Israel Strikes Aid Ship

[Mutant]

btw
Israel offered them to come in with the aid through an Israeli port.
But they refused.

Geee i wonder why...

 

[-Gavin-]

A terrorist thinks: "hmm we should send a ship convoy to Gaza even though it is blocked and forcefully resist any search attempt, then if they attack us - we will win the media war, because people will think that bad Israelis attacked a peaceful aid convoy and if they let us through - we will win the military war, because we will send military equipment in all following convoys".

If Israel stops controlling ships coming to Gaza, a huge amount of weapons and raw materials for explosives manufacturing will get to Hamas hands.
So it 20 killed vs many hundreds or even thousands if Israel let them pass through.

Bingo.

 

[Line666]

A terrorist thinks: "hmm we should send a ship convoy to Gaza even though it is blocked and forcefully resist any search attempt, then if they attack us - we will win the media war, because people will think that bad Israelis attacked a peaceful aid convoy and if they let us through - we will win the military war, because we will send military equipment in all following convoys".

A "search attempt" is not legal in international waters, it was a Turkish vessel and therefore Turkish land, any search attempt is a blatant act of piracy. If someone comes onto your property armed with weaponry should you be blamed for any hostility on your part? I think not, and thats even if there was any.

The Turks had scanned each and every passenger on board to stop anyone carrying weapons, until recently the Turks were very close allies with the Israelis (even letting them use their airspace).

 

[GeertSamuel]

A terrorist thinks: "hmm we should send a ship convoy to Gaza even though it is blocked and forcefully resist any search attempt, then if they attack us - we will win the media war, because people will think that bad Israelis attacked a peaceful aid convoy and if they let us through - we will win the military war, because we will send military equipment in all following convoys".

If Israel stops controlling ships coming to Gaza, a huge amount of weapons and raw materials for explosives manufacturing will get to Hamas hands.
So it 20 killed vs many hundreds or even thousands if Israel let them pass through.

C 2the orrect!
+1

 

[Mutant]

A "search attempt" is not legal in international waters, it was a Turkish vessel and therefore Turkish land, any search attempt is a blatant act of piracy. If someone comes onto your property armed with weaponry should you be blamed for any hostility on your part? I think not, and thats even if there was any.

The Turks had scanned each and every passenger on board to stop anyone carrying weapons, until recently the Turks were very close allies with the Israelis (even letting them use their airspace).

So Americans should have let USSR ships through during the Cuban missile crisis ? They stopped them on international waters too...

Sometimes what is legal and what is right don't really go together...

 

[Line666]

So Americans should have let USSR ships through during the Cuban missile crisis ? They stopped them on international waters too...

Sometimes what is legal and what is right don't really go together...

I love how you use hypothetical scenarios to justify genuine murder. Laws are there for a reason, nobody is above the law, whether they think they are righteous or not.

This was a Turkish ship, Turkey is a member of NATO, not an Israeli enemy, all civilians were scanned. This was not a terrorist ship.

 

[colynomial]

I think this is all just designed to foster anti-Israeli political and media hype. Gavin and Mutant are right- in practical terms, the Israelis have certain protocol established for dealing with these situations that they believe have the potential to directly impact their national security. Those of us who haven't spent time in Israel probably don't have a sense of what it's like to live under constant, legitimate threat by almost every single one of your neighbouring states.

I don't blame them for having a strict policy when dealing with unknown vessels entering their waters and deliberately ignoring their naval blockade. To me, this sounds like a bunch of pro-Palestinian/anti-Israeli types playing chicken with the Israeli military and expecting to get away with it. It's stupid.

 

[Line666]

I don't blame them for having a strict policy when dealing with unknown vessels entering their waters and deliberately ignoring their naval blockade. To me, this sounds like a bunch of pro-Palestinian/anti-Israeli types playing chicken with the Israeli military and expecting to get away with it. It's stupid.

Wrong.

 

[-Gavin-]

This was not a terrorist ship.

But had guns and weapons onboard and used them because....?

 

[J.DavisNJ]

Honestly, this is a pretty unfortunate event, but really...what the fuck did they expect? These people have tried doing such things in the past and are always turned away. They stated "well we are going to attempt it, and if we experience resistance, so be it..." or something to that effect.

If you try to break through the barrier or a hot zone such as that then you are a fucking fool.

I was in Israel a month or so ago. Security is tight as a witch's box, but the people don't live in constant fear because of this. I won't get into an "Israel should/shouldn't exists, Jews murder Palestinians," yadda yadda, because I won't be able to stop lol, but Israel needs to be aggressive if they don't want to be pushed into the Mediterranean one of these days.

