HamburgerBoy
Active Member
- Sep 16, 2007
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Was it domestic terrorism when lefties stormed a senate building to disrupt and delay the Kavanaugh appointment?
The News Thread
- Thread starter Jimmy... Dead.
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CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
C'mon man... these are completely different contexts. If a cop pulls a black guy over suspecting him of a crime and the guy pulls a cellphone out of his pocket or from within his car and gets shot, as fucked up as that obviously is, it's so utterly different to black people being openly armed during a protest. If what you are saying is even remotely true (that black people would be gunned down if they protested while legally armed) why are there little to no examples of it happening when they actually do show up armed?
I'm not downplaying racism but it serves nobody to just make shit up like this. Even in your article it weirdly conflates how left-wing protests are treated by police vs right-wing protests and tries to make that into a race thing, when we all know most of the violence at protests were by whites and most of the protesters harmed by cops were white. Look at the arrest records for example, mostly white.
No it's not about precedent. Day 1 of the Floyd protests also caught the cops off guard relative to that situation. It's why so much damage and destruction ended up occurring. By day [insert number here] they were more heavy-handed and better prepared for the protests. By contrast, this Capitol building riot had very little lead up. Now if they managed to stay at the Capitol over night and we found ourselves on day 3 of protesting the Capitol building or whatever, we'd see similar rates of heavy-handedness and preparedness by the cops. That's my point, a 1 day event that caught people off guard cannot be compared to like, day 56 of the #BLM protests.
Does that make sense? Haha. You can't expect them to prepare the same ways for completely different types of incidents.
Are you talking about that clip dipshits are sharing of cops seemingly letting them in, but when you watch the unedited video it pans around and shows that all the retards are already within the area?
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Allfader
Kvelding
Trumpsters will eventually form their own party. They will still be allies with "normal" Republicans, basically to not lose with the Dems, but this incident has proven that there's a fracture within the (more) right wing side of US.
In a way, this should be good. Bipartisan politics are to blame for keeping status quo and widening the gap between the elite and the average citizen.
Einherjar86
Active Member
I don't see it as making anything up.
You raise a fair point about the instances when black protestors do show up armed, i.e. the Louisville Breonna Taylor protestors. But in that case, tensions were so high about cops firing on black victims that I'll bet police were being extra cautious--even in the presence of an armed black militia.
But I'd be curious to hear about other examples of black protestors showing up armed, because my gut tells me this happens rarely. I'd also bet that when it does happen, it's usually your rare right-wing black guys among a sea of white dudes, which is very different than a black militia.
I'm not sure either of us is primed to comment on this, but I don't think the Capitol riot had very little lead-up. They had all morning to observe the crowd and prepare as it marched toward the Capitol. I don't think the passage of time in the aftermath of Floyd's murder should be the standard we set here. I don't see why the entire morning wasn't an opportunity for police to be prepared.
I'm not sure that makes a difference. "Well, they're already in--might as well let more of them in!"
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Baroque
Active Member
Iced Earth singer was one of the rioters, now on FBI’s most wanted list
https://metalinjection.net/metal-crimes/iced-earths-jon-schaffer-now-listed-on-fbis-most-wanted
https://metalinjection.net/metal-crimes/iced-earths-jon-schaffer-now-listed-on-fbis-most-wanted
CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
When I first saw this a couple days ago I was confused because in my ignorance I assumed Iced Earth were European, so I was thinking "woah he travelled all the way to the US for that dumb shit?"
I'm retarded.
CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
Right because cops are more cautious to shoot black people due to the attention on the subject right now, except Floyd is just one victim in a long line of slayings by cops while we've had a spotlight on the issue since at least #BLM's creation. C'mon man, stop being so dishonest. Cops just keep killing black people, hell the Kenosha protests happened because another guy was killed while the Floyd protests were kicking off across your country lmfao.
Your narrative just doesn't line up with reality. 7 months ago when armed right-wingers protested at the Capitol, days later representative Sarah Anthony brought an escort of several armed black people with her to make sure she was safe haha, nobody was shot. Arguably it's actually safer for a black person to open carry than to just be unarmed, going by any number of stories out there.
I said very little lead up in contrast to the Floyd protests. You know, as in, one was slow rolling and the other was like going from cold to hot. Yes the disposition of the crowd plays a huge role, did cops expect the #BlueLivesMatter dipshits to start attacking them? Probably not, but at the same time they did have barriers up so it's not like they were completely unprepared, just nowhere near to scale.
