Music Through the Ages

Its not that at all, I listened and made my evaluation, which was this is awsome stuff, far beyond A-typical rock or metal and I love it. I did say no one would remember these bands after we're dead. Elvis is even slowly fading but I suppose he'll at least always own a page in the history of R&R and they will never even mention the prog artists. But theres the statis quo thing again. Which brings me back to "classical", you are somebody if you develope a taste for classical and I think that has helped keep it alive as well as the fact that those guys were writing history when they made their discoveries.

So, in good sportsmanship I listened to our local classical station all day, I have always done this from time to time but its been about a year. I made a very interesting discovery. As awe inspiring as the origional concept of that form of composition is, it too becomes very predictable and rehashed. Much of it had a very cloned feel which becomes, in your face obvious after the first hour and nearly unforgivable after 4 hours. This is an art form that existed for centuries. Perhaps they too are placed too high on a pedestal. I also found many places where I could turn the instruments in my head and hear the guitars riffing out, and the keyboard player laying down harmonized melodic chord progressions and the guitarist wailing away indulging in scales. Yet there was no drummer and walking bass lines would only pop in and out. Much of it did seem to be basic major scales and harmonys with few mode changes but more cresendos and sweeping moods, very expressive. I believe modern guitarists eat up the scales and modes far superior as they should be because we are an advancing sort by nature. Im not talking shreding either because the classics were the origional shredders. I mean there is a more advanced way of using intervals, accentals and mode changes today.

SO as I came home and before I sat typing I decided to pop in my old When Dream and Day Unite tape and I gotta say ....... WOW ! I havent played this thing in at least 4 years and if these guys arent doing classical level song construction with all the harmonies, theory, bells and whistles ....... with only 3 instruments and a vocalist I need to be commited. Plus its just got a better groove, classical be abit grooveless but perhaps easier on the ear, not many ladies like prog metal but plenty go to the opera and symphony every year.

I never said they were writing modern classical music only that the music by the masters I mentioned operated on the same level. Im no ones fan boi as Ive seen mentioned here I've been a avid abuser of progressive music since '72 and very musically openminded ... to a limit

Damn ........ Ive got to get this thing on CD and play it more often.
 
The only "modern" musicians I'd put on the same level as the classical composers are jazz musicians, albiet the genius is on an improvisational level as opposed to a compositional level (both of which I admire). If you take a guitarist like Allan Holdsworth and ever dissect what he's playing, the fact that the man is improvising everything he does at the speeds he does, with the cleanliness he does, over the kinds of chord changes he does, it is nothing short of sheer musical genius.
 
The only "modern" musicians I'd put on the same level as the classical composers are jazz musicians, albiet the genius is on an improvisational level as opposed to a compositional level (both of which I admire). If you take a guitarist like Allan Holdsworth and ever dissect what he's playing, the fact that the man is improvising everything he does at the speeds he does, with the cleanliness he does, over the kinds of chord changes he does, it is nothing short of sheer musical genius.

I'd have ZERO issue adding someone like Holdsworth to the list with FZ & MK...
 
The only "modern" musicians I'd put on the same level as the classical composers are jazz musicians, albiet the genius is on an improvisational level as opposed to a compositional level (both of which I admire). If you take a guitarist like Allan Holdsworth and ever dissect what he's playing, the fact that the man is improvising everything he does at the speeds he does, with the cleanliness he does, over the kinds of chord changes he does, it is nothing short of sheer musical genius.


+ a whole shit load

There are still a lot of modern orchestral composers who will have left a very significant legacy when they pass too. I think for the most part though I should stay out of this discussion because I'm bound to get both sides all butthurt with my take on it.
 
Im ashamed to say I somehow missed the Holdsworth page. My music buying is infrequent and minimal. Was very big on Steve Morse and Dr. Sloans early work though and they put together some great compositions. Early DiMeola & Ponty were regulars as well but I missed both Holdsworth and Metheny. Kinda got a thing for what George Puleo does too, the best mostly unknown guitar improviser that I know of. Check him out on U tube if you have not already. Maybe old school today but very interesting player that never made it much past local aclaim around the western NY area.

Meedley - how can someone get butt hurt when another gives solid backup with their views without using degredation ? I like what people have to offer for points of view if they can put it out there without insults.

I also feel that the progressive artists we are speaking of without mentioning their names for fear of "fanboiism" are at the same level as the great jazz and fusion artists. All hard working masters of their craft and always loved or hated for it. I think the highly esteemed classical composers went through the same thing in their day.

Hell Id put as much weight in a live Stevie Ray Vaughan improv performance to some tired old memorized violin concerto and he just played the tired old blues and may very well retain a page in musical history for it. So just exactly what is musical genious ....
 
Meedley - how can someone get butt hurt when another gives solid backup with their views without using degredation ? I like what people have to offer for points of view if they can put it out there without insults.


You haven't been here at the forum very long have you:lol: (<-- not laughing at you, but rather WITH the other regulars here who know the kind of BS this forum is full of)
 
but I missed both Holdsworth and Metheny.

In this day and age, there is no excuse to "miss" an artist. Both Holdsworth and Metheny have nearly their entire discography on iTunes, theres countless videos of them on youtube, and Im sure if you wanted to acquire music via "illegal" means you could as well.

That being said, stop "missing out" on Holdsworth and go check out his incredible talents asap. Here, I'll even start you off:

 
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So just exactly what is musical genious ....

Its hard to say, because there are a lot of musicians who have done phenomenal stuff in terms of composing, improvising, and/or playing in general throughout history. For me some of the hardest stuff to understand is jazz. I have learned about counterpoint and seem to get the hang of writing it to a certain degree, but jazz seems like a music that is so complex that I can't even begin to break it down. There seem to be no rules, no scales, and in such a strict scalular theory world which I have put myself into, its sort of a trip to see Jazz players improv over chords I have never heard of. I still think every genre has their own musical geniuses or musical masters, regardless of what it is. Though not all genres will be remembered forever through history, its still nice to admire the greats who are still around today.
 
By missed it, I meant back in the 70's or early 80's whenever he kicked off his career. Let me see I was probably working 6 days a week in a very music unfriendly environment and into other things at that time. I dont make "excuses" nor need any, reality takes care of that. In this day and age I am still a very busy person and frankly thought jazz fusion had keeled over to smooth jazz and the rest went latin. Others I have mentioned are on par with Holdsworth as well as the great progressive metal guitarist/composers in question. But I will eventually get some Holdsworth, I have a bit of Methany already but have caught up on my man Al, replaced my old Spectrum album with a CD, Mahavishnu on CD, completed my Sym X, DT, Fates and Savatage collections on CD plus some of the real old stuff I needed to buy cause no one plays it. I have heard what Holdsworth just played before but hes still damn good. Hell I dont even have any Vai, its just a matter of priorities and current pursuits. He simply missed the list.

But in 100 years it wont matter anyhow cause The Priests will still be screaming Bach, Mozart, Beethovan and Elvis .......... and no where will there be a Stratocaster to be found ....... just cellos and violas singing that same old tired concerto ...... :)

Anyone heard Rite of Strings .... no excuses now
 
lol @ you fools fro comparing classical music to modern music. You make me laugh with glee.

Of course metal will be around in the damn distant future. It depends on how people interpret this music that determines whether or not it will have any significance that Bach/Mozart/Paganini had on the musical world. We can't automatically assume that it will so I guess we'll have to wait and see.

More to come soon.