How do you choose your multi-band comp crossover freqs ?

[akarawd]

Hi guys,

I've asked this in the "Collective Questions for Andy Sneap" forum, but I know Andy's a busy man and I'd love to get other opinions too. I mainly use the McDsp ML4000 for an ever so subtle multi-band compression (.5 dB or so on all bands but the bass region) on my master fader, because I've found it gives the mix that little extra "life", even if a mix sounds really great.

So, how do you choose your crossover freqs ? Do you A/B using your favorite reference by checking the octaves ratio on your freq analyzer ? Finally, is there a pattern we should be looking for between octaves ?

Thanks in advance,
akarawd

 

[lolzgreg]

This is a great question. The honest answer is I really have no idea. I would assume one would either use their ears or a spectral analyzer to detect the problem frequencies and set thge boundaries of the MBC accordingly. Use your ears is basically the best answer for anything. I wish I could have been more helpful.

 

[Ermz]

I already know what I want to be compressing before I even turn the plug-in on. The rest is fine tweaking done by listening.

 

[akarawd]

Thanks for your answers guys.

btw; I'm not using the MBC to correct stuff or anything, the mix usually sounds like it's already there. It's just that it gives it that little extra and I go by ear too.

 

[Glenn Fricker]

Please post this kind of question in "Production tips."


Help keep this fourm great.

 

[nwright]

If you have a MB comp plugin now, call up one of the presets and see where the crossovers are located. usually the name of the preset can help guide you one why the crossover points are where they are. Generally, if I use MB compression on a mix, I kinda know what I wanna do with it before I start. If it's thrown on the master buss or in the mastering chain, I use my ears but also study some frequency analyzation results to see if compression is what I want to do. On units like the TC Finalizer Express (I own one), the crossovers are fixed, but kinda apply to what the ear "likes" as it is. Heck, If you get on Izotopes site, they have a nice big document about Ozone, and the related stuff that goes with it...A lot of what is talked about is kinda universal, and IIRC, it's written by Bob Katz...Perhaps checking out the MB comp. chapter would be a help.

http://izotope.com/products/audio/ozone/guides.html

Specifically:

Setting Multiband Cutoffs
So where do you set the bands? In general, you want to try to split your mix so that each region captures a prominent section of your mix. For example, the strategy behind the default band cutoffs is as follows:
Band 1: This band is set from 20 to 120 Hz, to focus on the “meat” of the bass instruments and kick drum.
Band 2: Band 2 extends from 120 Hz to 2.00 kHz. This region usually represents the fundamentals of the vocals and most midrange instruments, and can represent the “warmth” region of the mix.
Band 3: Band 3 extends from 2.00 kHz to 10 kHz, which usually can contain the cymbals,upper harmonics of instruments, and the sibilance or “sss” sounds from vocals. This is the region that people usually hear as “treble”.
Band 4: Band 4 is the absolute upper frequency range, extending from 10 kHz to 20 kHz. This is usually perceived as “air”.
Keeping in mind that instruments have harmonics that can extend over several octaves, the goal is to try to partition your mix into bands. Play your mix, and click on the “M” button on each of the bands. This mutes the output of that band. Now you can hear exactly which frequencies are contained in each band. Try adjusting the band cutoffs by dragging them with the mouse. (Note that because of the analog design of the filters it will take a half second for the cutoff filter to adjust to the new cutoff).

 

[akarawd]

@ OzNimbus : My apologies, I had no intention not to abide by the rules of the forum, I'm still asking myself why on earth I didn't post it there. Will be more careful about it.

@ nwright : Thanks a bunch man, your info is precious. I will study it thoroughly and get back with more questions/answers.

If other people would like to contribute, it would be great.

Regards,
akarawd

 

[Morgan C]

I've never really thought about this much (but then I don't multiband much on the master). If its for bass guitar then you can really treat it like a comp/EQ in one. If its for the master fader.. I've got a 5band so I usually go 0-100Hz (or whatever makes up 'the subs'), 100-350Hz (the low mids, boominess on guitar/toms/bass, etc.), 350Hz-1500Hz (mids, guitars, vocals, snare drum), 1500-7000 (high mids, be careful here), 7000-> is usually left untouched. You'll just be bringing in noise and hiss and making it sound unpleasant.

 

[lolzgreg]

I've never really thought about this much (but then I don't multiband much on the master). If its for bass guitar then you can really treat it like a comp/EQ in one. If its for the master fader.. I've got a 5band so I usually go 0-100Hz (or whatever makes up 'the subs'), 100-350Hz (the low mids, boominess on guitar/toms/bass, etc.), 350Hz-1500Hz (mids, guitars, vocals, snare drum), 1500-7000 (high mids, be careful here), 7000-> is usually left untouched. You'll just be bringing in noise and hiss and making it sound unpleasant.

My friend, who has quite a resume: http://www.sajesound.com/discography.php

Said he never uses multiband comp on a master, EVER.

 

[Ermz]

There's is nothing wrong with using a multiband comp on the master, but you really have to know what you're doing otherwise you run the risk of not only dynamically sterilizing the track, but also castrating the frequency-dependent energy in it. They're great tools and can do some things far greater than simple EQ or single-band compression can, it's just with that power comes a bit of added complexity.

Katz' guide seems cool, but I find it a bit odd that he'd be advocating presets.

 

[akarawd]

Thank you all for your input -

Here's what I deduced from the provided info ;
Since we're referring to "enhancing" and not "correcting" we should be looking at broad strokes - large band regions (bass/mid/high). So it's probably not that technical in this case after all.

For the TC Finalizer Express that was mentioned, the Crossover points are fixed to 315Hz and 3.15kHz using 6dB slope linear phase digital filters (according to the manual) which actually makes a lot of sense to me.

If there's a mix about this forum that's accepted by most members for its quality, I'd be interested in running it through the McDsp using the Finalizers crossover points (will make note of the threshold and other settings) to see what happens.

Regards,
akarawd

 

[KeithTidd]

My friend, who has quite a resume: http://www.sajesound.com/discography.php

Said he never uses multiband comp on a master, EVER.

different strokes.

 

[Aaron Smith]

I already know what I want to be compressing before I even turn the plug-in on. The rest is fine tweaking done by listening.

This is a good philosophy.

 

[Loren Littlejohn]

use ears

This.

Please post this kind of question in "Production tips."

Help keep this fourm great.

And this.