What's the deal about mixing with headphones??

[Black neon bob]

Yeah, so i am mixing a song with headphones on right now, and i was wondering why so many people dislike or dismiss mixing through/with headphones?

I have older songs, and i was listening to them through headphones last night, and i noticed stuff like sharpness on the cymbals, or cymbals ringing through silence parts.. artifacts, noise, etc...

I have never noticed that stuff with my Near 05 monitors (crap, i know) but i dont think it's that bad mixing/recording through headphones...

What do guys think about this?

 

[~BURNY~]

Mainly because you don't get the right stereo picture. Using headphones when mixing is ok. You can get details on some of the sounds. But mixing with headphones from the beginning to the end (almost) always give unwanted results. If you have bad monitors (so do I), try to find the right balance between what you hear in it and in your headphones.

 

[Frank'nfurter]

Mixing over headphones only for control the stereo image.

 

[James Murphy]

headphones are on and off my head a lot during mixing.... i use them like a microscope to better hear fine details, like reverb tails, etc.... it's important to use monitors though, but keep in mind that many people these days listen to music primarily on headphones with their walkmans, iPods, etc.... also, be very careful when using headphones so as not to damage your ears through not only sudden, exrememely loud transients , but also due to prolonged moderately loud listening... it's easier to do than you think. i would say about 80 or 90 percent of the time, i'm monitoring and making my decisions through my nearfield monitors.

 

[Exsanguis]

With headphones, your stereo image is altered from listening to normal speakers, as well as the bass response. As the speakers are right next to your ears and are somewhat isolated, you're not accounting for any of the often subtle reflections and changes in audio when it's being played over speakers, taking just a little longer to reach your ears. If you only mix on headphones(if you're not REALLY familiar with mixing like that), you'll more than likely end up with a pretty messy mix. That said, if one learns how mixes translate from their specific pair of phones to many other sources, it is possible to mix on phones. I'm actually practicing that right now, as I'm going to college this fall and I'm guessing my roommate isn't gonna want to hear the same song for several hours on endless repeat over regular speakers.

 

[Awake_In_Animosity]

All very good point here, it also VERY important to use more than one pair of headphones. 1. Have a really good pair like Sennheiser HD25's or HD265's(both closed back headphones 2. Have a crappy cheap set of closed back headpones that you get from a megamart store. In conjunction with some monitors and your Hi Fi speakers you should get a great mix

 

[Exsanguis]

Very true about the multiple pairs of phones. I like the Sony 7506's, AKG K240's, and Grado RS1's(the RS2's are good too, and I believe cheaper).

 

[Black neon bob]

man, you guys ROCK!!

I am mixing a song from the very beginning until the end, beginning being actually all that goes in, like guitars, drums, bass, synth.. and i will finish it on headphones as well, maybe some monitor use in the final stage...

but the idea is to put it here entirely done with headphones, just for the fun of it.. see if it works, you know..

I just have a cheap behringer headphones hooked on a pioneer audio amp... nothing special there.. haha...

I was thinking though, if i take a song of a very good band, and listen to those on the headphones.. and i will actually take that very same mix as my example how to mix my song.. that would work though, right? or am i missing something on that one?

James, thanks for the heads up on the volume and transients.. i had a blast assault on my ears yesterday, and i think i might have damaged one side quite a bit now i have this crappy mouse that's really sluggish as hell, and sometimes it just goes out of order while i am trying to make it go somewhere.. just as i grabbed the volume button, it went all the way up, really blasting on the headphones!! my ear is making popping sounds every ten minutes now... be carefull indeed...

 

[Frank'nfurter]

i had a blast assault on my ears yesterday, and i think i might have damaged one side quite a bit now

For gods sake, go IMMEDIATELY to a ear doctor, this is no joke. If you go in the first 12 - 24 h then the Doc have a chance to help you against a tinnitus or other ear damage!!!!

 

[Impy]

i have this crappy mouse that's really sluggish as hell, and sometimes it just goes out of order while i am trying to make it go somewhere.. just as i grabbed the volume button, it went all the way up, really blasting on the headphones!! my ear is making popping sounds every ten minutes now... be carefull indeed...

I'd suggest running your output from the computer into a mixer or something and then plugging your headphones into that, that will give you a "safe" way to control your volume with a real pot.

 

[DIOBOLIC5150]

I'd suggest running your output from the computer into a mixer or something and then plugging your headphones into that, that will give you a "safe" way to control your volume with a real pot.

I have a "panic" button setup on my PC. If something all of the sudden gets to loud and might damage monitors, ears, ect... I hit it and it shuts off all sound immediately. Never had to use it though.

 

[Ermz]

Yeah the panic button idea is quite clever, I like that. There have been a few times in the studio where I've been in there with some other guys who underestimated the gear's potential to put out some serious dB and the music would come on cranked and just scare the shit out of everyone.

Back here at home I'm stuck using a 'virtual' fader for monitoring volume, as I'm running out of my soundcard directly into a pair of monitors (haven't purchased a desk yet).

