Satan

[Grank]

What's everyones thoughts on this entity? Do you believe him to exist? If you believe he exists what role does he play in this world?

I will give my thoughts on him. I believe he does exist as well as God, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit and all the servants of each force. My primary thought on Satan's role in the universe is to lead humanity into the pit of ruin. In other words I believe that Satan wants to personally "wreck my shit" as well as yours. Jesus Christ referred to him as "the enemy".

I started this thread with the intent of discussion and debate, not to preach or insult. I am also not here to convert/sway/influence any of you, just to provoke thought.

G

 

[JontRevolting]

I know that Satan has the best tunes...my belief is that he's a metaphor for evil deeds and also a tool to scare christian boys and girls.I don't believe in personifications of good and evil,God and Satan nor an afterlife.Also I think that one could meet their own personal Satan if they perform a foul deed and find that their conscious can't handle what they've done.
My firm belief is that the human brain functions through electric pulses created by the human heart,once the heart ceases so does the brain,people tend to use out of body experience as a sign of the afterlife and greater powers but i'd say those experiences are hallucinations brought on by changes the brain goes through prior to death.

 

[Thoth-Amon]

That's an interting point of view Grank... but I'm hanging out with Satan and Jesus Christ right now... and yeah Jesus did say that Satan was "the enemy" but he was mostly just pissed because Satan hadn't returned his copy of Obituary's "Cause of Death". Now that that has been remedied they're buds again... water under the bridge. In fact we're all chillin' to some Deicide and eating tacos right now. You should come over!

 

[Grank]

That's an interting point of view Grank... but I'm hanging out with Satan and Jesus Christ right now... and yeah Jesus did say that Satan was "the enemy" but he was mostly just pissed because Satan hadn't returned his copy of Obituary's "Cause of Death". Now that that has been remedied they're buds again... water under the bridge. In fact we're all chillin' to some Deicide and eating tacos right now. You should come over!

LOL, I got a good chuckle out of that...

There are some people in this world that would totally flip out had they been addressed in that manner. I like your attitude and sense of humor.

 

[Thoth-Amon]

LOL, I got a good chuckle out of that...

There are some people in this world that would totally flip out had they been addressed in that manner. I like your attitude and sense of humor.

good to hear! but you totally missed out... TACO NIGHT!

 

[Thoth-Amon]

but in all seriousness... back to the topic...
I'm a big fan of the Bible TBH... while parts of it are very monotonous and dull other parts of it rank amongst the world's greatest literature. It is an interesting mish-mash of various genres: history, myth, legend, psalmody, apocalypticism, et al. That being said while I personally believe that Jesus Christ was a historical figure I do not believe in the Judeo/Christian deity nor in Satan.

 

[Dak]

The irony of the situation is the "Judeo-Christian" diety does not approve of either Judaism or Christianity, as per the Bible.

 

[Thoth-Amon]

The irony of the situation is the "Judeo-Christian" diety does not approve of either Judaism or Christianity, as per the Bible.

well according to your interpretation of said text. I'm sure the various members of the various denominational and non-denominational 'sects' would disagree with that.
anyway... i suppose that's not really the point of this thread.

 

[Kara-Shehr]

but in all seriousness... back to the topic...
I'm a big fan of the Bible TBH... while parts of it are very monotonous and dull other parts of it rank amongst the world's greatest literature. It is an interesting mish-mash of various genres: history, myth, legend, psalmody, apocalypticism, et al. That being said while I personally believe that Jesus Christ was a historical figure I do not believe in the Judeo/Christian deity nor in Satan.

In terms of pieces of literature that follow a monomyth formula I prefer J.R.R Tolkien's Middle Earth universe over the Bible. Although the Bible does have it's moments of brilliance, I feel like the story doesn't get completely interesting until Revelations.

 

[Dak]

On topic: I basically agree with the OP. Lucifer is interested in one thing, and that is the suffering and degradation of everything that YHWH created, especially man.

He already knows he won't "win", but like any "sore loser", wants to drag as many down with him as possible.


@Thoth: Not really. I have attempted to debate with people from various "sects" regarding scripture and they inevitabley have to start referencing books other than the Bible to back up their doctrine, which is instantly invalidating. I could go into specific detail in multiple places where the Bible is very clear that the practices and doctrines of Judaism (Based on the Talmud, not even Torah), and Christianity (based on twistings of select passages in Paul's writings which, by twisting, directly contradict everything else he wrote, not to mention the rest of the Bible) are repulsive to YHWH.

