Jeff Loomis Obsidian Conspiracy tone?

[H-evolve]

Hi,

I've been trying to find info on this forum (and on others) as to what was used on the Obsidian Conspiracy album. Haven't found much so far. Unless I missed a thread about it?

Some say Jeff uses an ENGL Savage, but I think it might be his live rig only? Same thing about the 808 overdrive, is it really used for the rythm parts? Or only the leads?

Listening to the album it sounds more like a Rectifier or perhaps a 5150?

And also, we often read/hear the "Don't use too much gain" quote, but when listening to that album I'm always "My god... that sounds like insane amounts of gain, yet it sounds so awesome!!!!".

 

[allanqa]

Not this album, but olders you can hear rectifier tone on Loomis playing.

Probably 4 takes or mic combos to ticken the guitar sound

 

[Jormyn]

I believe This Godless Endeavour had some combination of Rectifier, Krank, and 5150 going on. Probably something similar to that.

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

Pretty sure it was 5150III on Obsidian Conspiracy. Could have sworn that was mentioned here at some point. Jeff switched to 5150III from Engl right around that time as well as I recall.

Hi,
And also, we often read/hear the "Don't use too much gain" quote, but when listening to that album I'm always "My god... that sounds like insane amounts of gain, yet it sounds so awesome!!!!".

My guess is that Jeff used a little more gain than most metal guys when recording back then but probably not as much as you would think. Nowadays it sounds to me like he's dialed back the distortion a bit.

 

[ArsMemoria]

Found this:

http://www.guitarworld.com/nevermore-what-doesnt-kill?page=1

"When he tracked The Obsidian Conspiracy, he ran the guitar through an Ibanez Tube Screamer pedal and into a Special Edition Engl or a Peavey 5150, using various alternate tunings."

 

[H-evolve]

Found this:

http://www.guitarworld.com/nevermore-what-doesnt-kill?page=1

"When he tracked The Obsidian Conspiracy, he ran the guitar through an Ibanez Tube Screamer pedal and into a Special Edition Engl or a Peavey 5150, using various alternate tunings."

Nice thanks. Funny though... When I use a TubeScreamer in front of my ENGL I have some unwanted high frequencies that are really bothering me when doing palm muted alternate picking rythm. There is this fizz on every pick attack. Not so noticeable when going from palm muted to open to plam muted, etc. But when only doing palm muted single notes, you definitely hear that unwanted harshness.

So I prefer not to use it for rythm, only leads. Maybe other ENGL users could comment?

 

[Phil_ocean]

Nice thanks. Funny though... When I use a TubeScreamer in front of my ENGL I have some unwanted high frequencies that are really bothering me when doing palm muted alternate picking rythm. There is this fizz on every pick attack. Not so noticeable when going from palm muted to open to plam muted, etc. But when only doing palm muted single notes, you definitely hear that unwanted harshness.

So I prefer not to use it for rythm, only leads. Maybe other ENGL users could comment?

Lowpass them a bit, it will certainly reduce fizziness

 

[Heabow]

So I prefer not to use it for rythm, only leads. Maybe other ENGL users could comment?

I almost never boost my Savage. This guy's tight enough in most cases for me.

 

[ArsMemoria]

Nice thanks. Funny though... When I use a TubeScreamer in front of my ENGL I have some unwanted high frequencies that are really bothering me when doing palm muted alternate picking rythm. There is this fizz on every pick attack. Not so noticeable when going from palm muted to open to plam muted, etc. But when only doing palm muted single notes, you definitely hear that unwanted harshness.

So I prefer not to use it for rythm, only leads. Maybe other ENGL users could comment?

What ENGL are you using?

 

[H-evolve]

What ENGL are you using?

ENGL Savage 120, but I previously had an Invader 100. I had that feel with both of them, the harsh high frequency that I get when I activate my TS9. Disapears when it is off. Perhaps it is the TS9 itself that is by nature edgier (versus an 808)?

It's really a high freq short "tchik" sound, at each palm muted pick attack. And, when you do fast alternate palm muted picking, you pretty much hear that sound every 0.3 second, so it's annoying.

Maybe it would disapear with a low pass as you proposed, but I don't know... Mic'ing a sound that I don't really like in the first place, thinking a low pass will fix it, doesn't seem like the way to go for me.

I'll try to share a file when I get home from work, perhaps it'll be clearer than my "tchik" onomatopoeia!

 

[ArsMemoria]

I haven't been able to play anything more than a Fireball or Powerball, but even with those, I can't imagine using them with a TS(maybe the powerball). But then again, if you're chasing the tone on TOC, it's probably needed. Maybe someone else can chime in if a TS808 would be much different than a TS9.

 

[Phil_ocean]

Well, if the fiziness is annoying specifically on palm mutes then probably the lowpass wont help, so as you already spoted the problem on the TS9 try to mess with the TS9 settings and if you cant get to a satisfying sound maybe kick it out?

