The Metal Vocals primer and Q&A

[ahjteam]

tl;dr: I want to take some singing lessons, any suggestions where to start?

Few questions:

1)

I am one of those persons who needs goals to get somewhere and I decided that by the time I'm 30, I want to learn to sing properly enough so I can demo all the vocals for my songs without having to autotune vocals to hell and back to make it not sound like torture or so that I could sing in a choir (not that I would, but anyway). Since I'm 27 now, I have ~3 years. I consider myself a total newbie at singing because I lacked the confidence to do it for the first 26 years of my life, but lately I grabbed myself from the neck and just started singing, made covers of Jenna Rose, Rebecca Black and the Eurovision song contest winner song and it felt great. I noticed that I can hold and sing long notes in pitch or at least at 1 semitone ballpark, but changing notes goes way off key because I don't have a good control over my voice and diaphragm.

At this point I am primarily interested in learning just how to sing with no bullshit. Just pure clean singing. Then with time later add some rasp to the voice if possible (I don't smoke or do drugs and only drink seldomly). Learning how to scream is a plus, but not a requirement for me.

2)

Reference video:



I have a really weird gap in my singing range, but what makes it weird is that I can talk in that gap, but not sing in it. My talking voice is relatively deep, but I sing at a tenor range (now that I think if of it, Freddie Mercury did have a really deep talking voice and a really high singing voice).

I can do like really low cookie monster type vocals from the diaphragm and then sing at higher pitch (with sub par performance, but semi-irrelevant on the subject), but then I have this range that the Switchfoot's singer uses in the video is what I can't use. Around 0:30 in this video the singer starts to sing, but I cant sing that low but I can talk at that pitch. For some reason when I try to sing from the diaphraghm it automatically goes higher. I can sing the chorus tho (but for some reason I hear it in my head higher than the singer in the song, or maybe it just seems so because I hear it louder).

3)

Where do you live? Since I highly doubt that you live in Finland, getting face to face lessons might not be an option, but do you teach over Skype? And if yes, how much do you charge (answer in PM if you don't want to do it in public)?

 

[Extreme Vocals]

Thanks for the welcome and discussion. I’m going to try to get part 2 up tomorrow. Until then, I’ll answer some of the posts in the thread. If you asked a question, etc, I’ll go in order below.

ALivingSight-
Glad to see our taking your voice seriously and have some dedication. It’s rare these days. I’m not going to lecture anyone about their lifestyle, but here are some things to consider. You said smoking hasn’t affected you. You have no real way to know that. Just because you made progress doesn’t mean it wouldn’t have been better or faster without smoking. I could drive 2 miles with my emergency brake on and say “see, no problem, I made progress.” Had it not been on however, I would have done better, and not have caused damage to my car that may not show up until further down the road.

Since you can’t compare what would have been, you don’t know for sure. The other thing, and what I would caution most about is, don’t mistake a lack of symptoms for not getting damage. You’re right in that people’s bodies react different. Some rebel immediately and some take abuse for a while and then suddenly show serious damage.
There can also be things going on that you don’t immediately see. Heat and fumes being sucked though your cords and into your lung is damaging. There is no way for it not to. It can come back to haunt you after a while when nodes, etc, pop up and as you can’t feel them until they are prominent, you can’t tell they are there until it’s already a serious issue. Again, just something to think about. I hope your approach works out for you and you continue to progress.

Forherdeadeyes-
Sorry to hear you’re having so much trouble. I would recommend going back to the Zen of screaming and working through the exercises whether you think they help your scream or not. Screaming and clean singing (I don’t make a distinction) both rely on relaxed vocal production and solid practice. Any good exercises will benefit your voice even if you’re not making gritty tones at the time. Remember, if you want to drive fast, you still have to take the time to learn how to drive stick smoothly. I’ll be doing some tips on vocal booths and practicing in part two, so check it out. It may help.

P-E
1.Yes, you can alter the pitch of the scream, if you can do one, you can definitely do the other.
2.What you describe is a common thing and can be due to several factors. I’ll due a short list below and it should help people understand why I say you can’t train someone in vocals via youtube video, forums, or any instruction where the coach can’t hear you and examine your physiology. There’s no substitute for one on one work.

