With all my hope...

[SmaviL]

Hello to you all...
I'm sorry to start a thread that has theorickly nothing to do with this forum and maybe could be problematic to some people due to diffrences in opinions... even if I think that most of you will agree with me...
As you all know, tomorrow the American people will elect their new president... for that reason the german chanel pro7 just showed the documentary entitled "Fahrenheit 9/11"... even if it just finished, it made me think very strongly about the situation, future, all the "why" questions... it's been really shocking to see it, even if we all know that too many things in last years haven't been right or done honestly.
I don't want to mess up with politics, but I know that what will happen tomorrow, will have consequences not only for the US, but also for the entire world... like it had 4 years ago.
I'm not religious, so I don't know what/who I could pray to to ask that things could get better... I can only say, let's hope all of us, that the right thing happens, whatever it should be, so that we can enjoy our lives in peace, having to worry a bit less about the nearest future...
Love to all of you out here...
Ala/Smavil

 

[Folklore]

well dear..
I think that the right thing is up to the boss to decide weather to make it or not.
and it`s definitly a response to our acts, what man do onto his brother.


you can look at it same way even if you drop the "boss" element from what I just wrote.
you start with yourself. from there on it`s a domino-reaction inside society and the rest of the world.
if you talk about leaders, let me remind you that good guys dont always wear white..
leaders can be serious assholes in their personal lives or even public life, and still be good.
look at hitler and churchill. hitler had a healthy life style, he was vegererian, and he was taking care of his body and personal life.
Churchill was a brat: he smoked, dressed like a bohemian and drank by the gallons.
and still....
I say life is too short to care about whos in charge. we`re in charge of our lives and that the only thing that counts eventually.

I think that if you`re looking for something to pray to.. you can pray for love to come.
because everything that we know, exists for love.

 

[Demonspell]

I also fear for the future and hope that the results of our election tomorrow will not add further to the rift between my country and the rest of the world. I know that the choice we make tomorrow cannot prevent war or guarantee peace, but it may offer a promise of resolution, and I hope we make the right decision.

 

[the_dying]

I'm happy being European... That's for clear... Rage against the States is becoming worldwide.

 

[Morticia NL.]

I do not thnk that this is the wrong place to put in a post like this. It seems to me that OL fans make up a different kind of society by themselves- look at what different kind of people visit in here. The love for music we share makes us open up to one another- even if we come from very diverse backgrounds.

I have not seen the documentary, but I think that I can make up my own mind on this subject. It is truely frightning to find that one person can have so much influence. Why do we all accept this?

I do not think that being anti- America is the answer. It is important to always keep the dialogue going, even if you don't agree!

 

[ScientistOfDarkness]

*just voted*


Well, let's see what happens. Maybe one day I can move to Canada

 

[LANTHWICK]

I do not thnk that this is the wrong place to put in a post like this. It seems to me that OL fans make up a different kind of society by themselves- look at what different kind of people visit in here. The love for music we share makes us open up to one another- even if we come from very diverse backgrounds.

I do not think that being anti- America is the answer. It is important to always keep the dialogue going, even if you don't agree!

hailz to Morticia ..
well , am livin a so f**kin state of life , being an american-arabik person well it s realy tough ...i VOTED yes against my relatives will .. i voted for believen in better world with all its lacks ..in the next time i ll vote O.L as president

i guess orphaned land despite everything succeeded in unitin at least us ,who come from different cultures with different religions .

once we talked bout buildin the ark , my ark s built by peace , nations united ,and a stage where all the bands will perform the opening for ORPHANED LAND

i guess i went to emotionaly , but that s how i feel ,long live the whole world ,long live our forum :Spin:

"Our hearts are too valuable to be worn on our skin, the same as they’re too valuable to be tucked away in the darkness until the end of time…."

 

[Folklore]

the dying.. Just wanna tell you that no one here where I live has some "anti-american" sentiments.
I think that this is just one of those pityful fasions in history where hate become a fashionable way to take out rage. There are Millions of people in america, how can you say you hate them? Hating america and american culture is, in a way, hating something form your culture as well. We know that america is the biggest immigrant country and that inside america there`s a little bit or england, little bit of holland, greece, israel, turkey, africa, china.. and the list is long.


LANTHWICK - WORD!

 

[the_dying]

Folkman, Israel is like a state of the USA. A partner in the Middle East to stay close with the oil source. I know ppl who have been to Israel and America. They say both countries are very alike. Israel is the small brother of the USA.

To the Dutch person: dialogue? I see how things work out in Holland... Van Gogh? Pitty... I'm more for a world boycott.

