Dark Passion Play

[Liverslapper]

I miss tarja....


the new album was good, but its like tarja beeing replaced just isn't nightwish anymore...

i like how tarja has that opera like tone, which i loved very much, and to not have that anymore is disapointing...


anyone agree with me on this? I still like nightwish, but it feels like somethings missing..

 

[Nehebkau]

In my opinion, I have never been able to get into Nightwish with Tarja as the vocalist, I've listened to DPP and woah, Anette has an amazing voice, theirs something to it that, just flows with the music, almost melodic? Tarja had a dull singing voice/opera voice whatever imo. //waits for tarja fan boys to flame me

edit: just encase I do get flamed, I have to admit she does have a powerful voice, and it's very nice, but I don't find it fitting at all.

 

[x_blackangel_x]

In my opinion, I have never been able to get into Nightwish with Tarja as the vocalist

I'll have to agree with you. It took me a long time to get into just a few songs but you have to admit though, she has a very distinct voice and vocal technique. It's not everyday you find a women like that in a metal band...but yea, I prefer Anette's voice aswell. Can't wait to hear more from DPP.

 

[kingtoad]

I agree with the thread starter, 100%. Although I do like Anette's voice, the songs just don't have the "Nightwish feel" to me anymore.

 

[Ecaobia]

I still think that the instrumentals have the Nightwish feel to them. In a way, I am glad that Nightwish just didn't try to "replace" Tarja because it just would not be the same. I think Tuomas is taking the band to a whole new level by trying something this new. Plus, Anette does have an amazing voice.
In the end, Tuomas's message is really what matters. The music still conveys his ideas, and even though Anette may not be quite as good as Tarja was, she can still sing the poetry that Tuomas writes in a way that realy gets to the listeners.

 

[Zellie]

Yeah there is something that feels less "Nightwish" to me as well--and it's not just Anette. There is something missing from the drumming, from the guitars... the only song on there that really gives me that EPIC NIGHTWISH feeling is Poet and the Pendulum. Nightwish is one of the few bands that I could have listened to without ANY vocalist because the insturmentation is just so unique in most of their songs. Nothing is really standing out to me in these new songs, unfortunately :/

Haha! Tarja's voice didn't fit the music? Oh man, when I first heard Nightwish all I could think was "that's so BRILLIANT! Of COURSE only a powerhouse singer would be able to match the strength of metal music!" Besides sounding like most other female singers in metal, Anette's voice sounds small compared to the insturments....... though I guess if they'd kept the complexity and uniqueness of earlier songs she would even moreso fade into the background with a disappointing contrast.

 

[Tramz]

I am so mixed on Anette. I try to like her, and i kind of do like her, but i kind of don't. I flip flop a bit. I've said it many times but i'll say it again, i am not exactly a rabid Tarja fan, though i feel that she brought something to the sound, a certain sense of magic that Anette just doesn't. Still, i completely agree with Ecaobia that Tuomas' message is what it's all about. That and the emotion in his music. I certainly still count myself as a fan (it would be kind of funny if i didn't, no?) and i'm eager to see how they now come across live, and what the future will bring.

 

[Trogdor 666]

Well, considering I've called Tarja an overrated choir girl at times, it may seem hypocritical of me to talk poorly about Anette. The thing that made Tarja work with Nightwish is that she had a very powerful voice with very powerful music. Now, with Anette and DPP, I think DPP is one of the fiercest and most powerful Nightwish albums yet in terms of heaviness and orchestration, and I just don't think Anette keeps up. This isn't a slight to her, I think she could be a great pop/rock singer, but I don't feel she was the best choice for this style of music.

All that being said, I love Dark Passion Play. In a year of albums that I have loved by several of my favorite bands, I didn't have the highest hopes for this one, but Tuomas and the crew teach me once again why I fell so deeply in love with this band shortly before Once came out 3 years ago. I'm listening to Tuomas' past few years of frustration, anger and sadness come out in his music and I think that's what's more important in music than anything, the emotion. If Nightwish can keep making albums this good, I don't ever see my interest fading away. Ever.

 

[thegoreprincess]

I don't think it sounds completely "Nightwish". Anette's voice reminds me too much of Sharon den Adel's from Within Temptation.

 

[Tramz]

It's funny how people think Anette sounds like so many different vocalists. Our own C. thinks Anette sounds very much like Sabine from Edenbridge, and before her name was known, i could have sworn i knew who she was, simply because she sounded so much like essentially everyone. Personally i don't think she sounds a thing like Sharon OR Sabine.. just plain.

 

[Snowy Owl]

As for me...I have had a love/hate relationship with Nightwish in the past year and a half...