A.
You could be using to much throat constriction adding excessive pressure and preventing transition
B.
You could be compressing the upper chest causing breathing imbalance
C.
Your sense of high notes actually being high, as in height can be causing you to react by squeezing and reaching and causing undue tension and constriction.
D.
You could have a psychological tie that makes you feel like lightening the pressure on your voice is light or feminine and is blocking you from relaxing enough to get a larger and thicker resonance.

There are more things that could cause it as well. I think you can see how it would be impossible for me to diagnose accurately without working directly with the vocalist. As I said though, it is a common issue and getting some time in with a good trainer should fix you up. It’s entirely fixable.

MondoLikeMetal-
I’ll cover inhale screaming a bit in part two, but here’s the basics. I have nothing against it, but don’t teach it. I can do it, but have never heard a sound I couldn’t get normally, so I don’t bother. I’ve never seen anything on long term effects, so I can’t advise on that one. My issue is usually that changing back to exhale based production feels weird, and feels kind of like suddenly jamming my car into reverse while driving. It just seems awkward.
As far as rating a scream, I can do that now. If it works for you and you like it, I rate it a ten! I’ve had people ask me to do this and honestly it’s completely subjective.

What I like to hear in screaming may not be your thing at all. What I like isn’t always what seems to be in right now. So your opinion is all that matters. As far as if I heard something I thought might cause you trouble, I can say if I hear it, but without working with you, I wouldn’t be able to help or want to risk shooting blind for the reasons I mentioned in part one and my other responses.

Thanks for the welcome. I hope some of this helps you, or at least gives some insight into training.

Melb shredder-
Good to see you are out there doing it. You have the experience of reality that hits many of these “I learned screaming in two seconds and joined a band” guys when the rigors of the road and studio hit them like a cinderblock. You’re perseverance and dedication sound like they are paying off. Cheers.

Arnaud! –
Good to see you as well. Thanks the gracious compliment. I had a great time working with you as well. It was fun.

Your point is right that the right training works for clean and gritty vocals. I’ll be addressing that more in part two. Many people consider them two different things and they aren’t. That’s definitely something I think needs to be covered as it creates allot of problems in how people approach their training.

You’re dead on with the fact that you drink and breathe with two different passages that don’t allow fluids to touch the voice. The overwhelming amounts of these singers’ formulas, special teas, etc are snake oil. They are more placebo than anything else. Some actually contain numbing agents that make you feel like your throat is getting soothed when it’s just not feeling the trauma you’re then convinced you can hit it with. What crap!

Abberation-
I damaged the hell out of myself and know your pain. I did it so bad I lost my voice completely for 2 weeks and then could only make creaky, frog like speech for a couple of months. I was actually told I would never do vocals again. That is what got me into seeking out how to do this stuff in a healthy way, which was a long process with allot of bullshit artists, and learning speech therapy and physiology.
The body has a muscle memory made to protect you. If it’s been a while and you still have issues I get the feeling it has allot to do with your body bracing for impact trying to prevent you from doing what you did before. It may be worth a single visit to an ENT or throat specialist to verify if there is any unknown trauma, and then you should be able to do your thing and get back to howling like a madman! Just look at it as a new a vocal approach and mindset. Voice 2.0 if you will!

Jevil-
There is no shortcut to good vocals. Just because you can scream doesn’t mean its good screaming! (That’s not directed at you. Never heard you and you could be killer!) Most people hear the grit and think that’s the end of it. Definitely check out my next Q&A post. It addresses this subject exactly. Screaming is a form of singing. They are not two different things. They rely on 90% of the same function. Besides, we all know the true shortest way to sing in a band. Be good looking. And brainless!

