My dual rectifiers tubes just died...like a week after the warrenty expired....amazing. Do you guys know of a brand of tubes that last longer, or sound better/warmer? I think if i get six in a set they cost like $20 but individually their $30.
Mesa tubes
- Thread starter WarHead
- Start date
sumairetsu
Joker's Favorite
There's a reason Mesa Boogie sells their tubes in sets...buy them that way.
There's a reason why most of the repair shops in my area won't touch Mesa Boogie amps and tell me to send it to the factory outlet in Hollywood...don't mess with it.
There's a reason why most of the repair shops in my area won't touch Mesa Boogie amps and tell me to send it to the factory outlet in Hollywood...don't mess with it.
Indiooo
Member
Putting a diferent brand of tubes in the amp won't make it blow up! I had a couple of Boogie tubes in my pre and they were ok, a bit too bright for my taste, but ok. Next time I retube I'm gonna go with JJs.
Oh, and Mesa doesn't make tubes, they just relabel them. I think their tubes are Sovteks these days (I'm not sure).
Oh, and Mesa doesn't make tubes, they just relabel them. I think their tubes are Sovteks these days (I'm not sure).
Ah, I figured I would buy them in a set to save money. There are two different types of tubes on my amp, er...same with the other rectifiers. I forget the exact name...but I was just wondering if there were some other options to chose when replacing my tubes. Im not happy with the set of four, because they dont sound as bold i guess as the other two do.
Do any of you have a tube set up that allows to switch between two different types of tubes?
Damn I have alot of work to do before my set up is to my liking...
Thanks for replying.
Do any of you have a tube set up that allows to switch between two different types of tubes?
Damn I have alot of work to do before my set up is to my liking...
Thanks for replying.
Indiooo
Member
Actually, you should have anything from three to four different tube types in your Dual Recto (12AX7, 6L6, 5U4 and maybe 12AT7).
If you don't like your tone because it isn't bold enough, you can try El34s in the power section, replacing the 6L6s. That'll give you a much more focused, in-your-face sound, but you won't have that huge bottom end, altough the bass gets a lot tighter.
And even within the same tube types, some brands sound a lot different than others, it's a matter of personal preference, really.
If you don't like your tone because it isn't bold enough, you can try El34s in the power section, replacing the 6L6s. That'll give you a much more focused, in-your-face sound, but you won't have that huge bottom end, altough the bass gets a lot tighter.
And even within the same tube types, some brands sound a lot different than others, it's a matter of personal preference, really.
DON'T FUCK WITH THE POWER TUBES. unless you are doing a straight replacement, DO NOT FUCK WIHT MESA TUBES!! you have to get the EXACT same tubes, becasue if you don't you have to take it to an amp tech and have them bias it for your new tubes, and thats a BITCH on mesa's. Trust me, just get the same exact tubes you used to have.
Indiooo
Member
That's just bullshit. Rectos have a bias switch for 6L6/EL34, it's safe. Most that can happen is that the amp runs too cold (this seems to be the case with a lot of Rectos) because it's overbiased, but it's easily solved by putting a pot (variable resistor) in place of the stock resistor. The only reason I can imagine for Mesa building these amps with fixed bias is to force people to buy their tubes, which seems to be working with you.
I think the guy from Eurotubes sells JJs with the ideal power to match the plate volts in your amp so you won't need to bias, but don't quote me on that.
I think the guy from Eurotubes sells JJs with the ideal power to match the plate volts in your amp so you won't need to bias, but don't quote me on that.
sure you can use either 6l6's or el34's, but they have to be the mesa brand, thats what i was saying, sorry for the confusion. what im saying is you can't replace those tubes with groove tubes 6l6's or EL34's
Indiooo
Member
You can, the thing is it won't sound the same (the exception would be if the tubes had the exact same output). And that can be bad if you did like the tone, or good, since Rectos are overbiased anyway (they're sort of buzzy when overbiased). And if you ask me, buying Mesa tubes just so I wouldn't have to get a trim pot to bias the amp to the tubes I really want, isn't a thing I would consider at all.
Fuck this just got really confusing. Ok ok... hmm the two 5U4-GB's are ok. They're the more bold sound. The other 4 which are 6L6's I think are just weak sounding. I want a bolder agressive ass sounding type of tube to replace the four 6L6's.
Is that possible to switch for a bolding tube with out moding the bias? Or should I just keep the same tubes are get a good effects rack to shape the sound to my liking?
Ah, the bias switch is between 6L6 and El-34....for some reason I cant see any El-34s in the amp. Damn my equipment is so damn unreliable.
Thanks for responding.
Is that possible to switch for a bolding tube with out moding the bias? Or should I just keep the same tubes are get a good effects rack to shape the sound to my liking?
