Correlation between Religion and Athletes

[hexwind]

The difference is that a metal band/song makes no claim of trying to influence its listeners behavior, whereas religion does it in a very explicit way. A sane person is not going to listen to a metal song (even a violent one) and then believe that is acceptable behavior. A sane person could easily read that passage Krampus posted and, having been taught that it is God's word, believe that he has the right to beat his wife. Can it be boiled down to "religion's fault"? I don't think so, but religion is an extremely powerful cultural force in many people's lives, and I do think it can encourage negative behavior.

Please read my post for more insight

I'm curious, where are you from if you don't mind me asking?

I'm from Tunisia, in North Africa, if you have any idea about Middetarrenian history, it was known as Carthage. It is way different than in the middle east due to colonization and other influences of other cultures (like the Turkish, French, Arabic and so on). Why did you ask ? haha

 

[Dak]

The difference is that a metal band/song makes no claim of trying to influence its listeners behavior, whereas religion does it in a very explicit way. A sane person is not going to listen to a metal song (even a violent one) and then believe that is acceptable behavior. A sane person could easily read that passage Krampus posted and, having been taught that it is God's word, believe that he has the right to beat his wife. Can it be boiled down to "religion's fault"? I don't think so, but religion is an extremely powerful cultural force in many people's lives, and I do think it can encourage negative behavior.

Denying that music in any form is not an extremely powerful cultural force is naive. Lyrical messages in music often circumvent normal brain processing by combining with hypnotic beats, etc. Any student of the effects of music on the mind can tell you this.

 

[damnromulans]

"Primal Concrete Sledge" is the best song you could ever beat your wife to!

Thanks for the insight hexwind. Unfortunately, the first line of the quote you posted is enough for me to say "no thanks, what a shitty belief system."

 

[Dak]

"Primal Concrete Sledge" is the best song you could ever beat your wife to!

INORITE?

 

[Badbird]

I have a thread about politics and sports. We have great threads like this one... why not make one about politics and sports.

 

[hexwind]

"Primal Concrete Sledge" is the best song you could ever beat your wife to!

Pantera music could be the soundtrack of any fight !

Thanks for the insight hexwind. Unfortunately, the first line of the quote you posted is enough for me to say "no thanks, what a shitty belief system."

haha I respect that

 

[jussstin]

That is like saying a hammer is a bad thing because it can be used for bad things. It can be used to kill people or build great things for society.

True, but there is a slight difference. Hammers can be used to kill, but they don't provide the justification for murder like religion can. No-one has ever blown themselves up and destroyed others because a coping saw told them they would receive 72 wives and 80,000 servants in the afterlife. No-one has ever been tortured or murdered because a screwdriver said they were of an incorrect faith.

Depending on your perspective of the historical inhabitants of that area, peace was not an option.

I'm sure that peace probably wasn't an option. The fact that a God (or at least one of God's followers) demanded violence against followers of a different god was the problem I had with it.

That portion isn't a part of the Torah, which are the instructions for living.

I wasn't referring to the Torah, I was referring to the Bible in general being the guide for living for people. But anyway, the passage I quoted was in Deuteronomy. Isn't that part of the Torah?

EDIT: Come to think of it, would anyone really want 72 wives? Many people I know, after a time come to think of their spouses as a significant burden that sucks the joy out of life. Multiplying that by 72 sounds like a complete nightmare. Then multiply that by the infinity that you'll be spending with them, and that starts to sound more like Hell than Heaven.

 

[jussstin]

I have a thread about politics and sports. We have great threads like this one... why not make one about politics and sports.

You'd probably get more people responding to your threads if you put a bit more effort and thought into the initial post.

Compare:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1015989/index.htm

A good article I readed just now. I can only think of one athelte that listen to metal.

I always see guys like 85 Bears, Deion Sanders, and Shaq rapping but not playing some metal.

...with ~Derek~'s original post in this thread. His post was well thought out, spell checked and actually asked a question which prompted further discussion. Perhaps try a 'Quality, not Quantity' approach to posting, rather than vice versa.

 

[hexwind]

True, but there is a slight difference. Hammers can be used to kill, but they don't provide the justification for murder like religion can. No-one has ever blown themselves up and destroyed others because a coping saw told them they would receive 72 wives and 80,000 servants in the afterlife. No-one has ever been tortured or murdered because a screwdriver said they were of an incorrect faith.

I guess you're referring to the Quran here. It's utterly forbidden :

"O ye who believe!... [do not] kill yourselves, for truly Allah has been to you Most Merciful. If any do that in rancour and injustice, soon shall We cast him into the Fire..." (Qur'an 4:29-30).

"Nor take life - which Allah has made sacred - except for just cause..." (17:33).

In war context, it means you have no right to kill someone other than a soldier WITH a weapon. Anyone who doesn't bear a weapon and attacks you is not allowed to be killed.

"O ye who believe! Remain steadfast for Allah, bearing witness to justice. Do not allow your hatred for others make you swerve to wrongdoing and turn you away from justice. Be just; that is closer to true piety."