How the fuck would the IDF know what was on these ships? These humanitarian nutjobs could have been conspiring with any number of Israel's enemies and been shipping tons and tons of weapons.

They were warned, chose to disobey, and got dealt the consequences.

Joe

 

[-Gavin-]

Honestly, this is a pretty unfortunate event, but really...what the fuck did they expect?

This sums it up!

How the fuck would the IDF know what was on these ships? These humanitarian nutjobs could have been conspiring with any number of Israel's enemies and been shipping tons and tons of weapons.

They were warned, chose to disobey, and got dealt the consequences.

And this!

 

[MarcusGHedwig]

I have to admit, putting all of my generally anti-radical-Islamic biases aside, it does seem very bullyish (and illegal) for Israel to just arbitrarily station a fleet in international waters and prevent anyone from passing without their approval; what gives them the right? To continue with the aforementioned example, if the black belt guy was hanging out on the sidewalk and harassing random people walking by, and somebody kicked him the nuts and then got the shit beaten out of him, I'd want justice on the black belt

 

[MarcusGHedwig]

Unless of course Israel's blockade was internationally sanctioned...

 

[colynomial]

Wrong.

Owen I understand that the event took place on international waters, but 40 miles out is hardly the middle of the ocean and given that the ship was intending to bring aid to the Gaza strip, it's reasonable to assume they were headed for Israeli waters which extend 12 nautical miles out from the coastline. Apparently there was a leader of the Israeli Islamic Movement among the group on board the aid boat which to me, does add legitimacy to the claim the intentions of the group weren't entirely humanitarian in nature- there's a good chance they were also trying to make a statement.

 

[-Gavin-]

This whole thing has blatantly been orchestrated and was designed to rally up international hate toward Israel.

I do not doubt for an µs that a lot of people on board were genuine humanitarian workers... but I doubt that was the real cause for the ship.
How could you NOT KNOW (Especially after warnings about what the consequences would be from Israel themselves) what would happen... The knew this and chose to push forward because it served the palestinian/anti-israeli cause.

There is no justification for murder... But I'll bet this was orchestrated by an islamic group trying to get the media on their side and THEY sent those people to die... So who is the bad guy here?
The humanitarian workers were simply fallguys because their death would gather far more publicity than a boat full of islamic fundamentalists.

This is either a case of Humanitatian stupidity or Islamic orchestration...

 

[SocialNumb]

Dam Islam!

 

[Line666]

To quote BBC News:

"Israel says its soldiers boarded the lead ship in the early hours but were attacked with axes, knives, bars and at least two guns."

Yes, thats generally what will happen when you board a ship firing live ammunition, in international waters after breaking the law, but since this is coming straight from the Israelis - who must by now have realised that they need to avert complete international dissapproval its not exactly an unbiased source for your views.

No Marcus, it's definitely not internationally sanctioned and your absolutely right.

And Israel doesnt need anyone to rally up hate for it when it supresses, kills and murders people on a daily basis, bulldozes their homes, won't admit to the fact that it has nuclear weapons or define its borders and is an American funded middle east wild card. Yes because we obviously need more reasons to dislike Israel military policy.

 

[Mutant]

I love how you use hypothetical scenarios to justify genuine murder. Laws are there for a reason, nobody is above the law, whether they think they are righteous or not.

This was a Turkish ship, Turkey is a member of NATO, not an Israeli enemy, all civilians were scanned. This was not a terrorist ship.

Why hypothetical ?

To halt this offensive buildup, a strict quarantine on all offensive military equipment under shipment to Cuba is being initiated. All ships of any kind bound for Cuba from whatever nation and port will, if found to contain cargoes of offensive weapons, be turned back. This quarantine will be extended, if needed, to other types of cargo and carriers.

All blockades are against the international law.
If USA can do it without being at war against USSR and Cuba, why can't Israel do it without being at war against Turkey and only being at war unofficially against terrorists ?

 

[John_C]

To anyone saying that this was done to stir up hate against Israeli military policy, good. Every bit of awareness brings pressure to eventually end their idiotic tactics that help no one, not even themselves.

Every time Israel breaks international law in the name of it's national security/interests it makes MORE not less people want to blow them up. Same goes for all the countries in the world who think that military action will stop people hating them

 

[-Gavin-]

To anyone saying that this was done to stir up hate against Israeli military policy, good. Every bit of awareness brings pressure to eventually end their idiotic tactics that help no one, not even themselves.

Every time Israel breaks international law in the name of it's national security/interests it makes MORE not less people want to blow them up. Same goes for all the countries in the world who think that military action will stop people hating them

By that logic... whoever started the hate train sent naive humanitarian workers to die.

Remind me, who is the bad guy in this?