I want to know the bare minimum

[tomas_almeida]

Hello dear members.

I've been lurking these forums for quite some time, appreciating your works, and absorving knowledge for the day I had the possibility of start recording my own stuff.

Finally, I've made my mind to spend some money so I can actually start recording my written material.
I have the disgraceful budget of 1500€, which needs to include a new PC (mine is absolute rubish) and a 7 string guitar (looking for used deals).
So, to try and minimise my spendings, I would like to know what equipment do I effectively need to start doing some decent recordings.
To try and maintain things on the cheap side I was thinking on relying on free amp sims entirely, except maybe for bass (I have a 200watt Traynor tube head and a 2x10 Aguilar cab, it's my live rig), although that would force me to have to buy a mic, but I could just use the head direct. Drums would have to be programmed. For synths, I have a friend that has the equipment I need(including software), and he could lend me the stuff.

So, now I am waiting for any replies you guys might want to give. Any advice is welcome. If you feel that I MUST increase the budget, then feel free to say so, and I might try to get a job during vacations.

Thanks in advance

 

[Vinny]

1500€ is approximately $2000 USD.
I have no idea how much the price differs in Europe by the way.

But I'd say you have more than enough money to get some decent stuff.

(These are very roughly rounded prices)
Here's my recommendations:
HP Laptop- $700
DI Box- $200
Steven Slate Drums EX+ 2 expansions- $160
Superior Drummer- $300
Focusrite Saffire 6- $200
Shecter Omen 7- $350

These are all US prices. and come out to roughly $1910 USD, which according to my converter, is roughly 1400€

 

[professorlamp]

that's a pretty good budget to get going IMO
Im just gonna expand/narrow vinnys list since its easier

You could omit the DI box from that list up there since the focusrite has instrument ins, you dont need two drum packages one or the other would do out of Slate and superior. Theres some medion computers which are pretty cheap (I got mine for about £350 I think, quad core, 500gb HD and 4gb of RAM) I've had it for 3 years and it shows no sign of dying which is good. I suppose you might want to get a mic I'd recommend a sm57 but my mate who is skinflint bought a Red 5 RVD30 and had pretty good results so don't let that put you off

 

[tomas_almeida]

Thank you so much Vinny and professorlamp!

You have your conversions well done. Instrument prices are usually higher here, but I checked to see the price of the Schecter, and I found a website that sells it for around 320€ (here).

I was planning on buying a desktop, so I can get a better computer at a lower price, and with better heat dispersion. Also, I wanted the PC to be able to be used for "gaemz", but I suppose that's not essential.

I wanted to use Firewire, do I need some kind of "ultra-special" soundcard?

 

[Vinny]

Most people on here use SSD for drums and Superior for cymbals when programming, so I was just suggesting that.
And it's always best to have an external DI box than using instruments ins on the interface. (most of the time atleast)

Oh, and you can get a Shure SM57 aswell which should put you right at 1500€.

And if you only get SSD and not Superior, you can get a decent set of monitors with the left over money

 

[tomas_almeida]

I heard the SM57 is terrible at capturing lows, and I wanted to use the mic to capture my cab's sound (its behaviour in lower freqs is astounding!).

Also, I wanted to use Firewire, do I need some kind of "ultra-special" soundcard?

 

[Vinny]

I've never heard that statement before. I've used a 57 on a bass cab and it turned out decently.
And it's always a good idea to have a 57 (or similar mic like the i5) laying around, incase you want to do acoustic or something.
Do you have a DAW already? Because you can just go direct with bass and use the bass plugins that most DAWS come with
Or like you said, you can just go direct from the amp

 

[tomas_almeida]

I don't, I haven't actually spent money yet. I opened this thread to help me get some directions for that.

I'm planning on buying Reaper, since it's cheap and people seem to be able to work with it alright.


EDIT: About the SM57, I read it on a thread here, and they had graphics that showed a huge frequency drop on anything lower that 200Hz, if I remember correctly.

EDIT2: By the way, you didn't mention any monitors or headphones on your list. I guess I don't have money for all that stuff then...

 

[ahjteam]

Going by the signalchain:

Guitar
Instrument cable
DI-box and/or mic
XLR cable
Firewire interface with preamp
Firewire cable
Firewire port
PC
DAW
Plugins
Cable to Monitors
Monitors with stands

= bare minimum


So for example:

Guitar (your pick)
Instrument cable (your pick, around 10&#8364
DI-box (for example BSS AR133, around 125&#8364 and/or mic (can't go wrong with SM57, around 100&#8364
XLR cable (your pick, around 10&#8364
Firewire interface with preamp (for example M-Audio Profire 610, around 350&#8364
Firewire cable (should be included with the interface)
Firewire port (should be included with the pc)
PC (your pick)
DAW (your pick, Reaper is around 30&#8364
Plugins (Slate EX is good for drums, around 65€, otherwise use the free and stock plugins)
Cable to monitors (your pick, around 20€ each)
Monitors with stands (for example Yamaha HS50M, around 350€ per pair)

So excluding PC and guitar around 1100€

 

[JoergieN]

So wait, what's the difference between and di box and an audio interface? I thought everyone just plugged the instrument or microphone into an audio interface and then into the computer. That's what I'm doing now, I plug my guitar straight into my m audio then use amp sim plugins. Did I miss something?

 

[RedDog]

So wait, what's the difference between and di box and an audio interface? I thought everyone just plugged the instrument or microphone into an audio interface and then into the computer. That's what I'm doing now, I plug my guitar straight into my m audio then use amp sim plugins. Did I miss something?

If it's working, it's working, although some would prefer a DI box capturing the DI and an amp at the same time. And a Box might have a higher impedance than your interface (10M ohm) which is desirable so's not to smear the high frequencies.