It has to do with many things...Tarja leaving, being oversaturated with their music for the longest time, Tarja's attitude, my failure to run OSA properly, focusing on my new webzine (which is doing well!)...a lot of things. I bought End of An Era a few weeks ago and STILL haven't watched it! Maybe because I partly miss the red and black leather clad metal frontwoman which was replaced by a diva who at times wears a dress that looks like a bumblebee!

As for Anette...have yet to even hear a syllable of her voice. I'm hoping she is good!

 

[Tramz]

I think you should make a point to watch it Snowy. You might find it useful in progressing your own personal attempt to end the era. It's not just another concert. There are clear indicators of what is to come after the concert. Tuomas for example, can be found crying during Ever Dream. It seems fitting, and is surely sympathetic to anyone still caught up in the emotional grip of those events.

I am surprised you have not heard any Anette. Not only was Eva released as a legal web single, but she has sung notes in at least one video interview legally hosted. Here's the link:

http://link.brightcove.com/services/link/bcpid909858640/bclid979307707/bctid1125877264

(If for some reason it doesn't take you there, just click on Musikk and scroll down till you see Tuomas face and click on that).

There is also the song that Tuomas and Marco did for a movie. Have you seen it? The video is on Youtube. I don't see how that is illegal to watch. The link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwTtDr5JPz4

 

[C.]

I wouldn't say she sounds exactly like Sabine, but I thought of her voice when I first heard Anette. Maybe it's because I had just reviewed the latest Edenbridge album and her voice was still on my mind, but if I had to compare her to another known singer in the femme-metal world, that's who I would say.

I would have to agree that Tarja brought something special to the table with her voice, but it's also known that the bullsh*t she brought along with it eventually outweighed the talent. Anette has a pretty voice, and I'm not going to judge Nightwish as a whole until I hear the entire (finished) album. However, I do notice that with Anette, just as I start to get into her voice, I hear another song that makes me have to begin all over again. I just hope the rest of the album does not do that to me.

 

[Snowy Owl]

Yeah, maybe it would help me heal over the loss of Tarja. It will be hard to see the excited young woman from FWTE replaced by the bossy snob who took her place (not Annette, but Tarja Turunen being replaced by Tarja Cabuli). It's been very hard for me to get over all that. Add that to her "stabbing the USA in the back" by refusing to tour here...Nightwish has fallen out of my favor in a big way. It hurts too, because that band touched my emotions in way music never had before. That's my thoughts on Tarja.

As for Annette...I have confidence she can do a nice job for the band. But, I do not listen to early clips of songs for many reasons (i.e. lack of production, low quality, a bad stream). I wait until I physically have a CD in my hand to make a judgement. If I can find it on iTunes it would also work!

Now if Nightwish can get off their butts and release the record so I don't have to wait no more!

 

[C.]

I understand what you mean Snowy, but that's why I think for me, the "bad favor" has fallen more with Tarja than for Nightwish. It's been made clear through several interviews and even the End of an Era DVD, that is was not the guys' choice to "stab the U.S. in the back". They wanted to come back. They wanted to make a genuine go at success here. It was Tarja who stopped them because she was not willing to stick it out and play smaller venues for a while here, with the hopes of getting more successful as the time went on. She expected the red carpets to be rolled out for her here like they do everywhere else. They didn't, because few people knew Nightwish here then, and she didn't want to play if she couldn't be Leader. With that attitude it's no surprise that things ended the way they did.

Either way, it looks like Nightwish is making good on their promises to us, and showing us that they value their fanbase here. The fact that we are getting the first leg of the tour (even if not the first show), to me, indicates this above anything else.

 

[KittyKatatonia]

I personally don't think the new album is worth all the hype it's getting at all. The new vocalist is talented enough, but her voice is nothing special and doesn't stand out like Tarja's did. Besides, ever since the band took away all the opera influences of their music and added in pop influences instead...I've been pretty unimpressed with anything they've done.

 

[C.]

Well, I always have found it either hilariously ironic or ironically hilarious that the more Nightwish incorporated orchestral elements in their music, the less they used of Tarja's opera voice. One would think the two would go better together, don't you?

 

[St Enigma]

I have followed the band's evolvement for years, almost from the beginnig, but really can't tell how many times Tuomas has underlined in numerous interviews that his idea of the band was, is and will be the music they make together. According to him the band is not about the individuals showing off their undoubtably vast talents and capabilities with their instruments - includung vocals - but to perform music as a tight unit.

