Death - The sound of perseverance

[anonymousnick2001]

TSOP is like a populist and confused Coroner. That's exactly what it is with lead guitar emphasis a la the prevailing Swedes of the time tossed in.

I agree with you here. I seem to have igored the Coroner argument all along. I'm not familiar with the band, and I checked them out a little. From what I heard, there is some similarity.

However, Death had the lead guitar emphasis since ITP. Symbolic came out just as the whole Swedish melodic style was taking off.

To argue that TSOP doesn't sound like Cynic of the 80s is totally absurd though. Those demos were ripped off on "Human", and face it, TSOP is "Human" spliced with rock & roll with extra noodling on the side.

I think Human sounds much more like Cynic than TSOP. I just pulled out Focus today and listened real hard. I hear such a similarity between the riffing style of Human and Focus. It's hard to pick out because Focus switches to the ambient interludes and jazz style at the drop of a hat, but the main heavy riffs in Veil Of Maya reek of Suicide Machine, and the guitar leads in Textures sound like a lot of the ones in Cosmic sea and Flattening Of Emotions and Suicide Machine.

I think both bands influenced each other a lot, and the similarities you hear are the remnants of that influence. TSOP does have some rocknroll elements, like the song Bite The Pain, and obviously, Painkiller.

But Flesh And The Power It Holds is an 8-minute epic. It has a very linear sprawl to it, although the riffs are similar throughout. One could argue that it's due to the noodling, but I sense a definite point A and point B in that song. Also, many songs on TSOP don't have a verse and chorus. They repeat one time, like Scavenger Of Human Sorrow, if I'm not mistaken. Or it's like Spirit Crusher, where there s a chorus, but no conventional song structure. It's like intro-verse-noodling-chorus-noodling-verse-noodling-verse-chorus solo-chorus-noodling-outro. Not conventional in my book.

I see what you're saying, but I really do think that the comparison is being stretched quite a bit. It's like saying Cryptopsy sound like Led Zeppelin. Some things are the same, but others are quite different.

But the melodies and riffs still kick ass! Ha! Hehehe.

Oh, so true.

 

[Demiurge]

I'm with the now defunct PE on this one, putting superfluous riffs between verses and choruses doesn't change the structure significantly.

"Focus" is similar to Death in that it's technical and the bands have swapped members. Compositionally it leans toward jazz as opposed to metal. The similarities are superficial.

 

[Planetary Eulogy]

Now defunct? I think not.

 

[SculptedCold]

The worm turns! Ha! *ahem* sorry. =)

 

[Episteme]

*sigh*

Everyone has their own opinion on their structure of music blah blah blah blah technical jargon nonsensical shit. I like Watchtower, I like Cynic, I like Atheist, I haven't heard much Coroner(but I shall try them), and I like Death.

I love TSOP, I love Focus, I love Human, I love Piece of Time etc etc etc. I have no idea how you think your "facts" are really "facts" as they are just another person's opinion of music that's been fed to you over and over again enough to make you go on and on and on. I don't care of TSOP has a bad circular structure, it's my favourite Death album as far as it goes. Music is music, you either like it or you don't, and if you don't think it's good, state your opinion because there are no true facts.

What you have been fed through out your life is like Chinese Whispers, so yeah.

I really don't care what you say about TSOP, I think it's a kickass album with kickass riffs and none of your technical jargon is going to make me like it any less.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

I really don't care what you say about TSOP, I think it's a kickass album with kickass riffs and none of your technical jargon is going to make me like it any less.

Yeah, man. I bet if Demiurge listed his favorite albums or bands, we could all go on for hours about how it's theoretically bullshit and a rip off this and that and whatnot. If he liikes it, he likes it. We can't convince him otherwise.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

The inactivity pretty much proves that I and the Death fans pretty much pwned this argument.

Drinks all around!

 

[bloody_trooper]

amazing album... nuff said

spirit crusher rocks, and the judas priest cover is insane


....in reference to the first post....death is NOT thrash

 

[anonymousnick2001]

I agree on all counts.