Maamar Hug –
Rock on with that my NMOBHM brutha! I’m amazed at how this stuff has made such resurgence. I saw it a few years back and to be honest kind of wrote it off. I did it for a long time and always loved that style, but thought it had run its course. I had the pleasure of working with James Luna of the band Holy Grail for quite a while. He would bring me demos to work on and I though “people are doing this again”? I had no idea how big it had become until a little later. He’s belting those high notes at Wacken and Castle Donnington so I guess it’s kind of popular again!

MaellaJohn-
I would argue screaming isn’t dumb, at least not if you’re doing it well. It’s like anything, it can be dumbed down, but so can singing or rapping. I would consider this – do you think it’s possible that you were able to get screaming easier since you didn’t see it as so far out of reach, and you weren’t as inhibited? Just a thought.

As far as hating your voice, Welcome to vocals! Almost everyone does! It’s the most common complaint from vocalists. Voice is a personal issue and we take it personally. Got a shit guitar tone? Bad guitar. Got a shit vocal sound- You suck! Or at least, that’s how we see it. I know of some singers with long pro careers who still have trouble listening back to their own tracks and need a producer to tell them when it’s done.

Yes, you can vary the sound of you tone and improve on it. Getting good training and practice habits will add in increased range, resonance and a wider range of available tone variances.

You should combine it with coming to terms with what you sound like and do best. Singing has a huge bit to do with psychology, and fearing the sound creates tension and results in a poor performance becoming a self fulfilling prophecy. Everyone has an individual tone, that’s what makes you awesome. Funny thing is, so many singers that hate their voice have tons of fans who love it. It’s really up to them. You can’t be the performer and the audience. You have to pick one. Their reaction may surprise you.

AHJTeam-
1.Congrats on kicking yourself in the ass. No reason at all you can’t do it. I don’t see a direct question here, but more a list of symptoms. From what I can tell they are fairly common.

2.Again, what you’re describing is really common, especially with men and tenors. The majority of the time it’s due to improper breathing, too much velocity causing the voice to “top out” at a certain point, making you leap to a different positioning to continue, and possibly from doing a song in a key that highlights where your troublesome transitions are. Could relate to a few other things as well. If you can speak it on pitch, you can sing it. All singing, speaking and screaming are functions of the same thing. If you can do one, you can do the others.

3.I live in Los Angeles and New Orleans. I also teach, but less often out of the Boston area.

I do online sessions allot actually. I’ve worked with people in quite a few regions and gotten good results. My rates can be found under the vocal training and online session section of my site - Extremevocals.com or just drop me a line at info@extremevocals.com. If you email, mention that you spoke directly to me, so my assistant will forward it to me to handle myself. I’ll look forward to talking with you about your singing.

Wow, this turned out to be quite a chunk! I hope I got to everyone, and covered some new ground for those reading. I’ll try and get the second Q&A up ASAP.
Thanks again for the welcome, I’m enjoying the discussion.

 

[P-E]

Thanks A LOT, seriously, you answering all of these is amazing!

I'll be reading the second Q&A for sure!

 

[locus_coeruleus]

Even though I have my own opinion on Melissa Cross' videos, what's your opinion on them?

 

[Mago]

great read man and welcome to the forum!

One thing I noticed while reading through it tho is that you missed out on breathing techniques for screams growls. As far as I understood they are they same as for normal singing, and imo its quite an important part to get that right first...at least it helped me making a major leap forward with harsh vocals after I understood how to breath for it.

and my thoughts for the "Q: How do I get a scream like_____ from ______?" are not really to say you cant scream like that guy, more like you wont SOUND like that guy. If you want to extent your vocal screaming range it can help to listen to other guys to understand HOW he does it.
But I agree about the part that its hard to not force oneself into the wrong direction by trying to imitate somthing you cant do because your voice maybe fits better for other styles, or your not ready for that kind of stuff yet.
careful experimenting is a good way for that imo...