 

[Korona]

@ Kara - the redemption of all humanity through an act of total self-sacrifice isn't 'interesting' to you? eish tough crowd...

@ OP relegating religious characters to the status of "entity" is a wrong turn right out of the gate. Religion isn't about things we can relate to objectively. Thinking of it that way really is a critical misunderstanding.

If you try to populate the world with religious figures you end up with Paradise Lost and look at what happens there - despite Milton's best efforts the Devil ends up the hero.

 

[Thoth-Amon]

@Thoth: Not really. I have attempted to debate with people from various "sects" regarding scripture and they inevitabley have to start referencing books other than the Bible to back up their doctrine, which is instantly invalidating. I could go into specific detail in multiple places where the Bible is very clear that the practices and doctrines of Judaism (Based on the Talmud, not even Torah), and Christianity (based on twistings of select passages in Paul's writings which, by twisting, directly contradict everything else he wrote, not to mention the rest of the Bible) are repulsive to YHWH.

You do have a point. Afterall most 'Christians' and 'Jews' commit abominations to God such as planting a field with more than one type of seed or wearing clothing made of more than one type of thread:

"Do not sow a field of yours with two different kinds of seed; and do not put on a garment woven with two different kinds of thread" (Lev. 19:19).

BTW you might want to check the label on your shirt to see what its made of... could be polyfiber!

 

[Dak]

Obviously you find such "petty" commandments amusing, but looking at it from the other perspective, an all-knowing benevolent diety had a legitimate purpose for the command. If you believe yourself the end-all then who cares about some words in a book, even if they are from a diety.

Either way, nothing in Torah is as ridiculous as some of the observances of Orthodox Jews. Deut 14:21 says not to boil a kid(goat/lamb) in it's mothers milk. Jewry takes this so far as not to let any meat and milk touch period, going as far as having seperate dishes and fridges, and if wealthy, having seperate kitchens. The commandment was straightforward and direct, why all the extra BS?

 

[Thoth-Amon]

Obviously you find such "petty" commandments amusing, but looking at it from the other perspective, an all-knowing benevolent diety had a legitimate purpose for the command. If you believe yourself the end-all then who cares about some words in a book, even if they are from a diety.

I've never said I was the end-all of anything. If in fact the Bible were a divine revelation I would care a great deal about it.
Of course if you start with the ASSUMPTION that the bible is a divine and inerrant revelation then of course you would have accept whatever it says as true, no matter how obviously ridiculous it is. Millions of non-Christians do this with their holy books too. If however you look at it from a neutral perspective and apply critical thinking to it you will find that the bible is riddled with all of the same kinds of problems, errors and nonsense that other supposedly divinely inspired texts have. I bet you that if Lev. 19:19 were not in the bible but was in the Koran or the Book of Mormon or the Vedas you'd laugh your ass off about it and wouldn't hesitate to point out what ridiculouse superstitious nonsense it is. But because its in the bible and you have an emotional commitment to that book you blindly accept it as God's word and simply say "well God knows best who are you to judge".

 

[Dak]

I actually don't accept all 66 books as chosen by the Catholic church as inspired. But I do accept Torah (among other things). I am also not so blind as to suggest that there aren't errors in translation from one language to another.

I wouldn't attempt to convince anyone of the authenticity of YHWH, since He definitely has to get your attention. I had something akin to a "Paul" moment while in Iraq (no I wasn't under fire, quite the opposite). I was about as far from "religious" at the time as I could be (and still am, but in a different way).

So I guess I could be accused of hearing things, but the voice was very helpful in everything it has suggested (so far)

 

[Jimmy... Dead.]

Satan, as well as God, does not exist. They are abstractions.

The only meaning is your own.

...and as far as metal goes, Satan represents rebellion to any intelligent band.

 

[Dak]

But if Satan is supporting the status quo, could not God be Rebellion instead?

 

[JontRevolting]

 

[Thoth-Amon]

Id be interested in seeing your basis for determining the canon then.

 

[Dak]

Id be interested in seeing your basis for determining the canon then.

Pretty much "thus said the Lord" I consider inspired , once checked against the original Hebrew. Everything else is history, or commentary/perspective. There is a vast difference between useful and "inspired".