Ordered 300 cd:s and the manufacturer fucked up the track order

Sorry to go a bit off topic here, but what software is everyone using for doing thier master cd's with pauses, IRSC codes etc? Is there something free out there that can do this?
Nero has the capability to make suitable masters including everything you mentioned. It comes with most computers so in a way it is free.
You have to navigate to the Nero directory and open Nero.exe (i think) and it will open Nero as the basic GUI that has all the "power user" functions. You don't want to use the "CD wizards" or any of the "guide you along" GUI's.
 
Nero has the capability to make suitable masters including everything you mentioned. It comes with most computers so in a way it is free.
You have to navigate to the Nero directory and open Nero.exe (i think) and it will open Nero as the basic GUI that has all the "power user" functions. You don't want to use the "CD wizards" or any of the "guide you along" GUI's.

Awesome. Thanks for the help man :kickass:
 
I'm working on a "visual audio" project, where all the song's waveforms produce cool images when viewed. Unfortunately all I've been able to produce so far are Zeppelins and Penises.

Bahahahahhahahahahahaha, gotta start somewhere :lol:
 
A brief update:

The manufacturer admitted doing the error. I asked if I could upload a cd-image file to his ftp, so we will get this thing done as soon as possible (our release date is 27th of March). They said they will reprint the 300 cd:s.
 
just out of curiosity, anyone know how much it may cost to get into pressing cd`s? I imagine if someone from the sneap forum started pressing discs, they could make a killing giving a "sneap forum" discount!
 
The manufacturer now sent me a zip-file including the mp3-files of the new master and asked for my confirmation. They sounded like they should and now the track order was right. He didn't comment anything when I asked could I send him an cd-image instead of the wave-files he already had. This all feels a bit vague and unprofessional, but at least he seems to have had a lot of clients before us, so maybe it's just an once-in-a-lifetime error.

I asked him to double-check that everything will be perfect on the final product. Now I just have to wait for the CDs and hope there will be no more new problems. Thanks for the support.
 
So you get 600 CDs? Shweet

No. I don't want to distribute CDs with incorrect track order and volume. Also, I think I will get the reprinted CDs without covers-sleeves.

But if I don't have to send the ruined CDs back, I can always sell them as promotional beer coasters and/or frisbees.
 
I see failures on both ends here.
The master you sent him was inadequate. Sending .wav files with file names is something I have never done, and would never do.

You need a "Master CD" to send. Not just "mastered" songs. I prefer DDP2.0 or if they cannot support DDP2.0 just an audio CDR with all fades, track pauses, indexes, ISRC codes, dithering, etc exactly how you want the master to be. DDP2.0 has less possibility of data corruption as compared to audio CD master. Audio CD has no sort of error correction, so make sure to use a good quality CD and burner. Also a detailed PQ sheet with all the previously mentioned info as well as contact info so the manufacturer can contact you should any problems arise.
Also mention on the PQ sheet for them to not to apply dither, or any sort of normalization, or in any way tamper with the data. If they find your master unsuitable for any reason (and they should not), they will need to explain the issue and have you correct it, not them. They replicate, not master.

Oh and don't worry about the RMS or Peak levels of what you send for replication. That should not matter to them one bit. Although it sounds like maybe they just sent you duplicates maybe, that is usually the cheapest.

What kind of bullshit is that? Sending clearly marked wav files should be the most foolproof thing you can do after sending DDP since audio cds are much more likely to contain errors than anything. At least if the files are already dithered, faded and with the right pauses between the tracks, which I assume was the case here.

I've done this a few times and one label I work with even insist on doing it this way since they don't trust the quality of cdrs. Unless you ask the pressing plant to do something specific, they should only mount the tracks in the right order and print. I can't possibly see how you can put any blame on the OP in this case.
 
What kind of bullshit is that? Sending clearly marked wav files should be the most foolproof thing you can do after sending DDP since audio cds are much more likely to contain errors than anything. At least if the files are already dithered, faded and with the right pauses between the tracks, which I assume was the case here.