 

[SculptedCold]

No-one controlled the argument here, don't be so cocky man. Most of Demiurge's and Eulogy's arguments were valid, it just so happens that more people just plain enjoy the music to care about how ideologically or structurally insignificant it may turn out to be.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

Most of Demiurge's and Eulogy's arguments were valid, it just so happens that more people just plain enjoy the music to care about how ideologically or structurally insignificant it may turn out to be.

Eulogy's arguments were valid. He was claiming that the album had too much of an influence from Coroner and Cynic to be hailed as strikingly original as it is. I conceded to that. He also claimed the album had circular structure. I disagreed with him about that. In the end, I figured that the album may be circular, but at the same time, in a different manner with different song structures than usual, and some linear pieces.

Demiurge was almost completely foolish. The words "in your opinion" mean nothing to him. And he claimed that TSOP was pop music and completely idiotic wanking and nothing more because it had circular structure and "stole" Atheists's style. Uh...no.

In the end, no one likes the album any less, so we(the fans) won.

 

[Demiurge]

You use the word(actually, it's not a word) "pwned" far too often. It's very annoying.

You have no idea when to quit. I stopped posting in this topic because I tired of the discussion, you're an idiot, and I cannot think of anything I could possibly gain from our correspondence. I learned long ago that it's difficult if not impossible to embarrass a fool, so attempts to humiliate you would likely prove to futile. Now I see that you've claimed some fatuous victory. For some reason, you assumed that so long as people continued to post I would respond though nothing of consequence was uttered. Clearly, you were mistaken.

My argument is so simple that even a subsimian, failed abortion such as yourself should be able to understand it. TSOP isn't original, it's nearly entirely derivative of several other bands. The album sucked because it was composed of circular death-rock with a terrible excess of disruptive noodly sections. You really understand where these pseudo-artists are coming from when you read their self-absorbed, mawkish lyrics.

You stupid fuck, if you take a circular song, and insert an extended bridge, it's still a circular song. Repeat after me, verse/chorus music is circular... This is not the least bit complicated.

Planetary Eulogy, for some reason, when I posted that, your account seemed to be invalid. Since it clearly is not, my apologies.

If I posted my favorite music, it would be far more difficult to criticize than Death's TSOP.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

I didn't realize subsimian life forms dealt with abortion as an issue. I've yet to see a pro-choice beaver.

You stupid fuck, if you take a circular song, and insert an extended bridge, it's still a circular song. Repeat after me, verse/chorus music is circular... This is not the least bit complicated.

You're right. I get it. It's not complicated. However, you stated earlier that circular albums are fun and not transcendental. B-b-b-bullshit!

BTW, Flesh And The Power It Holds is linear in composition.

You really understand where these pseudo-artists are coming from when you read their self-absorbed, mawkish lyrics.

Mawkish? Sounds like something from LOTR.

All kidding aside, I can't possibly see how an album dedicated to a theme of trumping opposition and rising through perseverance is at all self-absorbed. It's more of a lets-try-and-motivate-others vibe if you ask me.

If I posted my favorite music, it would be far more difficult to criticize than Death's TSOP.

I highly doubt that.

PWNED, MUTHAFUCKA!

 

[Demiurge]

What are you? The Jerry Seinfeld of metal BBs? "So the funny thing is, yesterday, some guy called me a subsimian, failed abortion. Now is it me or do subsimian creatures not have abortions?"(cue laugh track). Say something important or shut up.

Ugh, I just took another look at the lyrics, apparently, you cannot read. They look like fucking Radiohead wrote them.

Circular music is structurally limited, it's rooted in simple rock & roll. Linear structures are far less limiting, the composer has much more range, if you will, to work within. Circular structures nearly always reveal themselves to be tedious and predictable over a period of extended listening.

That song isn't exactly embedded in my mind. The band tried to disguise their structures. For example, a song would begin verse/chorus, then there would a different riff pattern, then they'd go back to verse/chorus.