 

[Impy]

I have a "panic" button setup on my PC. If something all of the sudden gets to loud and might damage monitors, ears, ect... I hit it and it shuts off all sound immediately. Never had to use it though.

Well when using headphones i think you'll throw them off before you react to hit the panic button

I have a rule which is to never ever press play before i've checked the volume knob, i'm very protective of my ears, i always wear earplugs when i go out and so on, one time can be enough when exposed to high volumes.

 

[FrostGiant]

Headphones act as a compressor, that's why you tend to hear more of the music. It's not a bad idea to check your mix on them from time to time, but don't expect your mix to actually sound good if that's all you use. For one the bass is going to be way too loud. I tried to mix a song on headphones once, then out went and bought a pair of nearfields.

As for using another bands mix to use as a template, that's not a terrible idea. It helps give you a starting point. But remember, your tones, number of tracks, etc. will all be completely different. You'll actually never be able to copy that mix. Every song mixes completely different.

 

[Exsanguis]

Using another band's cd to get used to your headphones is quite useful, just make sure you know that mix inside and out, on a variety of other sources as well. Headphones, like many speakers, can hide certain things that pop out on other speakers, and as a result, your mix might sound very close to your ref., but when you play it elsewhere, you hear all these nasty little things that were previously invisible. Just a heads up. Have fun, I'd love to hear the outcome.

 

[Mendel]

man, you guys ROCK!!

I am mixing a song from the very beginning until the end, beginning being actually all that goes in, like guitars, drums, bass, synth.. and i will finish it on headphones as well, maybe some monitor use in the final stage...

but the idea is to put it here entirely done with headphones, just for the fun of it.. see if it works, you know..

I just have a cheap behringer headphones hooked on a pioneer audio amp... nothing special there.. haha...

I was thinking though, if i take a song of a very good band, and listen to those on the headphones.. and i will actually take that very same mix as my example how to mix my song.. that would work though, right? or am i missing something on that one?

James, thanks for the heads up on the volume and transients.. i had a blast assault on my ears yesterday, and i think i might have damaged one side quite a bit now i have this crappy mouse that's really sluggish as hell, and sometimes it just goes out of order while i am trying to make it go somewhere.. just as i grabbed the volume button, it went all the way up, really blasting on the headphones!! my ear is making popping sounds every ten minutes now... be carefull indeed...

i've red i some magazines that mixing with headphones is a bad idea but that someone ( you ) is doing it with headphones is cool cause to know if it's true. any way i had the same thing wth my ears 3 months ago. A stupid farmer on my schoowl ( a.k.a kut eigenwijze frysland boeren ) had this plastic bag and made it pop close to my ears and my eras where wistleling like if a atomic bomb was exploxed. anyway to make a big story short ( already told the big story lol ) after 2 weeks it became a bit better. try not to listen to hard to stuff ( i know you love metal that's the problem ) and if you are gonna take a shower . . . . . don't let the shower sprinkle the water to hard in your ears ( i'm speaking of a experience)


cheers bobby!!

mendel

 

[Nostalgiaplatz]

All very good point here, it also VERY important to use more than one pair of headphones. 1. Have a really good pair like Sennheiser HD25's or HD265's(both closed back headphones 2. Have a crappy cheap set of closed back headpones that you get from a megamart store. In conjunction with some monitors and your Hi Fi speakers you should get a great mix

On the 2nd Sennheiser sugestion did you meant HD26 instead of 265? I'm nto aware of 265 (and didn't actually looked them up) but I know HD26 is being sold for 6euros..pretty cheap, just wondering if that's the one you were sugesting, cuz if it is I will buy those

Thanks!

 

[Wadi]

Most of the times, I do mixing through headphones at low levels...lower than cd listening level..even if I monitor through MSP5, Its still at a very low level.

Erm, at what levels do you guys normally mix?

 

[Ermz]

I try to mix at a reasonable level. At home that usually means as loud as possible without severely disturbing anybody and at the academy it means that it's quite loud, but not to the point of damaging my ears, or having to shout overly loud at anyone who's in there with me.

I find the louder it is the more details I can get from the mix. When it comes about juggling levels of the individual tracks, I'll take the volume down really really low and listen to things that stand out above all other elements in the mix and then adjust accordingly.

 

[Mulder]

I work with Sennheiser HD650 cans and they're fantastic. I can hear everything, they practically don't distort themselves and have a very good dynamic response. What I like a lot is the absence of bassreflex, the lowend is deep, tight and analytic. For the final mixingstage I switch to my monitors (Technics SB-RX50 with class A amps) cause I tend to add too much room while mixing on cans.

But I love working on them, took me a while to find a decent pair though.

Some inearmonitors are also very good, but if you give them a bit too much power they compress (& distort) like hell.. But inears give this funny 'in-head localisation' because you 'skip' your earshells while listening.

Anyway, if you want good cans you need some money, everything that comes cheap sounds very bad and adds all kinds of distortion and bad impulsebehaviour to your soundimpression.