Ah, the bias switch is between 6L6 and El-34....for some reason I cant see any El-34s in the amp. Damn my equipment is so damn unreliable.
Thanks for responding.
Indiooo
Member
WarHead said:Fuck this just got really confusing. Ok ok... hmm the two 5U4-GB's are ok. They're the more bold sound. The other 4 which are 6L6's I think are just weak sounding. I want a bolder agressive ass sounding type of tube to replace the four 6L6's.
Is that possible to switch for a bolding tube with out moding the bias? Or should I just keep the same tubes are get a good effects rack to shape the sound to my liking?
Ah, the bias switch is between 6L6 and El-34....for some reason I cant see any El-34s in the amp. Damn my equipment is so damn unreliable.
Thanks for responding.
Man you're SO confused!
First of all, to get a tighter, more agressive tone, switch to silicon diodes. Tube rectifiers make your tone looser (can be a good thing). Try that. If you still feel you need more tightness, throw a quartet of EL34s in there (check the JJs if you don't want to fuck with biasing).
And no effects unit is going to make your amp sound good. Even EQs are best used for fine tuning, not fixing bad tone, at least at the guitar amp level.
You don't see any EL34s in your amp because it comes stock with 6L6s. Rectos are not supposed to have mixed tubes (except for the Road King), that's a feature of Mesa's Simulclass amp like the Mk series and the 2:90.
Have you read your amp's manual?
Indiooo said:
Indiooo said:First of all, to get a tighter, more agressive tone, switch to silicon diodes. Tube rectifiers make your tone looser (can be a good thing). Try that. If you still feel you need more tightness, throw a quartet of EL34s in there (check the JJs if you don't want to fuck with biasing).
And no effects unit is going to make your amp sound good. Even EQs are best used for fine tuning, not fixing bad tone, at least at the guitar amp level.
You don't see any EL34s in your amp because it comes stock with 6L6s. Rectos are not supposed to have mixed tubes (except for the Road King), that's a feature of Mesa's Simulclass amp like the Mk series and the 2:90.
Have you read your amp's manual?[/QUOTE]
Yeah Im absent minded to what type of tubes my amp came with. Its been a while since Ive played on it unfortunatly. (long story)
The two high power silicon diodes tubes (5U4-GB's I think) sound ok. They put out a good deal of power and the tone is tight.
What is confusing me right now (in my drunken state of mind) , is why I have four other tubes that I dont seem to be using on the amp. The rectifier seems to switch between high power silicon diodes or the stander 6L6s i think. I always have it switched to the high powered ones. So I guess I want to see if there are any replacement ones for the 6L6s. Mainly because I cant seem to find a tone that Im happy with, while using those tubes.
Hopefully this makes some sense, sorry.
hah I just re-read everything again... The el-34s will have a more aggressive tone than the 6L6s? How do you mean, check the JJs? Does that brand have similar bias to mesa?
Indiooo
Member
Let me see if I can explain this clearly:
The POWER tubes on your amp are the four 6L6s. These are the tubes that make your preamp signal louder so it can push speakers. Power tubes also have tonal differences between different types (the EL34 / 6L6 thing I told you about earlier).
All amps have rectifiers. Some amps have solid state rectifiers, some have tube rectifiers and some have both, like your amp. Using the Dual Recto you have a choice of tube rectifier OR silicon diode rectifier. This doesn't power your amp, altough it is part of the power section. Using the silicon diodes, you get a tighter sound, with a lot less sag. This makes your tone more defined and punchy.
Bias depends on the plate votlage on your amp and the exact power the tubes put out. What happens with Mesa tubes is that they all draw the same power so that you don't have to bias your amp. The guy from Eurotubes sells JJs with the same power as your Mesas if you ask for it.
The POWER tubes on your amp are the four 6L6s. These are the tubes that make your preamp signal louder so it can push speakers. Power tubes also have tonal differences between different types (the EL34 / 6L6 thing I told you about earlier).
All amps have rectifiers. Some amps have solid state rectifiers, some have tube rectifiers and some have both, like your amp. Using the Dual Recto you have a choice of tube rectifier OR silicon diode rectifier. This doesn't power your amp, altough it is part of the power section. Using the silicon diodes, you get a tighter sound, with a lot less sag. This makes your tone more defined and punchy.
Bias depends on the plate votlage on your amp and the exact power the tubes put out. What happens with Mesa tubes is that they all draw the same power so that you don't have to bias your amp. The guy from Eurotubes sells JJs with the same power as your Mesas if you ask for it.
I checked out the Eurotube site. Awsome thanks alot, that site explained a shit load.
Im gonna get the JJ EL-34s and I guess just replace the 5U4-GB's that came stock in the mesa. Unless they have JJ ones that sound better.