 

[SculptedCold]

You're right. I get it. It's not complicated. However, you stated earlier that circular albums are fun and not transcendental. B-b-b-bullshit!

Well y'know, exactly. Sure, a circular structure is limited in comparison to a linear one, but that doesn't exclude the possibility of a circular composition being profound or effective in some other way. I mean cummon, there's a lot more to music than only structure. Thinking otherwise is simply retarded.

BTW, Flesh And The Power It Holds is linear in composition.

I would have said so. The song does feature a lengthy chorus section that is repeated about twice, but the vast majority of the song refers outwith the chorus, and doesn't rely on it.

All kidding aside, I can't possibly see how an album dedicated to a theme of trumping opposition and rising through perseverance is at all self-absorbed. It's more of a lets-try-and-motivate-others vibe if you ask me.

Heh, if you ask me, that is the sort of theme that comes from self-absorption and egoism. Haven't you ever heard of god complexes? =)

Personally, i've always found Death's lyrics arrogant and presumptuous. Preachy lyrics are ok man, I mean, if you're writing music and you want to carry through a definite message, that's cool.....but most of the time Chuck's lyrics were just childish.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

"You know so much about nothing at all."

Sounds more like a mocking, satirical tone to me. Especially if the song's called Th e Philospher.

"So you've come far across the sea to spread your written brand of misery."

I see many ways to interpret that one. Although written before 9/11, it's an interesting parallel. I'm not a very good at lyrical analysis, but I fail to see that as childish.

I think we can forgive him for sCream Bloody Gore's lyrics, considering he was a nearly a child at the time.

Ugh, I just took another look at the lyrics, apparently, you cannot read. They look like fucking Radiohead wrote them.

Not quite. But, then again, I was never really let down by Radiohead's lyrics, anyway.

Circular structures nearly always reveal themselves to be tedious and predictable over a period of extended listening.

B-b-b-bullshit!

 

[Episteme]

Exactly what's wrong with Radiohead's lyrics?!

 

[anonymousnick2001]

Apparently only Demiurge knows.

 

[DoReMi]

There are a lot of smart people on this board. Why waste your time with this frustrated fucking cum-shot of a person? With every reply of his I've read, he tries to make his insults sound as cutting as possible by attempting to sound excessively bright or intelligent. Instead, he just comes across as a sad fucking wanker who would get the shit kicked out of him if ever he started shooting off such a mouth in front of real people. Don't get me wrong, he seems like a smart guy, but he clearly has little to no friends if this is how he spends his time.

Let's just let bygones be bygones, admit to ourselves that Demiurge is a prick, and that we all love The Sound of Perseverence.

And what kind of cunt talks like that anyway (Gervaise, 2003)? I've noticed you've been using dictionary.com more often than most, Demiurge, because some of the words you use just don't glu together...

Trademark reasoning of Nazis and Goths; those whom express their intellectual views by deeming themselves superior with the use of an extensive vocab.

Fuck off and stop wasting the time of people who understandably wish to protect the merits of an incredible band.

I think Snow Like Ash said it best:

A scenario that I see all too often on metal boards. The Elitist/Nazi (who is undoubtedly an anus.com devotee) comes in and trashes an album cherished by fans. Cutting through his jargon and obscure references, you will realize his argument is either:

a. I don't like it because it doesn't suit my personal taste.
b. I don't like it because other people like it.

 

[DoReMi]

Haha. Jewboy. If by jewboy you mean somebody with better nordic roots than yourself who was raised Lutheran, than fine. If you guys are nazis I wonder if you all have blonde hair and blue eyes as I do. Or if your blood is even pure at all. Fucking parasites. I also hope your not under the impression that Chuck was jewish. For some reason a lot of people think that's true. He's actually of German/Catholic descent. 14/88 Fuckers.

Hahaha! The only members of the Arian race that are left are stranded on an island somewhere and about as inbred as you could possibly get.

Fuckin' nazis...