Going For Gojira

[GameFreac]

why can't it just be heavy metal? There's so many sub-genres these days that it's pointless to even try and group bands into them.

Because Gorgoroth and Edguy don't sound the same

Grow up and get with the times.

 

[waif]

^that. Seriously.

 

[DE4life]

Because Gorgoroth and Edguy don't sound the same

Grow up and get with the times.

that's not even an argument i'm willing to take seriously... sometimes I think the general perception of most metal fans being thick as shit is actually true.

 

[stardrowned]

tech death grind face blood yoyoma metal, lol

Seriously though, forget about In Flames if you dislike nu-metal (or whatever you wanna call it). So, what are they going to play from the old stuff? The Hive? Zombie Inc? Not worth it if those are going to make up 2% of the setlist.

As this thread says, go for Gojira. They're fucking amazing. Can't get enough of them lately. From Mars to Sirius is a masterpiece. Also got their latest, The Way of All Flesh. Needs a couple of more listens but I definitely see the potential.

Beat your feet on the ground now, go!

 

[Ross]

i hate new in flames, TJR, Colony, clayman, Lunar strain, subtereanean, whoracle and YES R2R are the ones to listen to
i like it yes......its something different

AND GOJIRA FUCKING RULE, M2S is an insane album (backbone, 1 of the greatest tracks ever) and TWOAF is also awesome

 

[Clay-Man]

It's definitely not melodic death metal, but it's not really nu-metal. It's alt metal.
And if anyone says it transcends genre I'm going to fall out of my chair laughing.

Melodeath mixed with alternative, now fall out laughing.

 

[waif]

Falling out.
There's a distinction between melodic death metal and melodeath, btw. But I don't hear the melodic death metal on STYE or R2R. It's just not fucking there.

 

[Veenox]

What's the deal with melodeath vs melodic death metal? I was always under the impression that they're the same thing.

 

[Clay-Man]

Since when the fuck did Linkin park have any fucking melody in the guitars?

That's a really asshole claim. I mean seriously. R2R was still crammed with melodies. Some of the guitar riffs and format were more alternative metal appealing but there were still the melodic death metal riffs In Flames were known for.

Even on STYE it had some melodic parts.
F(r)iend's "solo" (more like a bridge) sounded like an oldschool In Flames riff to me. Just because there's other shit thrown in doesn't mean something isn't there. Like what if you were in a crowd of different people, does that mean you're not there? No. My balls just fell off.

 

[DE4life]

You haven't really explained why, you've just thrown around an insult - presumably to cover up the fact that you don't have one. I thought his argument was pretty good:

1. X and Y within the broader grouping of 'metal' are extremely different; therefore
2. It is entirely appropriate to distinguish between them and other sub-groups.

Anything after Clayman is not death metal. Melodic or otherwise. I personally think it's part of the 'nu-metal' evolution. It's certainly NOT heavy metal. Does it sound ANYTHING like Black Sabbath?

Personally, it just reminds me of a heavier/slightly more complex take on Linkin Park. You take Linkin Park, make it a bit heavier and stick scream/light growl in the VERSE but NOT the chorus and bam you've got post-Clayman In Flames.

First he throws in Edguy and Gorogroth, then you throw in Linkin park. It's not even worth arguing with opinions like this. You're just.... wrong.

Btw, I will explain myself if I must, but I am a little surprised it is necassary.

 

[DE4life]

You still don't understand. He was throwing in Gorgoth andEdguy to justify his argument that metal is so diverse that you cannot simply just call something heavy metal and be done with it. THAT is meaningless nowdays. He wasn't comparing those bands to In Flames.

As for Linkin Park, like I said in the above post, sure In Flames have (increasingly less) guitar melodies. But for me the verse-chorus-verse-chorus-bridge structure, clean vocal chorus focus - with simply rhythmic interludes- takes it much closer to nu-metal than anything else. And like I also said, it's still heavier and more complex than most nu-metal. That's not saying much though.

You guys are really touchy

I don't mean to come off as touchy... i've just been involved with so many arguments about in flames being 'nu-metal' over the years that i guess I have a short fuse when it comes to this stuff.

The problem with bringing in gorgoroth and edguy was that they have no relevence to what I was talking about - In Flames and Reroute to Remain. Neither band is in the same genre or has any relevence to my argument that R2R is just straight up heavy metal, or melodic metal. I don't think it needs to be classified in any other way, and it's definately not nu-metal or alternative metal. Very few people who listened to Nu/Alt. metal listened to in Flames in 2002.

The verse-chorus-verse-bridge-chorus thing has more to do with pop or rock music than nu-metal. Nu-metal is a metal expansion of pop, essentially. R2R is not in that category, and to even compare it to anything Linkin Park have ever done is just wrong on many levels. if you were talking about STYE, maybe there'd be a little more reason for comparison.