I've done this a few times and one label I work with even insist on doing it this way since they don't trust the quality of cdrs. Unless you ask the pressing plant to do something specific, they should only mount the tracks in the right order and print. I can't possibly see how you can put any blame on the OP in this case.
First thing I would like to make clear is that there is a distinct difference between CD Mastering, and Audio Mastering. Just look at the word before "Mastering" and you'll see the difference. Some studios do "mastering". Usually, they are doing Audio mastering (or 2-track mastering, track mastering, etc.). CD mastering is where you get all of the Audio masters and make the final product. Obviously he did not send a CD master, that is where I believe he could have taken steps to prevent his product from getting messed up.

That "bullshit" was simply a suggestion to help the OP get a final product he needs, not everybody has DDP2.0 capability. Most everyone can make a suitable audio CD. Originally, the OP did not send a mastered CD, he left that work to the CD manufacturer (IMO a BIG no-no). To be clear I'm NOT blaming anyone. You are the one that put the word "blame" in my mouth. If anyone is to blame it would be the manufacturer. The manufacturer should have denied the wav files and asked for a proper master in a format they can use. I did say I saw failures on both ends. Unless the manufacturer said ahead of time they will take wav files. It is a non-standard practice, even if you (tgs) happen to do that.
Simply put: there are things the OP could have done to protect himself from a bad replication/duplication job. He was probably unaware of the risks involved sending wav files to an unknown super-cheap CD manufacturer. A lot of manufactures also make data-cds, I'd say he is lucky he didn't get a bunch of data CDs with wavs on them. lol
Sure, sending wav files would be nice but obviously this replication/duplication service he chose is completely inept and cannot adequately handle wav files.
Most places will accept a multitude of formats, with audio CD being the most widely accepted as long as C1/C2/jitter errors are within acceptable limits. This is why I gave the suggestion. Luckily it appears they will accept a CD image, again not standard but far better than wav files. An image is similar to sending DDP. I hope the OP makes it extremely clear he is sending an audio CD image, so they don't burn it as a data CD.

If a label is asking only for wav files, that is because they will have someone make the final master, adding the EAN/UPC, ISRC, pauses, indexes, etc themselves to be sure the glass master will have no problems. You cannot be absolutely sure the product will turn out the way you want it unless you do it yourself. I know for a fact a lot of times the data format for which the master will be is outlined in the artists recording contract as part of what the label will consider technically acceptable for "Delivered". In terms of artist delivering to the label to fulfill their contract option (along with commercially satisfactory). I have never had a label, artist, or manufacturer say one of my masters was unsatisfactory. Perhaps I hold too high of standards for my work? Maybe I can just start sending wavs, that sure as hell would save me a lot of time. lol. FFS some labels are so old fashioned (or lazy) they still want Exabyte so they don't have to transfer the DDP to Exabyte themselves for long-term master archiving. I swear some day I will throw this slow ass Exabyte drive in the dumpster. lol

OK, something I cannot let slide: how can you possibly add a pause to a wav file? Do you mean silence? That is not the same as a pause on a CD. This would pose a problem if you had songs with crossfades, if you just sent wavs the manufacturer would not know the indexes, and pauses (among all the other things previously listed). If they used the default Red Book 2-sec pause, your crossfade would have 2-sec of silence in the middle of it. A manufacturer will always default to what is Red Book standard unless you specifically ask them to break Red Book standard (such as 0 pause length for crossfade). Or you don't have to ask them to break the standard if it is contained within your CD image, on your Audio CD master, DDP, etc.

I thought I was pretty clear in my original post. I have a feeling you will still take issue with what I said here, for that I am sorry if that is indeed the case.
 
tarnationsauce2, before anything else, I am a mastering engineer, just to make that clear.

About pauses: I indeed mean silence. I usually don't use cd pauses anymore because I think it's unnecessary, and since a lot of stuff goes to mp3 nowadays I want to be sure that the composition of the albums is untarnished in the process. Most ripping programs seem to put the pauses as silence at the end of the tracks, but I won't take for granted that they do.
Of course, if a client really wants to see that pause countdown thing going on then I'll give it to them, but it's not my "default".

