Christcore is not Metal.

[Ultimate_Symphony]

A) Music that tells a definite story.
B) Music meant to convey a mood (abstract)
C) Music for music's sake.

What is commonly referred to as metal is classified largely into the first two areas (B more often than not), and therefore, is greatly influenced by the motivation for its conception which is hinted at and conveyed through the lyrics. Outside of more abstract and absurdist pieces, this is generally, the law.

As it has been mentioned, the subclassification of 'metal' is identified for its strong messages of personal revolution and identity (which is often displayed through highly violent messages), which is completely antithetical to moral and Zionist subversion.

In summary, to say that metallic music with Christian messages is still metal is like saying that Gospel choir music with Satanic messages is still gospel music.

What a pile of bullshit. Therefore bands like Symphony X and time Requiem are not metal? Metal tends to have violent messages, but that does not mean that every band that does not have violent/anti religious messages on their music are not metal. Metal was by coincidence I would say, a genre that was started (or formed) by people that were rebellious and a lot of times anti religion. What if those people that formed metal were christians? does that mean that every band that wasn't christian wouldn't be a metal band?

A genre of music is formed by a lot of people with a plethora of ideas. It's idiotic to think that to play a certain type of music I have to have the same ideas of those that started the genre (excluding gospel). That's like saying you don't play Salsa because you don't have the same beliefs of other salsa bands (hypothetically speaking) You have to draw a line between music and ideology. Music is sound/rhythm, a sound that provokes emotions. Christian bands may not have the ''metal'' ideology, but they certainly play METAL.

In summary, to say that metallic music with Christian messages is still metal is like saying that Gospel choir music with Satanic messages is still gospel music.

That's not a good example. Gospel music is the only genre that has a defined lyrical structure, it's meant to preach about Jesus (and gospel music has every genre imaginable: salsa, rap, pop, merengue etc.). Metal does not have a defined lyrical structure. ''Metal'' lyrics deal with everything, from war to religion, from politics to nature.

I suppose Nile are not death metal because they don't fit the death metal (lyrical) norm, right?

Why am I on this argument? :Smug:

 

[Neurotic]

What a pile of bullshit. Therefore bands like Symphony X and time Requiem are not metal? Metal tends to have violent messages, but that does not mean that every band that does not have violent/anti reiligious messages on their music are not metal. Metal was by coincidence I would say a genre that was started (or formed) by people that were rebellious and a lot of times anti religion. What if those people that formed metal were christians? does that mean that every band that wasn't christian wouldn't be a metal band?

A genre if music is formed by a lot of people with a plethora of ideas. It's idiotic to think that to play a certain type of music I have to have the same ideas of those that started the genre (excluding gospel). That's like saying you don't play Salsa because you don't have the same beliefs of other salsa bands (hypothetically speaking) You have to draw a line between music and ideology. Music is sound/rhythm, a sound that provokes emotions. Christian bands may not have the ''metal'' ideology, but they certainly play METAL.

That's not a good example. Gospel music is the only genre that has a defined lyrical structure, it's meant to preach about Jesus (and gospel music has every genre imaginable: salsa, rap, pop, merengue etc.). Metal does not have a defined lyrical structure. ''Metal'' lyrics deal with everything, from war to religion, from politics to nature.

I suppose Nile are not death metal because they don't fit the death metal (lyrical) norm.

Why am I on this argument? :Smug:

couldn't have said it better myself, you're a wise man.

 

[Soilent Goat]

That's right, Christcore, (like Hardcore) is not metal.

Now why isn't it metal? Because metal, when it originally started, did not preach utter submission of the will, which is what Christianity absolutely is.

Metal ideology was (note the past tense) the idea that embraced the individual and also embraced elitism. Basically ruling one's life, according to Metal ideology, was only the choice of the individual himself, NOT some long-dead martyr's posthumously written scriptures.

Now people might say; "Well what if the individual chooses to be Chrsitian?" I'll say it right now, submitting one's self to some "higher power" is NOT individualism.

Okay so Extol isn't truly a metal band? Yeah whatever..Shut the fuck up..and secondly just because a band is hardcore doesn't mean their Christians. You're an ignorant fuck. Please kill yourself. Later.

 

[SculptedCold]

Sonical Artist's argument was interesting and fluent, but invalid.

For one thing, you're more realistic reconsidering most metal music to fit into 'C', and the differentiation between 'B' and 'C' is very vague; isn't music's 'sake' necessarily inclusive of all the above regardless?

Ultimate Symphony's point regarding your example of Gospel music was very sound; metal didn't originate as an expression of ideology through lyricism, and although ideology was still likely present to some degree at metal's first inceptions, it was primarily expressed in the nature of the music itself, that is, its sound, so your discussion of lyricism and its importance in definining metal is largely irrelevant.


I enjoyed reading your argument though, twas well thought-out.

 

[-Galaxy 500-]

That's right, Christcore, (like Hardcore) is not metal.

Now why isn't it metal? Because metal, when it originally started, did not preach utter submission of the will, which is what Christianity absolutely is.

Metal ideology was (note the past tense) the idea that embraced the individual and also embraced elitism. Basically ruling one's life, according to Metal ideology, was only the choice of the individual himself, NOT some long-dead martyr's posthumously written scriptures.

Now people might say; "Well what if the individual chooses to be Chrsitian?" I'll say it right now, submitting one's self to some "higher power" is NOT individualism.

I disagree but oh well.

 

[LuminousAether]

Since when is metal about individualism? Seems to me that almost all metalheads are sheep with no opinions of their own.

 

[Scurvy]

I thought metal was a genre of music myself. Living your life by a musical genre and the associated scene is far from calling yourself an individual. As someone hinted before, being into metal is more about being part of a group with common interests than being an individual.

And elitism can fuck off. It's the height of narrow-mindedness and does nothing to help metal grow and adapt.

 

[Stormwatch]

Since when is metal about individualism? Seems to me that almost all metalheads are sheep with no opinions of their own.

Unlike you who knows everything about everything eh?

 

[Profanity]

Since when is metal about individualism? Seems to me that almost all metalheads are sheep with no opinions of their own.

good point

 

[Bryant]

This will turn into quite a thread, long time since i've seen one of these.

@bryant- I don't think it's derogatory to say christians are not individualistic. Christians (or religious people) often rely on a god, while individualistic people rely on themselves (their own logic and opinions, not what a book or god says) and i'm not even looking at the bigger picture. I would say no one is 100% individualistic.

So if you ask any "religious" person a question, he/she will flip through his/her religious book before answering it ? I am not saying you aren't right to a degree, but at the same time, there are varying degrees of "religiousness" different people have. I would say the hard-core Christians, Muslims, etc. probably would let their religion dictate a large portion of their life, but I some people are a bit more liberalistic with their religious beliefs, yet consider themselves religious.

Bryant

 

[Stormwatch]

Why are people always starting threads about religion? Trying to force their shitty beliefs on us all the time - fuck off. If i want to read about religion I'll go to the library, this is MUSIC discussion board, not the fucking "Ultimate Religious Fervour" board.