 

[SmaviL]

@the dying: we could start now to criticise every country, without always being wrong: f.ex. Poland (where I come from) for having supported war in Iraq just to do some "ass-licking" to the US thinking to get more advantages if they join the self named world leader in this way, or Belgium that is divided in 2 parts and where people from the nord refuse to speak french and people from the south refuse to speak flamish, even if they know it really well, just because that don't like eachother... It's not totally wrong, is it? But not for everyone, so what would such judging and putting all people in one category be good for? It's just not fair! Of course, it's easier this way, the less categories your mind has to deal with, the more it avoids you thinking and save space on your brains "hard disc" (which in normal case is supposed to be unlimited...), but I really think that with the current level of education and information that we become we should be a bit more open minded... and less lazy to think!

 

[Folklore]

Dying.. on the surface what you see is definitly east to describe as minor-america. indeed. But if you`ll give it a closer look you`ll know that unlike america, the israeli people might seem diffenat, externally-speaking, but.......
The origin of all those people is one. weather his family is north african oriented, or north-east iraq (places like Kurdistan or, say.. azarbeijan) - or central europe or n. america: they are all jews. and Judaism comes ofcourse form israel. Considering the fact that judaism is the only religion that oppose mission and conversion (and if you seriously want to convert, you have 3 long years of study to do...) you`ll see that jews, where ever they`ll be, in whatever colour or look, they`ll have... they`re still the people that were driven out of israel some 2000 years ago by the romans, or 800 years earlier (I think) by the persians and the earlier empires.. and yet there were always relics of jewish communites inside Israel. Most names of arab towns and villages are incarnated (liguisticlly speaking) from the origines of it`s hebrew name


unbelievable... peace lies underneath our feets right now, but people here in israel/ palestine prefer to ignor it.

and to my israeli and arab brothers here ill say : forget this whole violent thing here.. Yalla Khafla !!

 

[Morticia NL.]

The dying> please do not make this about countries, when I am trying to talk person to person.

To others> I do not know whether you've heard, but yesterday a columnist/ movie director was muderdered in Holland by a muslim from Holland, who originates from Morocco. He was gunned down in the streets of Amsterdam, with a knife sticking in his body to which was attached a piece of paper reciting textes from the Koran calling everyone on to start a Jihad.
This guy who was murdered was well known for being an outspoken person- not anti muslim, but always critizing any part in society that he did not agree with> muslims who beat up there wife or do not give women the rights they are entitled to, politicans who have stupid plans, but also government wasting money. He might not have been the most polite person when he was making his point, but all he wanted to do was get the dialogue going- this he did by writing columsn in newspapers and by making films on controversial subjects: the maming of (muslim) women in cutting their genitals and he just finished a film about Pim Fortuyn ( the right wing party leader who was murdered before he was about to win the elections) Irony right?

What I'm trying to tell you > I might become bitter in this being the second political killing in recent times in Holland, but I am not! The fact that the guy was a muslim, or originally from Morocco, does not mean that I cannot get along with any other persons from that country or belief. The only way for me to find out, is to talk to them, instead of hating them for reasons I do not really have.

So please let this place be an example for us all to exchange opinions and talk instead of fight.

PS> To me the trip to Turkey was a big eye opener in my life. There is a large community of turkish people in Holland, but we never ever talk to one another. Both our societies kind of exist next to one another in the same country, but only "touch" in violence. Ofcourse there are exceptions to this luckily!
During my stay in Turkey I got to talk with a lot of turkish people and people from countries in the middle east, that I never meet/ talk to normally. The only reason we did, is because we're all metalfans. It was a great experience for me and I really try to stay open like I was when I was overthere.

See what loving a band like Orphaned Land can do....

*You might say I'm a dreamer, but Í'm not the only one.........*
John Lennon

 

[Folklore]

I heard about that director. he was the grandson of Van Gogh`s brother... Im so sorry about that...
I believe that that guy who murdered him just didnt realize that he`s living in a free country.. probably a cultural difference that led to this tragic act..
Turkey was an excellent trip for me too! I met a friend who`s about only 90 minutes driving away, but the problem is that he`s in Beiruth.. so .. it was a very unique experiance for me, very educational and somewhat spiritual.. for me it was Touching peace.
So turkey will always be a good way to remind myself that peace is always in a reach of a hand...

 

[LANTHWICK]

The dying> please do not make this about countries, when I am trying to talk person to person.