 

[DE4life]

Yeah, like I said RTR retained some of the old melodic guitar elemets that sets it apart to some degree.

But I think there's a very strong case to be made for STYE-era being nu-metal. And you admitted yourself that the style and structure of their newer stuff has more to do with pop/rock before saying that nu-metal is a metal expansion of pop! Therefore, if In Flames are a metal band using pop/rock styles then that pretty much slots right into your definition of nu-metal.

So I think there are many grounds to compare it with Linkin Park. Sure, it's heavier. Sure, it's more complex. Sure, they sometimes use melodic guitars although this is slowly dying. And there's no doubt it's better than Linkin Park. But the fundamental structure, style, purpose and nature of the music (that is, basically, a pop-driven catchy chorus delivery mechanism, with rhythmic interludes) really is the same which, in my opinion, really puts in broadly in the same genre.

I think the problem a lot of people have is that they don't like to be seen as liking nu-metal, but they still like the new In Flames. So they desperately try to argue that it isn't nu metal when I think it would just be more healthy to acknowledge that it is a much higher standard of nu-metal (which it is, really, even if I dont particularly like it) to set it apart. But you clearly don't agree with me so that's neither here nor there

Structure is only one part of the music, though. Reroute really doesn't have many nu-metal elements other than perhaps structurally on some songs. The guitar tones and muddy production perhaps lend themselves to nu metal a little, but IMO most of it is just people searching for elements of the music to link it to nu-metal however they can.

STYE... well, who gives a shit about that album anyway?

I wouldn't say CC or ASOP are nu/alt. metal though, regardless of their structure.

For the record, I like some of Linkin park and Slipknot, but I wouldn't group either in the same category as In Flames (other than STYE, maybe). They're just not similar enough.

 

[Veenox]

Furious George, certainly has a point, but as DE4Life, structure alone can't classify In Flames as nu metal. Lets do a shitty little comparison:

Korn:
Guitars as atmosphere
Prominent use of pedal effects
No solos
Bass as driving force of the music
Hip-hop drumming
Clean/growled vocals
"Poor me" lyrical content

Recent In Flames:
Melodic guitars
Solos
Typical use of bass
Metal drumming
Vocals as main driving force of the music
Clean/screamed vocals
"Poor me" lyrical content

Based on the empirical evidence obtained through this comparison P), I'd say that while recent In Flames contains some elements of nu-metal, they don't share enough elements with the genre to be classified as such.

 

[waif]

What's the deal with melodeath vs melodic death metal? I was always under the impression that they're the same thing.

Melodic death metal is legit death metal with melody a la At The Gates, Dismember, Dark Tranquility, etc. The old school stuff, and also stuff like the Black Dahlia Murder, Amon Amarth, and Paths of Possession.

Melodeath is this sorta extreme melodic metal with strong power metal influences - wintersun, kalmah, children of bodom, etc.

That's a really asshole claim. I mean seriously. R2R was still crammed with melodies. Some of the guitar riffs and format were more alternative metal appealing but there were still the melodic death metal riffs In Flames were known for.

Even on STYE it had some melodic parts.
F(r)iend's "solo" (more like a bridge) sounded like an oldschool In Flames riff to me. Just because there's other shit thrown in doesn't mean something isn't there. Like what if you were in a crowd of different people, does that mean you're not there? No. My balls just fell off.

Having melody doesn't make you melodic death metal. And having one melodic death metal riff doesn't make you melodic death metal.

If you're in a crowd of different people, that doesn't mean you're not there, but it also doesn't mean the crowd is all like you. You fail at analogies.

 

[Clay-Man]

Melodic death metal is legit death metal with melody a la At The Gates, Dismember, Dark Tranquility, etc. The old school stuff, and also stuff like the Black Dahlia Murder, Amon Amarth, and Paths of Possession.

Melodeath is this sorta extreme melodic metal with strong power metal influences - wintersun, kalmah, children of bodom, etc.



Having melody doesn't make you melodic death metal. And having one melodic death metal riff doesn't make you melodic death metal.

If you're in a crowd of different people, that doesn't mean you're not there, but it also doesn't mean the crowd is all like you. You fail at analogies.

It's not "one melodic death metal riff". MDM melodies are laced within songs.

 

[waif]

If there's 10 of you in a crowd of 1000, it's not a crowd of you.
Also, I'm dubious of your notion of what constitutes a melodic death metal melody. As far as I can tell you consider anything that's even vaguely melodic to be tr00 melodic death metal.

 

[Clay-Man]

Oh yes I consider CKY to be melodeath.


Wow listen to some of the melody lines in R2R it's THE SAME FUCKING STRUCTURE as what In Flames usually used.

 

[GameFreac]

I always thought melodeath was just short for Melodic Death Metal

WTF?

 

[Clay-Man]

it IS short for melodic death metal.

WeAreInFlames is just making a shitheaded ape claim again.

 

[stardrowned]

You guys need to work on your genres.