Indo-European Roots of Metal

[infoterror]

There's a cd out there, that shouldn't be too hard to find in the classical section at your local music store that features the chanting of the Aka Pygmies in addition to some of Gyorgi Ligeti's piano etudes, which were very much influenced by African music, and a couple of Steve Reich's pieces which owe quite a bit to the music of the Aka Pygmies. That African chanting can be pretty interesting, especially considering that the songs are passed down through oral tradition; it's very dense, polyphonic, and polyrhythmic music.

OK, here's the dual argument again: musical traditions belong to all places, except Africa, which is the root of all thought.

 

[Cythraul]

People who wish to defend their own cultures only want things of their cultural background; otherwise they become adulterated and destroyed.

America as a whole has no culture and is an example of this.

Anyone who preaches against this is awash in emotion, possibly revenge, if they are not Indo-European.

Explain how your position is any less "awash in emotion" then say, Nick's postion on the matter. It seems to me that you merely have a different preference. Take your preference and shove it up your ass thank you.

 

[Kenneth R.]

People who wish to defend their own cultures only want things of their cultural background; otherwise they become adulterated and destroyed.

America as a whole has no culture and is an example of this.

Anyone who preaches against this is awash in emotion, possibly revenge, if they are not Indo-European.

metal is not owned by indo-europeans or any race, country, continent, or other division.

 

[the alumnus]

People who wish to defend their own cultures only want things of their cultural background; otherwise they become adulterated and destroyed.

America as a whole has no culture and is an example of this.

Anyone who preaches against this is awash in emotion, possibly revenge, if they are not Indo-European.

then wouldn't music like black sabbath, which took heavy influences from american music, or music heavily influenced by americana, be an anathema to english culture? for example, in their early days black sabbath covered "blue suede shoes", an american song with rock and roll roots that extend to the blues. and much of their early material took pages from cream (compare NIB to sunshine of your love), which was a blues based band (see bluesbreaker, etc.). defending a culture through something that is a new crosspollination doesn't add up.
anyone who preaches this is awash in an inferiority complex.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

And America certainly does have a culture.

 

[infoterror]

anyone who preaches this is awash in an inferiority complex.

Good technique for argumentation.

Point is that some people make an association, emotionally, of "all rock = invented by Africans."

That ain't true, by the same principle you try to argue.

That you didn't see that... well, you would never be my choice for any delicate tasks.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

Point is that some people make an association, emotionally, of "all rock = invented by Africans."

Right. And we established that that was a load of shit.

As is "best metal = evokes Indo-European pride".

Thank you, come again.

 

[infoterror]

Metal - especially in its modern form - carries on the Indo-European spirit and style of composition. It's important to understand it in cultural context. I believe metal could be developed for any tribe, but it would probably not have the same form.

 

[Kenneth R.]

Metal - especially in its modern form - carries on the Indo-European spirit and style of composition. It's important to understand it in cultural context. I believe metal could be developed for any tribe, but it would probably not have the same form.

i strongly disagree with the utter lie quoted above.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

Well, if by its classical leanings you imply a Western style of composition, okay...but the various folk influences from cultures all over negate the exclusivity of that notion. So, I somewhat agree with SS.

 

[the alumnus]

Metal - especially in its modern form - carries on the Indo-European spirit and style of composition. It's important to understand it in cultural context. I believe metal could be developed for any tribe, but it would probably not have the same form.

ironic that your criticism of my off handed quip because of its reductionist nature is followed by a reductionist statement of your own. the "Indo-european spirit and style of composition"? how can a geographic region that includes several hundred thousand miles and over a billion people have a specific spirit and style of composition. if you examine the indo-european world, you will see hundreds of different styles of composition that vary from region and time period. that's why i don't understand why people try to make these strange connections between metal and a very large, complex, and diverse linguistic region.

 

[infoterror]

ironic that your criticism of my off handed quip because of its reductionist nature is followed by a reductionist statement of your own. the "Indo-european spirit and style of composition"? how can a geographic region that includes several hundred thousand miles and over a billion people have a specific spirit and style of composition. if you examine the indo-european world, you will see hundreds of different styles of composition that vary from region and time period. that's why i don't understand why people try to make these strange connections between metal and a very large, complex, and diverse linguistic region.

Debunking media guilt-oriented stereotypes is always useful.

Anything can be called reductionist, much as anything can be "deconstructed." Only HIV+ is true.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

@the alumnus

It is not an attempt to link a supposed spirit to a diverse linguistic group.

It is an attempt to place exclusivity on a form of human expression through a most disgusting turn of racism.

 

[Nightendday]

Only HIV+ is true.

Indeed.

 

[Cythraul]

Debunking media guilt-oriented stereotypes is always useful.

Debunking stereotypes? perhaps. Debunking alumnus' point which you replied to? NO.

Anything can be called reductionist

That's absolutely false. It's also another example of how you avoid directly addressing the crucial points.

 

[infoterror]

That's absolutely false. It's also another example of how you avoid directly addressing the crucial points.

His point was generic, and I'm not wasting time on it. "Reductionist" in the classical sense refers to a linearization, which in this context would apply most clearly to the tendency of western "authorities" to claim black ownership of a genre with Celtic roots.

 

[Cythraul]

His point was generic, and I'm not wasting time on it.

At least attempt a refutation of his point or stop posting.

 

[the alumnus]

well, perhaps you could at least explain why the linguistic model of "indo-european" is used in conjunction with musicology. what is the indo-european spirit? what is the indo-european style of composition? indo-european, as i said, encompasses over a billion people. http://www.georgetown.edu/faculty/ballc/oe/oe-ie.html
are you saying that indian ragas, irish reels, gregorian chants, german polkas, polish mazurkas, mexican mariachi, and death metal all share the same spirit and style of composition?

 

[infoterror]

well, perhaps you could at least explain why the linguistic model of "indo-european" is used in conjunction with musicology. what is the indo-european spirit? what is the indo-european style of composition?

Excellent - take a linguistic definition to stand for an ethnic-cultural entity. You wouldn't last long in a debate round

Indo-European culture stands on its own, and its contributions are clear. For example, I'd say Beethoven's pretty goddamn Indo-European, wouldn't you?

 

[Kenneth R.]

Excellent - take a linguistic definition to stand for an ethnic-cultural entity. You wouldn't last long in a debate round

Indo-European culture stands on its own, and its contributions are clear. For example, I'd say Beethoven's pretty goddamn Indo-European, wouldn't you?

that statement is about as good as saying Beethoven was human. that he resided within a certain geographic area has little to do with the nature of his musical genius.