Edit: You said it the noise is coming from the picks, but only on palm mutes? Or in general?

 

[H-evolve]

Well, if the fiziness is annoying specifically on palm mutes then probably the lowpass wont help, so as you already spoted the problem on the TS9 try to mess with the TS9 settings and if you cant get to a satisfying sound maybe kick it out?

Edit: You said it the noise is coming from the picks, but only on palm mutes? Or in general?

Hi, for me, I hear it mostly on palm mutes, at the pick attack.

 

[Phil_ocean]

Hi, for me, I hear it mostly on palm mutes, at the pick attack.

I would try to find if a specific frequency (or a small band of frequencies) that may cause the problem and if it seems like a problem concerning a wide range of frequencies then maybe try messing with the tone (take a photo of your previous settings though)

 

[H-evolve]

You can hear, I think, what I am talking about, using the link. It's recording that I put in my dropbox. It's the raw track, no EQ whatsoever.

It is the following chain : LTD ZH-7 with D-Activators, TS9, ENGL Invader 100, ENGL XXL Cab, SM57. Not a perfect recording. But it's to demonstrate the annoying tscchhkk I mean.

The Invader was on channel 3, Gain Boost on, Gain at 12:00. Lows at around 12:00. Mid at 1:30. High at 1:30. Pres at 10:00. Depth at 10:00.

dl.dropbox.com/s/fw3hv1v3ca6yrjb/38-Hugues_Riff5_Mic_1-160730_1652.wav?dl=0

EDIT: By the way, the recording was done a couple of weeks ago and I do not own the Invader anymore. Sold it and bought a Savage. As was discussed, I feel a similar high pitch noise is heard when using the TS in front of the Savage, again on palm mutes. But I haven't had the chance to play with it much.

 

[Phil_ocean]

Hey dude, the palm mutes sound fine man. I understand what you mean about the pick attack but thats how they naturally sound with this kind of sound. Personally, I dig 'em . Bear in mind, that when drums and bass kick in, it wont bother you that much. There are plenty of famous records when the pick attack can be heard, but rarely someone notices it.

 

[H-evolve]

Hey dude, the palm mutes sound fine man. I understand what you mean about the pick attack but thats how they naturally sound with this kind of sound. Personally, I dig 'em . Bear in mind, that when drums and bass kick in, it wont bother you that much. There are plenty of famous records when the pick attack can be heard, but rarely someone notices it.

Well, perhaps I'm crazy then! haha. Thanks for commenting. I guess that comparing with the Dual Rectifier, they didn't sound as harsh. But ya, your point about how it will sound with added drums and bass is completely valid. I'll probably try and add them. Then I'll see how it sounds

 

[Phil_ocean]

Well, perhaps I'm crazy then! haha. Thanks for commenting. I guess that comparing with the Dual Rectifier, they didn't sound as harsh. But ya, your point about how it will sound with added drums and bass is completely valid. I'll probably try and add them. Then I'll see how it sounds

awesome, post some stuff here when you wish

 

[ArsMemoria]

You can hear, I think, what I am talking about, using the link. It's recording that I put in my dropbox. It's the raw track, no EQ whatsoever.

It is the following chain : LTD ZH-7 with D-Activators, TS9, ENGL Invader 100, ENGL XXL Cab, SM57. Not a perfect recording. But it's to demonstrate the annoying tscchhkk I mean.

The Invader was on channel 3, Gain Boost on, Gain at 12:00. Lows at around 12:00. Mid at 1:30. High at 1:30. Pres at 10:00. Depth at 10:00.

dl.dropbox.com/s/fw3hv1v3ca6yrjb/38-Hugues_Riff5_Mic_1-160730_1652.wav?dl=0

EDIT: By the way, the recording was done a couple of weeks ago and I do not own the Invader anymore. Sold it and bought a Savage. As was discussed, I feel a similar high pitch noise is heard when using the TS in front of the Savage, again on palm mutes. But I haven't had the chance to play with it much.

I hear what you're talking about, honestly, I think the only reason it even comes close to bugging me is because I'm looking for it. In a mix, I bet it wouldn't matter. There's a clip on tonefinder which is one of my favorite Savage clips and I kinda hear the same thing. Maybe it's just the pick attack of that amp?

Ex: http://www.tonefinder.com/files/57-Sundaymetaltune.mp3

Again, I only notice if I was looking for it. It kinda disappears in the mix for me.

 

[Pxz]

That pick attack sound happened to me when i raised the d-activators in one of my guitars. Try lowering the pickup a bit. D-activator and other pickups behave like that when they are to close to the strings and produce some squeaky shit . The TS may be boosting that characteristc of the guitar and that's way you hear it with the TS on. Try that and let us know if you solve the problem.