Signal chain:
Guitar
DI box
------Amp
------Microphone
Interface
PC

(whereas '---' indicates optional)

 

[tylerrr]

I'm not that into most metal and I don't down tune past C, unless I'm messing around very occasionally, but I would recommend holding off on the 7 string and getting whatever 6 string you have set up to play in a lower tuning(something some what comparable to what you might be trying to achieve with the 7 string). I know a 7 string is still obviously a different instrument compared to a down tuned 6 string, but I figure you could compromise for the time being and spend that $300-$500 on one or two items that you might need in your recording set up that you don't have any version of at this point. I might be totally wrong, but it just seems like the least necessary part of your desired recording set up.

also, to add to the sm57 debate about low end, I think that it captures whatever you play into it pretty accurately. in fact, that's kind of the idea from my experience and research. I've never had a problem with a lack of low end. I've used it on bass cabs/toms and I've always been happy with the result. it's definitely a multidimensional work horse of a mic that should be a part of every recording set up.

 

[Vinny]

He never implied that he had a guitar to begin with...

 

[tomas_almeida]

First of all thank you all for trying to help, it's very appreciated.

Going by the signalchain:

Guitar
Instrument cable
DI-box and/or mic
XLR cable
Firewire interface with preamp
Firewire cable
Firewire port
PC
DAW
Plugins
Cable to Monitors
Monitors with stands

= bare minimum


So for example:

Guitar (your pick)
Instrument cable (your pick, around 10&#8364
DI-box (for example BSS AR133, around 125&#8364 and/or mic (can't go wrong with SM57, around 100&#8364
XLR cable (your pick, around 10&#8364
Firewire interface with preamp (for example M-Audio Profire 610, around 350&#8364
Firewire cable (should be included with the interface)
Firewire port (should be included with the pc)
PC (your pick)
DAW (your pick, Reaper is around 30&#8364
Plugins (Slate EX is good for drums, around 65€, otherwise use the free and stock plugins)
Cable to monitors (your pick, around 20€ each)
Monitors with stands (for example Yamaha HS50M, around 350€ per pair)

So excluding PC and guitar around 1100€

So, it's a little more than previously said, and a bit more around what I was expecting. I think I'll start to buy the stuff in a near future, but will be doing so in steps.

By the way, do I want Slate because it has a trigger or because of the samples? If it is because of the samples maybe I can get some good ones here for free, no?

One more thing. Do I need some kind of pricey soundcard so it has a Firewire port?

I'm not that into most metal and I don't down tune past C, unless I'm messing around very occasionally, but I would recommend holding off on the 7 string and getting whatever 6 string you have set up to play in a lower tuning(something some what comparable to what you might be trying to achieve with the 7 string). (...)

I have all my stuff written for 7 string guitars, that's why I need one, because some of the chords can only be done on a 7 string.

Also...

He never implied that he had a guitar to begin with...

I don't have a guitar at the moment. I am a bassplayer, and spent all my money on bass gear, including my 5-string Dingwall (completely surreal bass, amazing). I can play guitar somewhat reasonably, nothing special, but technique can be improved with practice.

But regarding guitars...
I have someone selling a Ibanez here near me. It's either a RG7620 or a RG7420(he doesn't know, I've contacted him, and he can't seem to figure out), from 98, and he is listing it for around 400€.here Sorry, it's in portuguese, but it's just so you can see the pics.
However, I found this. It's new, and it's around 320€ without shipping.
What do you think? Should wait a bit more from a better used deal?

 

[ahjteam]

One more thing. Do I need some kind of pricey soundcard so it has a Firewire port?

Profire 610 is one of the cheapest firewire interfaces on the market. Good price-quality ratio on that unit.

By the way, do I want Slate because it has a trigger or because of the samples? If it is because of the samples maybe I can get some good ones here for free, no?

Trigger and Steven Slate Drums are two different products. Trigger is a drum replacement plugin and Slate Drums is a virtual instrument. And trigger doesn't have cymbals in it. Only decent free ones are in the Native Instruments Komplete Players package, but they pale in comparison to Slate stuff. But we are still talking peanuts here (65&#8364 in the big picture. You _can_ buy the Slate drums, the DI-box and mic later, but you pretty much need everything else.

 

[tomas_almeida]

Profire 610 is one of the cheapest firewire interfaces on the market. Good price-quality ratio on that unit.

I was refering to the PC's soundcard, not the interface. I've read some stuff about the profire, and it seems good for my needs, indeed.

Trigger and Steven Slate Drums are two different products. Trigger is a drum replacement plugin and Slate Drums is a virtual instrument. And trigger doesn't have cymbals in it. Only decent free ones are in the Native Instruments Komplete Players package, but they pale in comparison to Slate stuff. But we are still talking peanuts here (65€) in the big picture. You _can_ buy the Slate drums, the DI-box and mic later, but you pretty much need everything else.

Thanks for the explanetion. I'm reading about the Slate products at his website at the moment, so I can get a better grasp of it.

I will probably delay the purchase of the things you said in there, except maybe the DI.

 

[JoergieN]

If it's working, it's working, although some would prefer a DI box capturing the DI and an amp at the same time. And a Box might have a higher impedance than your interface (10M ohm) which is desirable so's not to smear the high frequencies.

Signal chain:
Guitar
DI box
------Amp
------Microphone
Interface
PC

(whereas '---' indicates optional)

What if you're just using amp sims anyways? Couldn't you just record using the ampsim pluggin, then turn it off afterwards and use that as the di? It seems as if that would essentially be doing the same thing. And by that I mean I could record using an amp sim and then use that di to get reamped by someone who actually has the equipment.