Any mastering tips?

[Gnash]

i would totally NOT do this!

mix/master as much with your ears, and not your eyes. i know we all want our masters to reach the volume of other commercial releases...but the truth is, most of the shit being released now is just way too pancaked.

also, try do everything in your power to avoid smashing flat with the L3...there's a lot of things you can do to raise average volume other than lopping off peaks.

Yeah, the mix can get away from me, and the dynamics just leave, after smashing too hard with the L3. I give it a very light touch. I still want to find a way to smash it though , without losing the sweet spot.

 

[Rob Logic]

So what's your average squash in dbs? I find after 4-6db of average reduction (the ideal number in the L3 manual), the song starts to sound harsh and "squashy" the hats always get too loud, and I start losing the low end in my kick, so I back off, and I'm rarely getting an even level. A good trick for "final volume" I have learned in my "ghetto mastering" endeavors is to just look at the meters of my playback channel for my favorite new (loudest) cd, and match my work to those levels. At this point, I hate my mastering work, though. I use the L3, by the way. What are some other "go to" plugs with waves?

The Storyteller has an incredible post on this forum which links to another forum that shows examples of mastering with different limiters. It really opened my eyes as to how bad the waves limiters can be while producing a "loud" disc. It sounds like you have a liking for the waves stuff so I don't want to shit in your cereal or anything (I read his post shortly after I bought a Waves bundle). I've pretty much stopped using all the limiters with waves for any 2-bus application. I highly recommend locating it and reading the posts and listening to the examples. It gives you some other great tools as you asked for which provide in most cases much better results than what you might currently be using. Keep in mind also, these types of limiters The Storyteller chronicles can be used in conjunction with other types of limiters. Check it out!!!

 

[brandy]

4-6db of average reduction (the ideal number in the L3 manual)

haha! how can they talk abou an "ideal" number of reduction without knowing about the musical style, the dynamix (amount of compression allready used in the mix) etc etc?

Record some drums, make a rough-mix without any compression/limiting. Put the L3 on it - now you can squash ist about 8db without getting too much artefacts.

Now put that L3 on a allready squashed and dense metal mix, with quad-tracked guiters, all drumreplaced drums etc.

I barely use the L3 for more than just 1 or mabe 2 db of limiting.

If you need LOUDNESS you better use EQ and maybe some parallel-compression scenarios first.


And:

Everything would be much nicer if we could drop that "average-must-to-have-loudness" by just a few db.


If your result is in the -12 dbrms range you can spent your time for a GOOD SOUND - if you have to compete in the -8dbrms range you have to spent 90% of the mastering time to "tweak for loudness".


brandy

 

[Black neon bob]

Everything would be much nicer if we could drop that "average-must-to-have-loudness" by just a few db.


If your result is in the -12 dbrms range you can spent your time for a GOOD SOUND - if you have to compete in the -8dbrms range you have to spent 90% of the mastering time to "tweak for loudness".


brandy

If only the entire metal industry would think like that... i mean, i fully understand why bands want their loudness, but hell.. why sacrifice so much just to compete with the loudest recordings out there, you know?

What's so hard about turning up a volume button a bit?

 

[colonel kurtz]

well...what really sucks is that it's the bands who are buying into the whole "louder is better" thing now

"duuuuuuuude...the cd sounds good and everything, but like...it's not as loud as my friend's demo...i mean, it's cool and all, but like...could you master it some more and make it louder or something?"

now you have 2 options:

a)make the fucking thing louder

b)don't make it louder - and then the band doesn't come to you next time they need a demo, and they tell all the bands they know not to go to you, "cause you can't make shit as loud" as others

personally, i try to explain to people that the liberal use of brickwall limiting that goes on nowadays kills the dynamics of the music and all that good stuff...but honestly, 9 out of 10 people just want their shit to play back as loud as everyone else's.

 

[Glenn Fricker]

now you have 2 options:

a)make the fucking thing louder

b)don't make it louder - and then the band doesn't come to you next time they need a demo, and they tell all the bands they know not to go to you, "cause you can't make shit as loud" as others

personally, i try to explain to people that the liberal use of brickwall limiting that goes on nowadays kills the dynamics of the music and all that good stuff...but honestly, 9 out of 10 people just want their shit to play back as loud as everyone else's.

I totally agree. And the situation just plain sucks. Every now & then I'll get a client who understands what dynamics are & they'll ask me not to blast the shit out of it... & it always sounds great that way. These days "louder" rarely means "better."

I realize that last statement might be unpopular, but I'll stand by that opinion. Flame away!

 

[Gnash]

The Storyteller has an incredible post on this forum which links to another forum that shows examples of mastering with different limiters. It really opened my eyes as to how bad the waves limiters can be while producing a "loud" disc. It sounds like you have a liking for the waves stuff so I don't want to shit in your cereal or anything (I read his post shortly after I bought a Waves bundle). I've pretty much stopped using all the limiters with waves for any 2-bus application. I highly recommend locating it and reading the posts and listening to the examples. It gives you some other great tools as you asked for which provide in most cases much better results than what you might currently be using. Keep in mind also, these types of limiters The Storyteller chronicles can be used in conjunction with other types of limiters. Check it out!!!

Thanks, man!

 

[Student]

Keith is right on about the headroom.

I would advise you to never listen to a mix louder than 83dB SPL. Get an SPL meter at Rat Shack and check your speakers. This has to do with the Equal Loudness Contours, or Fletcher/Munson Curves. Look them up.

I started listening to my mixes at very low levels, and since there is an upward expansion of bass and treble as volume increases, the mixes have started translating better into every volume level every user uses...all around better EQ.

Use flat monitors like the Meyer HD-1 or better, make sure your room is tuned/dampened/treated. Check or "reference" your mix on shitty speakers like the NS-10s, your car, your home stereo SONY MDR headphones and a pink boombox from Walgreens to make sure your not messing up phase too badly, if it sounds good on all of those, your have a decent mix, I DID NOT SAY "If they sound the same." THAT WILL NEVER BE THE CASE, I SAID IF IT SOUNDS GOOD ON ALL OF THEM.

 

[Student]

I totally agree. And the situation just plain sucks. Every now & then I'll get a client who understands what dynamics are & they'll ask me not to blast the shit out of it... & it always sounds great that way. These days "louder" rarely means "better."

I realize that last statement might be unpopular, but I'll stand by that opinion. Flame away!

The nice thing about digital audio was the increase of dynamic range, which every idiot in the industry mistook as more loudness, which is not necessarily accurate.

We can only change this one mix at a time. Keep it dynamic don't squash it all. Run an expander on some things track guitars at a lower volume, we can only do so much when it comes to dynamics and paying the bills at the same time.

KEEP ROCKING.