The only tip I like to give people who asked me how I do it is to not force themselves to anything, and to be relaxed and not to build up any kind of physical or mental pressure.
I understood that during the first few times I recorded myself, because the more I wanted it to sound in any specific way the more tighened up I've become and the harder it got to get anything good out. Also lead to some headache because of bad breathing.
I dunni if I could do a few gigs in a row yet because we dont gig that much, but rehearsals and recording session a few times a week I am able to do without any kind of pain or tiredness so.

so thats just my .02c about that topic and your FAQ


oh yeah and I also have one question:
I think I read somewhere that for females with higher pitched voices its not a good idea to start screaming because their chords arent strong enough or something, whats about that? Sounded quite strange too me tho

 

[Jevil]

I would really like to sing..

I play guitar and sing (clean singing) in front of 2.000 or 3.000 people, I can intonate perfectly, i don't need a fucking autotune in my recordings, but my vocal texture is like shit, very low pitched like a baritone... kinda Rammstein.
As I play in a parody band nobody really cares of the vocals, they just want metal and funny things on stage, but actually I would like to improve and be able to sing higher notes, my range is low and narrow. I would also like to include some grit on my vocals cause it is too clean.

 

[aberration]

Wow, Rodney, loving this discussion. It honestly never occurred to me that the damage I'd done wasn't permanent. Looks like I'd better give you a call on Skype!

 

[LeSedna]

I've taken courses with a teacher who likes modern music, so he sings rock and likes metal too, it was the best experience ever. I still have a LOT to learn, but i recommend it to anyone.

I would have one question for you Rodney : for those high pitches in the first scream of this video, which are the signature of peter tagtgren :



Does he mix "fry" scream with high pitched singing notes ?

Another example that would be close is Devin Townsend, he often does a similar sound like in this one, at 3:00 :



Is there a specific technique or is that simply high notes with a dirty or fry general sound ?

 

[LunyAlex]

I must say I love the thread.
Very useful tips.
I'm mainly a guitarist, but I've started screaming a few months ago inspired by the sheer amazingness that is (IMO) Randy Blythe (expect many to disagree). But I'm not trying to copy him or anything, trying to get my own style going.
Watched the Zen of Screaming. I understood a lot of it but weird thing is, after doing the suggested vocal warmups, I forget how to scream, haha. I might be misunderstanding the exercises though.
What I've noticed works good for me is to start out with singing a clean song that's very comfortable for my range (I think I'm a bass-baritone), then working my way through songs that are progressively harder. Then after 20 minutes I Usually am able to scream decently.

Still, my problem would be : Sometimes I can scream, sometimes I can't. I guess it's all about practice and persisting to memorize that perfect muscle control, but it's like on different days my throat sets itself into different "presets", and sometimes those presets aren't good.
When my scream isn't that good, it's either too empty, breathless and bassy Or cracking and very thin.
Only like 50% of the time can I get to that fine harsh texture I really love that's right in between.
Any tips on getting to that fine texture faster or does that fall into the category of things that require you to physically interact with the screamer?

Need to note that although I don't know what technique I use or if I'm warming up properly, my screams don't hurt 80% of the time and when I notice they do even the slightest bit, I stop immediately. (A bit paranoid about busting my voice).

Thanks in advance and thanks for this highly informative thread.

 

[Fama]

Awesome threads like this are the reason this forum is so great.

 

[guitarguru777]

true but not too hot. Anything from room temperature to kinda warm is what you want to use, especially with water. Too hot and it can cause you to sweat a little (if you're not already) therefore actually depleting any hydration benefits you were getting

As for tea, only decaf

+1000000000000000

Never drink COLD water as it will tighten the chords. Tepid / Room Temperature is the way to go. Dont drink anything caffeinated and avoid beverages with a lot of sugar (natural or otherwise) as they will cause coating on the chords.

 

[Extreme Vocals]

A quick note. If I don’t see something that looks like a direct question for me, I’ll just assume it’s commentary in the thread, so don’t think I just passed you buy if I don’t address it.

I’m pretty sure I’ll be able to get part two up later. I didn’t expect to get so much response so quickly so I’ve decided to do a part three. It will cover my general thoughts, opinions, etc and will amount to the conversation I wish most students would have with me, or even with themselves before getting into screaming or pursuing training.

Locus coeruleus-
If you already have your own thoughts on it, mine are probably going to be irrelevant. I will cover ZOS and a few other metal coaches etc, in parts two and three. It should cover it pretty well. Thanks for the question. I do get it a lot.