Thanks alot for bearing with my slow learning ability.:Spin:
Im gonna get the JJ EL-34s and I guess just replace the 5U4-GB's that came stock in the mesa. Unless they have JJ ones that sound better.
Thanks alot for bearing with my slow learning ability.:Spin:
Indiooo
Member
No problem, tube amps are complicated shit. But I think you still missed one of my points. EL34s don't go in place of the 5U4. They replace the 6L6s. But while you're at it, replace all the tubes (preamp, poweramp and rectifier). Maybe there's something wrong with your tubes. You have a nice amp, can't imagine why you don't like it... Maybe it's just bad tubes.
The Advice here not to "mess with" MESA Boogie tube sets is worth heeding. MESA does not manufacture their own tubes, but they do develop the specifications for the tube design and operating characteristics.
A rectifier circuit takes AC voltage and current input, uses a set of diodes to ensure "one way" current flow (because AC circuits reverse theri polarity every half cycle), and then puts the resulting half-waves theough a set of coils and capacitors that filter out or pass certain frequencies easily.
The rectifiers are used to generate the tube sound. The "power" is generated by applying gain supplied by storing charge in capacitors, through transformers (or in some solid state amplifiers, with transistors and other semi-conducting components).
Bias is a little-understood, but critical part of tuning a circuit for a certain sound or effect. In techie terms, "bias" is negative voltage applied to the grid of each output tube, which controls the base level, or standing current draw, of each tube. It is like an electrnic current valve (in fact, bias adjustment is called Current-Valve adjustment in teh U.K.). When you measure the bias in a circuit or tube, ou actually measure the voltage drop across the cathode [negative] resistor of that tube. When you set or adjust the bias, you're adjusting the amount of negative voltage going to that tube's grid. The best analogy is the adjustment for the fuel/air mixture in an aircraft engine, or tuning the idle-setting for a carburetor in a race vehicle.
You can't make a Ford run like a Porsche, but you can make a Porsche run like a Ford if you screw up the fuel/air mixture.
Improper Biasing may result in the following:
1. Damage to the power tubes themselves
2. Decreasing the life expectancy of the power tubes
3. Damage to amplifier's grid resistors
4. Damage to the output transformers within the amplifier (ouch!)
5. Damage to amplifier Power supply circuitry and transformer
Damaging the other circuitry can be an expensive proposition -- especially with MESA equipment.
Best bet: go to a MESA dealer, and get a new set of tubes.
Since tubes operting characteristics chane slighly over time, check and adjust bias regularly (once a month is usually about right) to maximize tube life.
A rectifier circuit takes AC voltage and current input, uses a set of diodes to ensure "one way" current flow (because AC circuits reverse theri polarity every half cycle), and then puts the resulting half-waves theough a set of coils and capacitors that filter out or pass certain frequencies easily.
The rectifiers are used to generate the tube sound. The "power" is generated by applying gain supplied by storing charge in capacitors, through transformers (or in some solid state amplifiers, with transistors and other semi-conducting components).
Bias is a little-understood, but critical part of tuning a circuit for a certain sound or effect. In techie terms, "bias" is negative voltage applied to the grid of each output tube, which controls the base level, or standing current draw, of each tube. It is like an electrnic current valve (in fact, bias adjustment is called Current-Valve adjustment in teh U.K.). When you measure the bias in a circuit or tube, ou actually measure the voltage drop across the cathode [negative] resistor of that tube. When you set or adjust the bias, you're adjusting the amount of negative voltage going to that tube's grid. The best analogy is the adjustment for the fuel/air mixture in an aircraft engine, or tuning the idle-setting for a carburetor in a race vehicle.
You can't make a Ford run like a Porsche, but you can make a Porsche run like a Ford if you screw up the fuel/air mixture.
Improper Biasing may result in the following:
1. Damage to the power tubes themselves
2. Decreasing the life expectancy of the power tubes
3. Damage to amplifier's grid resistors
4. Damage to the output transformers within the amplifier (ouch!)
5. Damage to amplifier Power supply circuitry and transformer
Damaging the other circuitry can be an expensive proposition -- especially with MESA equipment.
Best bet: go to a MESA dealer, and get a new set of tubes.
Since tubes operting characteristics chane slighly over time, check and adjust bias regularly (once a month is usually about right) to maximize tube life.
Indiooo
Member
Well, you can't adjust the bias on Mesa amps unless you get a variable resistor in there, which is something most people don't want to do. I don't understand why, but they don't. And if you get tubes with the same characteristics by another brand (JJ for example, and I'm in no way affiliated with that company lol), it's really a matter of choice, don't you agree?
Thanks for the info, it was nice reading that.
Thanks for the info, it was nice reading that.