In spring 2004 before the release of Once Tuomas remarkably stated in all interviews the fact that he wanted Tarja to be only one of the instruments in the band, nothing more. (Maybe she felt neglected because of that, who knows?)
Emppu is quite a wizard with his ESP, but his solos are limited to few and rare and only serving the composition in question. Everybody knows he could do more, but he has accepted his role in the band as Mr. Guitarwall and concentrates on making the best of it.
Jukka has said that he'd never want to play drum solos because there isn't much more boring things in music than a drum solo.

Marco, one of the most appreciated rock/metal musicians in Finland, has a double role in the band as bass player and second singer. Despite he knows his value very well, he says he never wanted any bigger role in Nightwish. His larger role as a singer on DPP doesn't mean the band would be heading towards increasing role of male vocals on the future releases. This time only some parts of certain lyrics were too personally pointed to Tarja and Marcelo, hence the guys felt that it'd be unfair to make Anette to do it, since she has nothing to do with the past incidents the lyrics refer to.

Tuomas has also always wanted to compose soundtracks for movies, hence his enthusiam towards using big orchestra and choir(s). If you think about it, the very first impact anyone gets from listenign to a Nightwish track, old or new, will be how big the sound is. Even on the first three records when they had no money to hire an orchestra, the distictive big sound of the band hits the listener like a sledgehammer. It'll be even more evident when you get to see tehm live. Very rare five-piece bands can match the overwhelming sound of early Nightwish, not to speak about the more recent output with a real orchestra. And by sound I don't mean decibels, but impression of the music and melodies in it.

For many musically uneducated people Tarja's classical singing became the clou of the band, but most times it only reflected the opinion of a musically illiterate person who couldn't hear the the music behind her poweful vocals. (I won't say her classical vocals, because I've been to Tarja's solo concert where she sung classical, and believe me, there is a difference!)

Personal tastes aside, clinical observing of the structures in Tuomas's compositions from the musical and technical point of view will easily reveal us that we are not dealing with ordinary consumer music. Calling Nw pop(pish) really doesn't make any justice, but only shows the critics' ignorance and lack of deeper knowledge in music. Pop is something easy listening on the background while doing something more important, it doesn't take a brain to observe details or understand the lyrics (if they make any sense at all) and the song usually vanishes from the listener as soon as the last tones disappear, without leaving anything to recall later.

Dark Passion Play is a something you rather want to play in quality player, concentrate on and work through several times, preferably with lyric sheet in your hands before it'll fully open to you. Anette is an excellent singer who can really sing in many various styles and express deep emotions when needed. But she isn't Tarja, she is Anette and there is a difference in overall singing style between the two. But not in quality, no way.

Also, there are so many details in the music, that even after numerous listens one will discover something new on every spin. That is the thing which separetes consumer pop from more sophisticated music.

Anyone's personal taste and musical preferences will be sources for a completely different story.

 

[seraph7]

Enigma, if you don't mind I'd like to ask you a bit about this, as you always seem to knw a great deal about what is going on in the NW world.

When you say Tarja's voice is different to how she sings in her classical concerts what do you mean? Is her technique different? The tone of her voice? I've only heard snippets of her classical stuff on Youtube and having got her Xmas album and listened to it I was curious.
I was under the impression that she was aiming for a classical career. That was what her and Marcelo wanted. Obviously not. It just seems a shame to throw away the chance of working with a band going places to be the next disposable crossover classical diva. There are hordes of these type of singers clogging the classical charts and while they have sales, they aren't taken that seriously. For what it's worth , I think her voice is too good to be dismissed as 'this year's Charlotte Church' and then forgotten about.

I always wondered about how the other members of the bands felt as they are all talented in their own fields but I really don't think they get the recognition for it that they deserve frankly . It must have very galling to have to play second fiddle to someone who doesn't want to be part of the band and whose actions seem to to wind up the fans and to destroy what they worked so hard to do.

Even now, all the press I've read about the band seems to focus on how are they going to back to what they were without her. As if the guys didn't work just as hard for their success.....

I'll always remember how Kerrang interviewed Tarja and asked her how she wrote 'Nemo'

 

[C.]

I have listened to bootlegs of Tarja's classical performances, and I have to say also, there is a difference! I'm not musically educated enough to explain what or how that is, but there is a difference. She did her best to bring as much of that classical voice as she could within Nightwish, and that will always be part of their legacy. You know it is Tarja when you listen to the classical recordings, but the delivery is different, the feel...I can't explain it.

But I do also agree that judging from what little I've heard of her solo efforts outside of Nightwish, she doesn't seem to be utilizing the classical side of her voice as much as she did in earlier Nightwish works. It does almost seem a waste that for all her struggles to "break free" of Nightwish and become an identity outside of it, that it would only go to making similar music or more watered-down versions of what Nightwish did.