Mago-
Thanks for the welcome. I didn’t miss breathing. I will cover it some in the later volumes. Remember though, I’m not trying to train people in technique in the thread, just offering insight and combating misconception. The idea is to answer the most often asked questions. I rarely get asked about breathing. You and I both know they should be asking though!

As far as the women screaming thing, my answer can come in the form of a single word- BULLSHIT! And to prove my point, if you have ever been the sorry bastard who was caught in between two approaching teenage girls at a mall who hadn’t seen each other in longer than week, you know the two girl banshee shriek that immediately ensues. If you can manage to keep your hearing and manhood intact after that and still argue that girls can’t scream, you’re lost.
Anyone with a female child who has had a toy taken away knows that girls are natural screamers. Not necessarily a good thing for our sanity, but proof none the less.

Jevil-
Singers always seem to hate their own voice. Do you know how many students I have that desperately wish they were baritones? A LOT! If you truly are a baritone, you can sing higher notes. They will not sound like a tenor or soprano though. You might a very unique quality to your voice and can offer things by controlling tone and delivery that get across the same intensity. Besides, Barry White was a baritone and he is considered “panty remover” by quite a lot of women! Grit is accessible too. Remember that Phil Anselmo and Randy Blythe are both baritones as well.

Aberration-
You’re welcome to drop me a line. If you feel like you want to find out your options before doing a full session, etc, You can do a consultation and get a roadmap of your options, find out how to proceed, etc. I’ll look forward to hearing from you.

LeSedna-
Ah, I knew it would happen eventually! A new round of “guess that scream”! I get this a lot. I’ll be doing a couple comparisons in part two so people can ID most of what they hear. As far as your examples, Peter has excellent control, and yes, it’s a mix. For others reading, noticed how the guy isn’t blowing tons of air or “screaming” like you would in traffic or an argument? Looks controlled doesn’t it? Great example.

As far as Devin- he’s, well, DEVIN FUCKING TOWNSEND! What a voice! In the piece you mention he is doing the same thing. He does fry the majority of the time for his screams and a different function for his gritty singing.

LunyAlex,
It’s possible that the way you are understanding grit is not placed correctly and as your voice warms up / moves into position, you are losing your footing. If your screaming is inconsistent it’s almost always due to lack of breath control. The breathy cracking thing is usually a tell tale sign, but I can’t be exactly positive. As I mentioned before, I can’t teach over text, etc, but reading some of the answers and Q&A may spark something for you. There’s more to come, Hope it helps. Stay tuned.

Thanks again for the discussion. I’ll be back with Part two shortly.

 

[LeSedna]

Yes, it's obvious in my examples the flow of air is controlled. It's basic singing technique (breathe/blow control) applied to a special effect.

One of the best advices I could give from my little experience is that the best way to loose time is to try to copy 100% of another singer's voice, because you can't. And the best thing is to find your own confort zone, and find a nice tone out of it. I've discovered I can do some things decents and some other badly, and trying to go against that, except for practice or experiments, is a waste of time for most parts.

About devin, yeah, it's obvious it's another league. I just listened to this one again this afternoon, what a demo : [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sl64-xfewrk&feature=related[/ame]

 

[Extreme Vocals]

Lesedna,
You will often find the difference in between things you suck at and things you're good at is just the right knowledge and some practice, so keep at the weak points, you may suprise yourself.

I also agree though, you have to rely on you're strengths, accept them, and as you evolve you may change style and that's good thing. Personally I'm getting pretty tired of vocalists that rest on thier achievements and never seem to change no matter how many albums they do!

 

[Fox Mulder]

Lesedna,
You will often find the difference in between things you suck at and things you're good at is just the right knowledge and some practice, so keep at the weak points, you may suprise yourself.

I also agree though, you have to rely on you're strengths, accept them, and as you evolve you may change style and that's good thing. Personally I'm getting pretty tired of vocalists that rest on thier achievements and never seem to change no matter how many albums they do!