- Qur'an, Surah al-Maidah (5:8)

I know this might not interest you, but just to give an idea on how suicide bombing is NOT allowed in Islam. And that 72 virgins pretext is actually hilarious, why didn't the whole Islamic population suicide to get those 72 vergins?

 

[jussstin]

I know this might not interest you, but just to give an idea on how suicide bombing is NOT allowed in Islam.

Not at all, it's very interesting, thanks for pointing it out. I'm glad you did because now when I get into arguments with those stupid people that say all Muslims are violent extremists who want to blow themselves up for Allah, I can shut them up easier by pointing out those passages.

And that 72 virgins pretext is actually hilarious, why didn't the whole Islamic population suicide to get those 72 vergins?

Haha good point, perhaps because shortly after deflowering the 72 virgins there's going to be a lot of explaining to do (to at least 71 of them), and while the 72 virgins bit sounds interesting, having 72 angry women that want to cut your balls off in the aftermath is probably not so fun.

EDIT: Forgot to say I wasn't actually saying that there was anything in the Qu'ran that actually gave those instructions, (I haven't read it so probably am not qualified to comment) moreso that people use it as a justification for those acts.

 

[Dak]

True, but there is a slight difference. Hammers can be used to kill, but they don't provide the justification for murder like religion can. No-one has ever blown themselves up and destroyed others because a coping saw told them they would receive 72 wives and 80,000 servants in the afterlife. No-one has ever been tortured or murdered because a screwdriver said they were of an incorrect faith.

Yeah this is a reference to Islam. There are some minor similarities between the Bible and the Quran (like don't eat pork, don't murder, etc.) but that's about it.

I'm sure that peace probably wasn't an option. The fact that a God (or at least one of God's followers) demanded violence against followers of a different god was the problem I had with it.

If you go purely based off scripture and extra writings from the books of Enoch/Jasher, some of the inhabitants of the land were descendant from demons (The Nephalim/Rephaim). You can't understand an action unless you understand the assumed motive behind it. Ending demonic infested bloodlines was a pretty good reason (Assuming truth obviously).

I wasn't referring to the Torah, I was referring to the Bible in general being the guide for living for people. But anyway, the passage I quoted was in Deuteronomy. Isn't that part of the Torah?

Yeah, my accuracy was off. It is a part of the Torah (the first five books of the Bible), but is not part of the Law, which is often referenced seperately as Torah as well.

As far as heaven and hell are referenced, the Bible never says "good" people go to heaven forever. It says that the earth will eventually be cleansed and the "good" people get to stay, and the dead "good" people get brought back to live on the cleansed earth as well.

 

[Badbird]

You'd probably get more people responding to your threads if you put a bit more effort and thought into the initial post.

Compare:


...with ~Derek~'s original post in this thread. His post was well thought out, spell checked and actually asked a question which prompted further discussion. Perhaps try a 'Quality, not Quantity' approach to posting, rather than vice versa.

Well I got spell checked on the computer now, so I will make a post.

 

[jussstin]

If you go purely based off scripture and extra writings from the books of Enoch/Jasher, some of the inhabitants of the land were descendant from demons (The Nephalim/Rephaim).

That's interesting. Are there any descendants of the descendants of these demons around these days? Or were they successfully wiped out? How accurate would I be if I assumed they all looked like this?:

 

[Dak]

The only note the Bible makes about a difference in appearance was they were really big/tall, and some had six fingers/toes.

 

[Badbird]

I have a thread about politics and sports. We have great threads like this one... why not make one about politics and sports.

.

 

[Dak]

.

Stop advertising your threads in other threads. If people are interested they will post in it.

 

[cookiecutter]

Denying that music in any form is not an extremely powerful cultural force is naive. Lyrical messages in music often circumvent normal brain processing by combining with hypnotic beats, etc. Any student of the effects of music on the mind can tell you this.

I don't think I need to argue that religion is a vastly more influential cultural force than music.

Please read my post for more insight

I realize that it can be read differently, but I'm saying that it is quite possible that someone could easily read it as a justification for violence.

I'm from Tunisia, in North Africa, if you have any idea about Middetarrenian history, it was known as Carthage. It is way different than in the middle east due to colonization and other influences of other cultures (like the Turkish, French, Arabic and so on). Why did you ask ? haha

That was my second guess behind Turkey. I asked because you seemed like an intelligent, moderate muslim person and I was curious.

 

[hexwind]

That was my second guess behind Turkey. I asked because you seemed like an intelligent, moderate muslim person and I was curious.

Thanks, my grandfather is Turkish tho haha

 

[Peter Joseph]

Athletes are brainwashed into believing into the myth of religion. Most athletes tend to come from the South and Mid-West, home of social conservatives that tells us gay marriage is a sin. The link between coaches and the players is well though of as the anti-authority. Players look up to old guys who hate gays and believe in a guy that probably never was real.


Religion has damage our world and so has sports. Great combo isn't it? NOT.


Peter Joseph, The Greatest Story Ever Told-Zeitgeist.

 

[Pessimism]

How can you have a B.A. in biology and not believe in evolution (as I would assume that they don't)?

You would be surprised how many people can do this.