Significant Upgrades? Help me out

[RCW]

Hey everyone,
I have been checking out this forum for about last half year. I don't believe I have posted before but have some questions I need answered. I am at the point where I have been pretty happy with the sound I have been getting from my gear but now it just doesn't cut it anymore. So I am looking to make some upgrades but I really need help understanding what will make the most impact on the quality of sound of my recordings. Here are some of the things I plan to upgrade one day but help me set some priorities so I know what will make the most difference.

1. DRUM TRIGGERS: I have always used drumagog over mic recorded drum tracks with mild success and a LOT of editing. I am hoping to get a set of triggers and use them straight into my preamps feeding drumagog tracks. I am thinking this will be a lot more accurate if I plan to completely sample replace anyway and require a little less editing. Is this correct thinking?

2. INTERFACE: I am currently using a MOTU 828mk3 and 8pre. These have been great since I have had them but I am suddenly realizing there is a difference between high end consumer gear and pro gear. I feel like the sound I get from these pieces is airy and very digital with no warmth at all. Is this the converters in them, I use the stock preamps on drums and other sources. Should I upgrade to a new interface such as a pro tools le rig or something similar?

3. PREAMPS: The only preamps I use besides the ones in my MOTU units are an Art Tube MP and a Studio Projects VTB-1. I know these aren't great but would something like a Universal Audio pre or something more expensive get a much better sound? Would this add the warmth I have been looking for?

4. DAW/SOFTWARE: I use reaper with several standard plugins. My main question is reapers rendering process. In other words, when I render a mix to a wav file. Is this process as good in reaper as it is in cubase or logic or other daw programs? Is there something different about reaper that wouldn't yeild a good result. I am fairly certain I understand dither, bit depths, and other related things but is the process itself good?

5. MICROPHONES: I use very few mics. I use sm57s on most of the drums, audix d6 on kick, and some shure pencil condensors for overheads. I use sm57 for guitar. I use a Shure SM7B for vocals. I don't really think this is a weak spot because I am pretty good about getting mic placement right and using the right mics for the right applications. Please tell if this is a sure fire sign of bad quality but I don't think I am far off here.

Hopefully you guys can give me some insight. Take it easy as well please because I know I still have a lot to learn on the engineering side of things as far as recording tighter arrangements and editing. I mostly just refering to overall sound quality.

To hear my work so you can get a reference to what I am talking about visit http://www.myspace.com/greyskullstudio and check out any of the songs on my player.

Thanks SO MUCH for any help or opinions!
Rory

 

[Trevoire520]

1. DRUM TRIGGERS: Yep, triggers will give you much more accurate triggering compared to mic'd tracks as triggers have almost no spill.

2. INTERFACE: Converters will not give you warmth. Thats more often gained from nice analogue outboard. You could possibly get an improvement in preamps by upgrading your interface, but you'll have to spend alot of money to get a significant upgrade.

3. PREAMPS: A decent preamp might get you the warmth you're looking for. Probably something tube based would be best (ART MPAII maybe?) have a search on Gearslutz as those guys are VERY into their preamps.

4. DAW/SOFTWARE: Rendering and summing in all DAW's is identical. At it's core it's just maths at work so it is very accurate and repeatable. There have been null tests done to prove that all DAW's sum the same.

5. MICROPHONES: Your mic's are fine. 57's on snare and toms are good enough for Andy, the D6 is considered THE kick mic around here. As is the SM7B on vocals. 57's are also standard on guitar amps.

All in though you seem set man. The thing I find odd is your quest for warmth, as it's not something most people tend to aim for in metal production.
Really though, your setup is fine, just grab some triggers and you should be sorted.
One thing you didn't mention though. Hows you monitoring? Have you got acoustic treatment sorted? Basically everyone here will agree that sorting out your acoustics is the single biggest upgrade you can do. There's no point in having all this nice gear if you can't hear what it's doing properly.

 

[greyskull]

you stole my home studio name.
damn you.