To others> I do not know whether you've heard, but yesterday a columnist/ movie director was muderdered in Holland by a muslim from Holland, who originates from Morocco. He was gunned down in the streets of Amsterdam, with a knife sticking in his body to which was attached a piece of paper reciting textes from the Koran calling everyone on to start a Jihad.
This guy who was murdered was well known for being an outspoken person- not anti muslim, but always critizing any part in society that he did not agree with> muslims who beat up there wife or do not give women the rights they are entitled to, politicans who have stupid plans, but also government wasting money. He might not have been the most polite person when he was making his point, but all he wanted to do was get the dialogue going- this he did by writing columsn in newspapers and by making films on controversial subjects: the maming of (muslim) women in cutting their genitals and he just finished a film about Pim Fortuyn ( the right wing party leader who was murdered before he was about to win the elections) Irony right?

What I'm trying to tell you > I might become bitter in this being the second political killing in recent times in Holland, but I am not! The fact that the guy was a muslim, or originally from Morocco, does not mean that I cannot get along with any other persons from that country or belief. The only way for me to find out, is to talk to them, instead of hating them for reasons I do not really have.

So please let this place be an example for us all to exchange opinions and talk instead of fight.


See what loving a band like Orphaned Land can do....

*You might say I'm a dreamer, but Í'm not the only one.........*
John Lennon

Nathalie respect
WELL to clear one sticky stuff .. bout muslims part
these parts making incomings and bomb stuff .. they r not muslim they r but racisst fanatik troops ..who see everyone else blashpemer even the other muslims troops ..
u know being a muslim ...is being christian and jew too .. those three r found with harmony leadin to the supreme being ..the one and only holy god ..even buddism,hinduss and others pagan religions believe in one god even if he s called buda or shiva ...but they believe in the same believes that we do ..to live in harmony with others and nature and people polymorphysm
the torah the bible and the koran ( the real books ) teach us how to live and let live respectin others believes ..and not how to kill each other
..and by the way islam objects and defies the way the women r treated and insists on theire equality with men ..all the misstreatement is due for an old and ugly habbit before islam and still in some countries like saudi arabia and ...afghanistan ( the countries of nomads )
those threee r but one accomplishing the other ..and without the 3 united there will be no heaven and life willl be useless
the fanatic war ..well created by those people who have benefit in humans killing each others ..and all they think bout how to increase theire bank accounts ..it s not our fight nor our war..
for me Platos democrathie but a person , who respects me and understand me for who i am , and for sure i ll do the same ..

in the end i own holland an appologie for what stupid arabik troops done ..
so sorry guys ..
god bless you all

 

[Morticia NL.]

Lanthwick> Amen to that!

You do not owe an appology for something you did not do- but I for sure appreciate the idea that's behind it.

Big hug,
Nathalie

 

[emirkarasakal]

morticia havent anyone told you that the turk people are in your country are not really turks. more than %50 are kurdish, which doesnt count theirselves as turk but has a turkish passport
it is the same arround whole world

 

[emirkarasakal]

religions are not sent to kill, dissect, break, divide
but to love ,unite and arrange a better social life
those troopers are brainwashed, god damned stupids that who couldnt simply get the main idea of islam
and i am sick of it

 

[LANTHWICK]

well i ve bein tryin to reply but i ve got nothin in head .
i thank god for meetin u guys even in cyber world ..but someday for real

 

[Morticia NL.]

I do not know about the turkish or kurdish people over here.( I know the history of Turkey a bit by the way, it's not like I don't understand what you're talking about) Like I said, there is not a lot of contact between us and the "others" I have to say that that is also mainly the case for me because I live in a very rural place. It's right in the center of all the big cities, but it's very rural- there are no "foreigners" living here because houses are not affordable and you cannot get a rental place if you weren't born here in this town. That's not because we do not want them to live here, but if they do not keep the houses for the town people, only rich folks would be able to live here.
So I hardly meet any non white people as it is- and since I am a metal fan I don not see any "foreign"people in concerts and while I was a student there were almost solely "white"people in the college.
The point I'm trying to make is, that if we do not know one another, but still live in the same country, how could we get to know one another? But also> how is it we are hating one another? How can you hate someone that you do not know, enough to want to kill him?
Maybe this is something I cannot understand since I am not a religious person....

And yes, I would very much love to meet up with you guys, who knows.... It would make up for some really interesting discussions and exchange of thoughts and experiences. But I might be in the two turkish gigs, so who knows???

 

[SmaviL]

I can not understand either how's possible to hate someone one doesn't even know... as for me, I hated one person in my whole life, and even if this person gave me good reasons for it, I'm always trying to change something about my feelings... maybe luckily without success, or it woud give him other opportunities to hurt me again...

As for religions, I think we in fact all believe in the same thing, even if we all call it diffrently... whether it's God, Allah, the Force inside ourselves... call it as you wish... there are just some problems about interpretation