 

[Diabolik]

I wouldn't call them "true metallers". To be a such requires at least a minimum of knowledge about the scene ...

that is right....you are such a master mind. How are you spending all of your money on your business endevors?

 

[Jasonic]

Next take Blackguard. As Claus himself had mentioned, they have to tour their asses of to make enough $$$ to pay back the label (Nuc Blast I believe right) for all their up front expenses for recording, promotion, touring, etc. They hope to accomplish that through playing as many shows as possible, moreso, than as opposed to having a quality album that is well received.

This is what I had said.
Not sure what I said that you could possibly disagree with.
You had said previously that Blackguard has to tour to get their name out there. They are certainly not selling CDs based on buzz about the album itself, as opposed to bands like Agalloch who does not tour.

Finally, what Blackguard should do then is take in all of what they learn on tour, and deliver a killer follow up album.

Sorry, but I stand firm. At THIS point in their career, the debut CD of these guys alone isn't going to cut it for their longevity.

 

[Claus / Intromental]

that is right....you are such a master mind.

I prefer "master of the mind", thank you.

 

[Claus / Intromental]

They are certainly not selling CDs based on buzz about the album itself, as opposed to bands like Agalloch who does not tour.

How much do you actually think Agalloch sells? It seems to me like you think they are selling a LOT ...

 

[Diabolik]

This is what I had said.
Not sure what I said that you could possibly disagree with.
You had said previously that Blackguard has to tour to get their name out there. They are certainly not selling CDs based on buzz about the album itself, as opposed to bands like Agalloch who does not tour.

Finally, what Blackguard should do then is take in all of what they learn on tour, and deliver a killer follow up album.

Sorry, but I stand firm. At THIS point in their career, the debut CD of these guys alone isn't going to cut it for their longevity.

I agree.....I will be surprised if in 3 years Blackguard are even still around nor even being discussed. When was the last time anyone posted about Into Eternity?

I think any band would rather be known for recorded output than touring.

 

[Diabolik]

How much do you actually think Agalloch sells? It seems to me like you think they are selling a LOT ...

We know they are not selling alot but they are not selling to the average fan who listens to the disc once and files it away. They are selling it to fans of music with substance and not quick commercial success that comes across dated.

 

[Claus / Intromental]

We know they are not selling alot but they are not selling to the average fan who listens to the disc once and files it away. They are selling it to fans of music with substance and not quick commercial success that comes across dated.

So, just like Jason was claiming above; Agalloch is all about quality music with substance, whereas other bands are not.

That's a cool way to win an argument: "my opinion matters more than yours, because I'm an avid fan".

 

[Jasonic]

How much do you actually think Agalloch sells? It seems to me like you think they are selling a LOT ...

Ok,
Once again, you are chappin' my arse here Claus.

Is long term success REALLY and TRULY dictated solely by the EXACT number of CD sales and dollars earned? Your statement above would indicate that it does.

No, I have even stated NUMEROUS times that Agalloch only sells a MODEST amount of CDs. Still though, there has been consistent demand for a band like Agalloch for many years due to album reviews and buzz. It is music for a niche market, which seems to be on the rise year after year.

There are plenty of bands who had strong first or second album sales, based on various factors (IE - tour a lot, flavor of the month, etc), who never really followed through or just died off. (IE - maybe touring too much has resulted in lackluster follow up albums, Children of Bodom quickly come to mind).

 

[Jasonic]

So, just like Jason was claiming above; Agalloch is all about quality music with substance, whereas other bands are not.

Oi Vey!
Seriously Claus??????

No one ever said other bands are NOT about quality music.
It's about their approach for reaching out to more and more listeners.

Every band strives to make quality music.

I just think that bands who do not tour as rigorously as some spend more time making better music. How many bands failed to deliver with a solid follow up album after touring relentlessly?

 

[Claus / Intromental]

Ok, Once again, you are chappin' my arse here Claus.

I'm not familiar with that term, but it doesn't sound pleasant. Good luck with that - you might want to see a doctor.

Is long term success REALLY and TRULY dictated solely by the EXACT number of CD sales and dollars earned? Your statement above would indicate that it does.

Success can be measured in different ways; sales and $$$ is one way.

No, I have even stated NUMEROUS times that Agalloch only sells a MODEST amount of CDs. Still though, there has been consistent demand for a band like Agalloch for many years due to album reviews and buzz. It is music for a niche market, which seems to be on the rise year after year.

Fair enough. Your many posts about how fantastic they are and how everyone loves them and how much they keep selling without touring makes them seem to be the biggest band I've never heard about ...

 

[Claus / Intromental]

Oi Vey! Seriously Claus??????

No?

I just think that bands who do not tour as rigorously as some spend more time making better music. How many bands failed to deliver with a solid follow up album after touring relentlessly?

I'm pretty sure most bands from when the music business was alive and kicking and it was possible to stay on the road 11 months a year will disagree with you.

 

[Jasonic]

I'm not familiar with that term, but it doesn't sound pleasant. Good luck with that - you might want to see a doctor.

Success can be measured in different ways; sales and $$$ is one way.

Fair enough. Your many posts about how fantastic they are and how everyone loves them and how much they keep selling without touring makes them seem to be the biggest band I've never heard about ...

First - Chappin my arse = chapping my hide. (IE - making my ass itch, irritating the hell out of me!!!) I do mean that in the nicest way.

Second - about sales and $$$$$. Agreed 100% in that this is only ONE measure of success. Different bands will measure success differently. A long running band like Manilla Road who is greatly respected will never sell more than modest album sales, because they play a style of metal that simply will never connect with young audiences. It will never be hip or eye catching. Still though, Manilla Road is big enough to get invited to many large European metal festivals each year. I have no clue how much $$$ they make from these appearances, or if any of the members truly live off of this. The point being though, is after so many years in the game, and keeping going as a respected band, they have the ability to release new albums every few years on various labels and play some very big shows. Just one example.

Third - No, Agalloch are absolutely not a huge band. Just an example of a band who has had some online and offline buzz about them based on their recorded output. Very few people, esp in the States, have seen Agalloch live. Once again, Agalloch was a quick example, as they have a new album being released today actually, that is getting a lot of talk on various forums.