True that.

Rodney,
Is it true that practicing high-octave falsettos (mildly forced) is a good practice for increasing chest-voice range?

 

[NoDestiny]

Rodney,

This advice is priceless. Thank you for taking the time to do this for us. I do have a question for ya, though.

Could you explain what your recommendation to practice/show/recording vocal warm-ups would be? I never really "warm up" but would like to, but want to do it properly if I'm going to do it at all.

 

[Plankis]

True that.

Rodney,
Is it true that practicing high-octave falsettos (mildly forced) is a good practice for increasing chest-voice range?

First:


You really don't increase your chestrange, sure you can force it by pulling it up but that will sound terrible and damage your voice.
What you do instead is to gradually blend in your headvoice as you go higher, this range where this transition occurs is called mixed voice. Blending is easier said than done of course. But that's how the great singers do it.

Singing Success has worked great for me and my singing. I like how easy and effective it is. Just pop in a cd, listen, browse Sneapforum, mimic the exercises, done.

 

[Paulie!]

Rodney:
If you're Lowest/Highest comfortably projected note is around the F#2/F#5 is there a well accepted way to get up to around an A5? Basically I can get up to around where I'd like to be but then when I'm doing high harmonies I can't quite get there (unless I reeeeally strain, and that's just not something I like doing..)

Also, what is the best technique for cleaning up high head voice vocals (I seem to get more grit up there without even trying, where as I have a problem with getting grit in lower ranges.)

 

[Djentkitty]

A lot of very useful info/advice here, thank you kind sir for posting this awesome guide!

 

[Extreme Vocals]

Maamar Hug-
As I mentioned before, not just in screaming, but in all singing, force = bad idea. What you could be referring to is using a larger resonance, etc, But I can’t know that without seeing how you’re doing it.

Any exercise will benefit you across the board. If you do yoga, your flexibility and core strength will benefit your weight training etc. Same idea.
I actually don’t use terms like chest, head, falsetto, etc. I find they cause more issues than they solve. One of the big issues for allot of people is getting rid of the idea that pitch, etc has an actually position in height.

When you say high or low, or chest or head, people will do all kinds of problematic things to try to physically reach that place. When a person strains for a high note, they pinch their throat, crane their neck, eyebrows go up, and they look up, trying to reach this non- existent position in space.
I have also never seen a picture of “chest chords” or “head chords” You have one voice.
If you work on it from the idea of having a powerful center that you can lean in different directions with, I find people make faster progress and eliminate strain much quicker. When I do a death growl, I project it from the exact same place I do a Rob Halford style shriek. Both are comfortable, I don’t strain and the tone is way larger than when I used to think of one as head / falsetto and the other as chest.

No Destiny-

There are tons of warm ups out there and if you decide to get into training any decent coach will give you a routine based on your specific needs. However you can’t go wrong with lip bubbles. They are as old as the hills and still useful. You can find free scales and instruction on doing them all over the web. Be sure to do them in a comfortable range. It isn’t an exercise or competition, just something to warm up.

Most people neglect a cool down after. This is crucial. Take some time after a show and do them again. Get yourself hydrated, AND THEN talk to people. After a show never talk loud or yell to people. It’s a common way to screw yourself after a show of good techniques. If another band is playing, go outside, or if you must, lean in and talk directly into their ear. DON’T SHOUT! Keep the water going for a bit as sweating on stage dehydrates like crazy, and your voice still needs to be babied a bit.


Paulie!-
I don’t know what your appropriate range is, so I can’t know if you’re already pushing yourself too much. I would tend to think it’s doable though. Check out what I replied above, that should make some sense in your situation.
If you are getting the feeling of squeezing or straining when you sing “high” that’s what’s keeping you from extending further. The irony is that high notes take less pressure and a more open, relaxed position and we seem to do exactly the opposite to reach them. Your grit in that range is a sign of straining. You’re really pinching and grinding trying to reach up to that note. Learn a relaxed way to produce those sounds and the grit will clear up.


To everyone who popped in just to say thanks. Glad you’re finding some value in it.