Question On Mixing Cymbals!!!

[ocean.abernathy]

I just bought Seraph Recording's "Seraph Drums Volume 1" pack. These are probably the best sounding samples I've ever heard this far. But, the same problem I always run into when using samples is mixing the cymbals. In his mix demos, they sound real like they were intended to. Just like all of the other samples I've heard, when I get them and try to mix them, they sound like shit. I tried using compression and various other things, but I guess I just don't know how to use compression all that well or maybe it's just something that I don't know to do. If anyone has any tips or a link to a video that could help me, it would be much appreciated!!!

 

[bryan_kilco]

I wouldn't suggest a lot of compression cymbals, personally. I never compress my cymbals (if I do, its the OH bus and very, VERY little...not even 1db).

It's more of an EQ thing with cymbals, in my experience. But others may chime in with better advice.

 

[ocean.abernathy]

Thanks for the feedback man. To be honest, part of the reason may just be because I'm only using one of the samples per hit. They include about 5 different variations of each hit. 5 hard, 5 medium, 5 soft, ect.... I have never tried to eq cymbals before. I wouldn't know where to start!

 

[blue_fAng]

It depends on your approach really. For modern modern metal, removing the overheads' low end is a must, it depends on the source but in general you'd want to cut below 400 hz as a starting point to remove mud and you might need to do an aggressive hp filter depending on the mix, also keep in mind that the overheads are meant to fill the treble of the mix. Compress only if the dynamic range is too large but since you are programming drums they probably dont need much compression

 

[ocean.abernathy]

So all in all, I should just mess around with the eq and mix up the velocity of the hits? Thanks guys for your help!

 

[Fandus]

Pasting single hits will always sound bad. Does his sample pack include .nki for kontakt? That would be your best option, otherwise if going to cut/paste route, do it over 2 tracks so the tail of the sample has room to breathe instead of being cut off with every new hit.

 

[RedDog]

You should mess around with multiple samples of that same velocity, and accents as they are used musically. Also, you should definitely mess around with posting in the right subsection of the forum.

 

[MotherEel]

Add reverb - or even better record the cymbals through your speakers, that'll give it a room sound... kind of.

 

[ocean.abernathy]

Thanks everyone for your help. Yes, they do come in nki format also. I'm very appreciative. I think I'm just going to use different velocity hits and then use a room impulse blended with them.

 

[nervirasme]

EQ: Roll off the low end below 150-200Hz, reduce the boxiness around 300-500, and eventually find the sweet spot in high end where you can emphasize the sizzle of cymbals (this usually depends on the microphone used and the cymbal itself). Compression: Definitely add it! It will prolong the sustain which is very important if you don't want to loose them in the mix, and makes the cymbal really sound fuller.

 

[Erik Monsonis]

I like them compressed and muddy for some bands... It's up to you to be creative.

 

[sbwakfk1]

Compression is tricky on overheads. Depends largely on the style of playing. If you compress too much on an up tempo song with a lot of crashes they tend to sound washy because the compression is changing the decay of the cymbals. Mid and lower tempo songs benefit more from compression on overheads. I would go with a slow attach and fast release to even out the dynamic range without affecting the overall tone too much. Choose a rather "clean" compressor. Most of your issues probably lie in the EQ of the cymbals themselves. If they truly are great samples, you shouldn't need much processing to make them sound great although, in my experience, it is REALLY hard to get sampled cymbals to sound anywhere close to real.

 

[ocean.abernathy]

The cymbals do sound great! I just have a hard time getting them to lay correctly over the rest of the drums. But, it appears that everyone is saying that messing with the eq and compression is the way to go. I just have to toy with them I suppose to get them to sound good to my ear. Thanks again for the help guys!

 

[Deuteronomy]

First of all remove all the junk below 500hz,even try some LP at 17000.
Then decrease all the annoying frequencies that have information from other instruments
4000/5000 for the vocals.
3000 can also be annoying too since it's a very sensitive frequency for the human ear.
Then compress them-I usually compress them a lot,especially for fast tempos.
And finally,don't be afraid to do ANYTHING that you think will improve their sound.

There are also other factors,like the quality of the cymbals and the sticks
Cheers

 

[PeterPaul760]

All my demo clips are bounced straight from being triggered by drumagog, so you should EASILY be able to nail the same result

I would say though, less is more! Pick samples that work better together and the mix will start to mix itself.

 

[PeterPaul760]

Thanks for the support though! Really appreciate your purchase and can't wait to start releasing the 2013 samples, lots of neat and probably overly detailed features, but I can dig it