Geez... It seems like everyone who adds me on MySpace is Death-core?!

[_Brutalism_]

To be honest, I think a lot of the hate towards this "death-core" scene is mainly brewed from the looks and fads from its followers.

I for one like certain death-core bands...but I hate the catagory name. Today, any extreme music with a breakdown has to have a -core allotted to it. I personally think that if any bands from the golden era that incorporated groove to their sound came out today, they'd be labelled with some kind of -core to their genre name.
The interesting thing to note in my opinion is that if a random listener who had NO IDEA of what a deathcore/hardcore scene kid would look like, he would listen to it from a fresh perspective. That is the case with me. I live in a country where metal doesn't have a very big scene at all, I'm talking numbers below a thousand, and if you had to cut out the trendies, well you'll be left with a roomfull. Anyway, I happen to like this type of sound and find it appealing to my ears, but luckily for me, I am geographically disjointed from anything resembling a -core scene which would actually be noticable. This way, I happened to only care about the music, not who is making it. Of course, with some research, it became evident that this music was aimed at an audience of debatable class and knowledge of metal. Just looking at the way these people react at shows - slam dancing being the most protuberant proof, I just shook my head with disgust.

I think that the image when conjoined with the music is really playing an influence on its critisism, which in my eyes doesn't do the music justice. HOWEVER, since the creators of the music in question are emerging from the same background as its shameful trend community, it throws me into a dilemma whether it should be supported or not. But then again, if one had to base his opinion on the music on 1) the personality of the musician, 2) the looks of the musician, 3) the mainstream audience and all that breeds within it, then everyone's musical preference would be narrowed quite considerably.

 

[Metaltastic]

Breakdowns and groove sections are NOT the same things.

 

[spioraid]

Breakdowns and groove sections are NOT the same things.

Agreed. I've always considered melodic/groove sections to be part of a "post" genre and breakdowns usually in connection with a "core".

Of course in this instance we're talking NWBSHM, so it's essence is melody/groove in it's application. Post-NWBSHM would sound kinda silly.

 

[Ermz]

I love how Meshuggah have been able to straddle the border of the 'true metal' and 'core' genres yet still stay unique and never subscribe to that fashion-based, core mentality. Yet at the same time they influence just about every 'groove' core band out there. They're always my guiding beacon in how to have a groove-based djent band and not need some screamo twink/bear screamer/growler faggot combo on top ruining the whole thing.

 

[abyssofdreams]

I think this subgenre or whatever you may call it as well as any other subgerne lacks individuality.
I don't mind a good deathcore or whatever band and I certainly do not care what they look like or what they wear or how they pose.
Granted, it can look stupid but it's the music I often find boring, simply because 90% of that genre copies each other.
Same goes for blackmetal, brutal death, modern thrash, melodic death and so on...same thing.

 

[_Brutalism_]

Breakdowns and groove sections are NOT the same things.

Fair enough, but sometimes the only thing distinguishing one from the other is a very thin line.

For example, a song that comes to mind is Sepultura's Dead Embryonic Cells. I would call the interlude towards the end a breakdown because of its build up, tempo and execution. However, some might not agree. But what's the point in being so pedantic about something which is meant to elicit emotion and energy? Too many people today don't like this band or that because of stupid reasons like this. Now, it is very evident that -core labelled bands are called so because they RELY on the breakdown as a part of every song structure to pidgeonhole themselves in their subgenre. But don't you think it goes a little too far? The way metal fans have formed rifts within the genre because of this nitpicking?

 

[Metaltastic]

I don't think so - to me breakdowns embody emotions that I can't stand, I find them very base and juvenile in their lame attempt to be "heavy" and "br00tal" (when in fact no fucking slow chugging crap could EVER be more brutal than, say, the riff at 3:10 in Decapitated's "The Negation" HOLY SHIT HOLY SHIT - not to mention EVERYTHING Behemoth ever does). My definition of a breakdown can be summed up in two words - tempo change. When everything stops, you have the stupid hi-hat counting off, or just one guitar going "duhduh, duhduh WEEDEEDEE" (the latter being some horrible dissonant chord), ugghh, DO NOT WANT.

The point of all this is that breakdowns and the attitude of them are perfectly valid reasons to me for not liking a genre IMO, just as, say, outbursts like "OH YEAH BITCH GET DOWN AND SUCK MAH DONG NIGGAAAAA" are valid reasons for people not liking modern gangsta rap

 

[Metaltastic]

By the way, I should mention that I LOVE Job for a Cowboy's "Genesis," because they purged all the pig squeals and breakdowns of "Doom" (which I can't stand), and made just a solid fucking death metal album (though I don't like how almost every song starts with like 2 bars of guitars/drums, then the vox come in). Especially track 9, "The Divine Falsehood," which is honestly one of the greatest songs I've heard in a LONG time, it reminds me A LOT of Behemoth and Dimmu, and just has such fucking awesome chords and ambience, it really stands very uniquely on the album, as no other songs are quite like it IMO, and I really recommend checking it out!

 

[_Brutalism_]

When everything stops, you have the stupid hi-hat counting off, or just one guitar going "duhduh, duhduh WEEDEEDEE" (the latter being some horrible dissonant chord), ugghh, DO NOT WANT.

i.e. the example I gave you, Dead Embryonic Cells (except its a china doing the counting off).

The point is, riffs like that DOES NOT mean the band is hardcore. I totally understand the disdain you have towards breakdowns because today they are representative of some kind of wanna-be machismo but in my opinion that is more of a cultural thing (as you mentioned gangsters and all this).

But I think people are totally disregarding it as a tool in a musical piece to make the structure more dynamic and looking at it as a lame attempt at heaviness.

The root of the problem, the way I see it, is that the idea of a tempo change for an epic vibe or something of the sort has been overused and overdone repeatedly by bands of the hardcore genre.

The same is to be said about the blast beat. It has been incorporated into hardcore with the growl from death metal to create DEATHcore. But does that mean that the origin of the idea should be hated because it has been rehashed and perverted into something which is uke:.

As I asserted before, I like certain deathcore bands, I don't want to give the wrong impression of being a hypocrite, but yes, breakdowns, growls and blastbeats have become part of the trend creating this:

Breakdowns+Blastbeats+Growls = Deathcore = Gay picture shown above.

Now, what I think is wrong is that the single entities that have become the elements which shout out "DEATHCORE" have origins way beyond it have their own history and uses before this genre was created. I don't see anything wrong with change or trying to create something new, but the gripe I share with most of you is that it has been a perfect concoction to create a trend of the Br00talz kids who regard all those 3 as being associated with their look. At the end of the day, though, anything can become corrupted by trends. Just look at the so-called resurgence of thrash. You have bands who are trying to make a breakthrough to revive it yet modernise it with originality and you have those who are trying to jump on the bandwagon. Needless to say, this caused a tumult with those kids who wanted something new to fit in to, and here come horde of "fans" who have no idea what they are representing.