crossing over to metal drumming - tips please

[acidbasement]

I've been playing drums (rock, jazz-fusion, funk, reggae) for 14 years, but only listening to metal for 3 years. I want to play metal, and I'm looking for tips in crossing over - it's like learning a completely new instrument! I play at a professional level when I'm doing other styles, but I completely fall apart when I try to play metal. uke:

My most pressing issue: I recently got a double-kick pedal, and I find that my shins get very tired and sore if I keep up a fast beat for too long. Is this just a matter of building up endurance, or do I need to adjust something, for example the height of my seat (I'm currently a low rider)? I also play with heels down, but maybe I need to switch to heels up? Shoes vs. barefoot?

Any tips from drummers would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[nissan]

Alright, here we go

Most metal drumming is rather simple with the hands, and down under is where it gets more difficult - but I'm sure you've observed that already. So there are 4 major techniques on the pedal:

1 - Heel down - I'm sure you're already familiar with this one already lol. Anyway, heel-down has negatives (not loud enough, and fast-tiring) and posetives (composed, more intricate and controlbale.)

2 - Heel-up - This is the one most metal drummers use. It's a very good technique to use for constant double bass strokes. It is also reasonable loud, and feels much better. Speed-wise, I think this and heel-down are on par with each other, ultimately - ultimately both muscles groups end up twitching spuratically. Think about this and try to figure out what I'm talking about, because by the time you get really fast, you're not coordinating the strokes one-by-one anymore - you just put pressure (body weight) on the ankle and you basically twitch. Anyways, heel-up is much easier to maintain, but it's hard at first. Heel-down will feel easier because you're used to it, but once you get that twitching things going you'll see the difference - it's almost in exhaustible. The bad thing is that it's pretty hard to get the gastroc muscles (muscles group used in heel-up) on the two legs to coordinate alternating stroke in twitching fashion that I explained, but you'll get it eventually.

3 - Swivel - This is basically heel up, but it's a very clever trick to allow you to keep track of what your feet are doing - because a lot of the time you'll notice your feet are going out of synch with each other - this method fixes that. So basically you're doing alternating strokes with the two feet, but this is how it goes:

L (swivel to left) R (swivel to left) L (swivel to right) R (swivel to right) etc etc

4 - Heel-toe - I absolutely love this method!!!1111111 You do a stroke with your heel, and come up for the double with the toe. There's two ways to do it:

1. Start heel-up (heel stroke first), end heel-up (toe stroke first.)

2. Start heel-down (toes stroke first), end heel down (heel stroke second.)

I use the first as I find it much more convenient to me as I'm normally in the heel-up position. But you can make up your own mind.

Anyways, by the time you get good with this technique, your feet will be doing a rocking fashion movement.

Now here's the best advice you'll get from me today:

Combine all 4 techniques in your playing:

-Heel-down for intricate strokes, or really short-lasting but quick strokes.
-Heel-down for endurance at high speeds.
-Heel-toe is so versatile, you can do anything with it!
-Swivel is less needed than the rest, but it's not bad to use once in a while.

Hope that helped, and if you got any questions, please ask - I tend to not make sense!

 

[acidbasement]

Thanks a bunch - I'll try that stuff out. Any comments about the height of the throne? Mine is pretty low, and I think I might get better endurance if I raised it. Probably better for heels-up playing as well. I think I just answered my own question

 

[nissan]

Your seat should be set at a hight so when your gastrocs are as flexed as possible your leg is at a 90% angle. You want to put weight on the pedals, because heel-up's power relies on the force put on the leg as it comes back down... And at high speeds you can't manage to force your foot down everytime you go for a stroke - it relies on gravity to pull your foot back down to make the hit. So the more weight on the feet the beetter.

 

[nissan]

Another method I forgot to mentions is very similar to the heel-up, but instead your suspend both legs up about a few cm away from the pedal, and then you bounce to pedal up and down like a basketball with your toes. It's a pretty cool method... For this you definitely need your seat high up, because it will really take it out of your iliopsoas trying to lift your legs up if your seat is low.

 

[nissan]

Also there's an alternative method to the heel-toe you can use to do double strokes. It goes like this:

The idle/standard position is heel-up with your feet on the pedals, but the beater does not touch the head.

Then you flex your gastrocs fully to get to the ultimate heel-up - this applies the first stroke.

Now, you unflex your gastrocs and your foot begins to fall - while your foot is falling your beater comes off the head of the bass drum.

The next stroke is applied when your foot fully drops and forces the beater to hit the head again.

Then you return to the standard position and start the next round.

It's pretty hard to get down, but if you got big feet/small pedals, it can be a good alternative to heel-toe. Well, really it's the same thing but both strokes are done by the toes.

Anyways, good luck.

 

[genocide roach]

DONT LOSE YOUR JAZZ STYLE! alot of metal bands get stuck in the bare basics. but the great bands use the variety afforded by jazz training. the band all around will be better if you keep that style. but dont forget to add some blast beats every now and again hehe
~gR~

 

[nissan]

DONT LOSE YOUR JAZZ STYLE! alot of metal bands get stuck in the bare basics. but the great bands use the variety afforded by jazz training. the band all around will be better if you keep that style. but dont forget to add some blast beats every now and again hehe
~gR~

Good advice!

 

[MasterOLightning]

I always play heels up. Double bass simply takes time. No matter what method you use, expect 6-12 months to get pretty solid, depending on your practice habits. Right now, I can play 16ths at 140 for about 5 mins, but I don't really train myself for speed. I also sit rather low. Shoes always, preferably with a gym shoes with a hard sole, otherwise it's pretty hard on the arch muscles. A bad double bass pedal might set you back. What kind do you have. Also, practice different kinds of blastbeats: I prefer this style, more useful for black metal.
hh: x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
sd: -x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-
bd: x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x

You can probably play to faster songs with this one:
hh: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
sd: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
bd: x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x-

 

[acidbasement]

Wow, thanks for all the tips guys! I agree that the most interesting drummers tend to mix up their metal styles with other less typical tricks - Petter from Therion is so much fun to listen to for this reason. My pedal is a good one, a Pearl Eliminator - I found it to be my favourite single pedal, so I went with it in the switch up to double.
Ready to rock,
Iain