Most masters I make are sent out as audio cds. I use high quality burners though, burn on high quality discs, and I do quality check on all masters. All this mainly because audio cd is a fragile format. To assure the integrity of the master though, I would definitely recommend "home users" to make wav files, with silence instead of pauses, and will each track starting where the previous track ends. Why? Because the risk is pretty high that their burned masters are sub-par.

If a pressing plant - without informing the client - 1) Puts the tracks in any order other than what's indicated by the file names, 2) makes ANY changes at all to the audio, 3) adds 2 second standard pauses without the clients request to do so (not the case here, but anyway), then they are not doing their job properly.

As for the case with the label that doesn't want audio cds: they've complained about the quality of discs even though the C1 rate was way below what any pressing plant accepts, and could just as well mean that the lens on the reader they use for analysis is dirty.

All that being said, it's always a huge fucking risk to put anything at all in someone else's hands, so it's always good to include instructions for every single little detail. But I really don't see how instructions could be any clearer than naming the files "track 1", "track 2" etc in this case.
 
if its any conselation, i sent an album to Sterling sound to be mastered, with each track titled. 1 Song name 2 Songname, etc etc, AND a pro tools session with all the tracks compiled roughly how we wanted them, AND a text document explaining what we wanted, and recieved an email saying "do you have an idea of the order?" or words to that effect! not from the engineer mind....

Also what we received back via emastering was not a DDP image or individual tracks, but ONE contiguous track that i had to open in waveburner and chop up to compile the master from!

just goes to show......
 
I agree it wasn't a good decision to send wav-files instead of a cd-master. I just assumed that putting numbers 1, 2, 3 and 4 in an ascending order wouldn't be an overbearing task to anyone. I know it's a risk, but we have near to zero-budget, and we are mainly promoting our songs to attract the attention of good drummers and bass-players so we can finally start rehearsing regularly. It's still a non-profit project.

About the pauses between tracks, I especially asked that there would be no pauses between tracks, the guy said that he "needs to decode in studio, which would cost something, but this time it's free". I guess all the errors were made in that process. Also, I didn't have the chance to send them a CD-image, but I got a zip containing mp3-rip of the new master, so everything should be okay this time *knocks on the wood*
 
I see failures on both ends here.
The master you sent him was inadequate. Sending .wav files with file names is something I have never done, and would never do.

You need a "Master CD" to send. Not just "mastered" songs. I prefer DDP2.0 or if they cannot support DDP2.0 just an audio CDR with all fades, track pauses, indexes, ISRC codes, dithering, etc exactly how you want the master to be. DDP2.0 has less possibility of data corruption as compared to audio CD master. Audio CD has no sort of error correction, so make sure to use a good quality CD and burner. Also a detailed PQ sheet with all the previously mentioned info as well as contact info so the manufacturer can contact you should any problems arise.
Also mention on the PQ sheet for them to not to apply dither, or any sort of normalization, or in any way tamper with the data. If they find your master unsuitable for any reason (and they should not), they will need to explain the issue and have you correct it, not them. They replicate, not master.

Oh and don't worry about the RMS or Peak levels of what you send for replication. That should not matter to them one bit. Although it sounds like maybe they just sent you duplicates maybe, that is usually the cheapest.

That's right, in a certain way... but I like to think that if the italian masterer guy can't master properly 4 songs named "track 1" "track 2" ecc, it would fuck up any other task, won't matter how do you send stuff to him.. :D

@Xes: sono italiano pure io! E pensare che tempo fa sono capitato sul sito di questi tizi proprio per cercare una soluzione per i master... Meglio scappare ;)
 
UPDATE:

I got the reprinted CDs today. They were perfect, track order, volume and encoding were as we wanted. There's only two days to our release date, so the timing was perfect :D

Thanks for tips and support!