 

[RCW]

1. DRUM TRIGGERS: Yep, triggers will give you much more accurate triggering compared to mic'd tracks as triggers have almost no spill.

2. INTERFACE: Converters will not give you warmth. Thats more often gained from nice analogue outboard. You could possibly get an improvement in preamps by upgrading your interface, but you'll have to spend alot of money to get a significant upgrade.

3. PREAMPS: A decent preamp might get you the warmth you're looking for. Probably something tube based would be best (ART MPAII maybe?) have a search on Gearslutz as those guys are VERY into their preamps.

4. DAW/SOFTWARE: Rendering and summing in all DAW's is identical. At it's core it's just maths at work so it is very accurate and repeatable. There have been null tests done to prove that all DAW's sum the same.

5. MICROPHONES: Your mic's are fine. 57's on snare and toms are good enough for Andy, the D6 is considered THE kick mic around here. As is the SM7B on vocals. 57's are also standard on guitar amps.

All in though you seem set man. The thing I find odd is your quest for warmth, as it's not something most people tend to aim for in metal production.
Really though, your setup is fine, just grab some triggers and you should be sorted.
One thing you didn't mention though. Hows you monitoring? Have you got acoustic treatment sorted? Basically everyone here will agree that sorting out your acoustics is the single biggest upgrade you can do. There's no point in having all this nice gear if you can't hear what it's doing properly.

Thanks so much for the reply! It's not so much that I am trying to get an extremely warm sound really, but the fact is that there really seems to be none present. I just want to add thickness/texture that I hear in pro recordings. I think I will start with a nicer tube preamp. I am also going to check out some tube emulation plugins and various other things like that. Also, I use guitar rig 3 religiously (I know this is terrible) and I feel like I need an upgrade. What can you recommend? What seems to be the hot new modeling software as far as guitar tone goes?

 

[RCW]

you stole my home studio name.
damn you.

HAHA, I have seen you as a member on here for a while now. I checked out the studio where you work. NICEEEE! My friends and I decided that was the name after nothing extremely professional or meaningful came to mind. No hard feelings I hope.

 

[greyskull]

naaaaaaaaah

 

[Harry Hughes]

Thanks so much for the reply! It's not so much that I am trying to get an extremely warm sound really, but the fact is that there really seems to be none present. I just want to add thickness/texture that I hear in pro recordings. I think I will start with a nicer tube preamp. I am also going to check out some tube emulation plugins and various other things like that. Also, I use guitar rig 3 religiously (I know this is terrible) and I feel like I need an upgrade. What can you recommend? What seems to be the hot new modeling software as far as guitar tone goes?

Do a search around here, there is some threads about saturation plug ins.
As for amp modeling, POD Farm, 8505, Revalver, 7170, and a whole bunch of others are good, it just depends on what tonal characteristics you want

 

[AboutBlank]

Really nice workshop:

http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/production-tips/509526-making-your-tracks-sound-larger.html

Greetz

 

[jeid]

One thing you didn't mention though. Hows you monitoring? Have you got acoustic treatment sorted? Basically everyone here will agree that sorting out your acoustics is the single biggest upgrade you can do. There's no point in having all this nice gear if you can't hear what it's doing properly.

I upgraded my monitors and did some acoustic treatment, two of the best upgrades ever. I agree with Trev, this will make a big difference to what you hear.

 

[crillemannen]

Do acoustic treatment for your room, thats the most important for you atm.

If you need more inputs i really recommend the Focusrite Octopre LE if your on a budget, if not then go with API,Neve or like me Crane song Spider.

I get bye using Sm57 on snare and toms, you got the kick covered i can really recommend the Oktava mk-012 for overheads. If you have more money to spend get the Shure KSM141 for OH, really nice high end.

I feel you can do allot of upgrades before hitting new converters, but if you want to commit and invest Lynx Aurora is really nice high end converters, but there are tons of alternatives that will move you sideways'

Cheers