My mind is breaking so I'll just leave this here haha:
http://www.politifact.com/article/2021/jan/07/ask-politifact-did-capitol-police-let-mob-trump-su/
CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
This is fucking dumb, you actually believe they'll form a 3rd party? Hahahahaha. Just no.
Einherjar86
Active Member
I don’t think the examples you’re providing are as cut and dry as you think, but getting into why would be way too much distraction in this thread (and not news). Maybe at some point I’ll move it elsewhere and try to respond more fully.
Also, thanks for the politico link. I hadn’t seen that and it’s helpful.
CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
Yeah I agree they're not cut and dry, and I'm not pretending like cops probably won't be more intimidated by a crowd of armed black people than by a crowd of armed white "patriots" (which hopefully changes going forward considering the mayhem at the Capitol) but trying to make a point while also adding a billion caveats pertaining to nuance is a bit beyond my capabilities haha.
But I agree, back to news, apparently they're rushing an impeachment of Trump next week. Also Lin Wood, some dickhead lawyer known for sucking Trump's balls has had his Twitter permanently banned for claiming the riot at the Capitol building was staged and for apparently calling for Mike Pence's execution.
'Murica.
But I agree, back to news, apparently they're rushing an impeachment of Trump next week. Also Lin Wood, some dickhead lawyer known for sucking Trump's balls has had his Twitter permanently banned for claiming the riot at the Capitol building was staged and for apparently calling for Mike Pence's execution.
'Murica.
zabu of nΩd
Free Insultation
- Feb 9, 2007
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Laughable comparison. For one, that was during a public hearing on Kavanaugh's appointment, so most likely everyone inside the building had already been processed by security staff (unless you have evidence to the contrary). The rioters last week broke into the Capitol, fought their way through security, and brought guns and bombs in with them.
CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
From what I remember most of the protesters at the BK hearing did the standard trick of entering a place peacefully with a plan to interrupt at some point, or getting into areas like the gallery or the hallways where they could at least hold signs, chant slogans and confront people (hence the infamous elevator confrontation). They definitely didn't trample barricades and charge at armed officers, haha. That's not domestic terrorism just regular ass protesting.
Allfader
Kvelding
Why not? It's a matter of time, really. They were up to hung Mike Pence and even did setup a Gallow outside the Capitol. They went there with bombs and plastic cuffs. What for?
Those people believe that Republicans are mostly a bunch of cowards and "establishment" yes men. They are way beyond your typical "status quo" stance. Trump himself have distanced from the "normies" republicans and those who have extreme views found a voice on him.
I'm under the impression some people here didn't dimension what actually happened. Those guys weren't different than the British back in early 19th century. It was an attempt (a feeble one but still) at destroying the government just because they lost the election. They were up to take power by force. That's what Trump told them to do and that's what they believe. Some of the insurgents were interviewed and said "this is revolution".
Do you really think those traitors will actually just stand down and let the political climate to get as it was before? Do you really think they will just trust in the republican party, the Dems and the whole government's institution?
Shaffer belongs to an antigovernment organization. How is even possible that the US allows the existence of paramilitary groups, heavily armed that defy the political establishment in the open? Did they really think this wouldn't happen?
After 4 years of Trump's provocations to insubordination and fueling hatred, do you really think people that actually share such deplorable views wouldn't act? There were people with antisemitic hoodies, others with fascist symbols, most of them are actually racist in the "normal" US way: hate/despise everyone who's not white, especially black people. Down in the south, there's still a bunch of people who believe that blacks should be slaves again.
What do you think US should do with people who have those extreme views and have the means and intention to act and actually harm/kill people?
CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
I don't think these retards will suddenly vanish obviously, but they're way too disorganized to form a 3rd party. Trump's supporters are already in the process of eating each other alive in the wake of the Capitol riot. Could they try to start a party? Sure, but a "3rd party" implies it will be relevant and a contender to the main 2 parties monopoly on political power.
Allfader
Kvelding
Polls from that day say that nearly half of republicans actually supported the coup. It's entirely possible for them to make a 3rd party and coerce the "coward" republicans to make things as they want to get their support against the Dems.
Disorganized? Are you sure?
They are actually well organized, but they haven't consolidate their ranks politically yet. Most of them are members/founders of pro-gun organizations, veteran groups, hunting associations, etc , where they are the majority in their respective circles.
It's a matter of having a few voices in politics to get them together. The raw material is there's ready to be shaped and seized.
Nothing more useful than a bunch of zealous, conspiratorial thugs that are so blind that they believe that destroying the government and violating the constitution are protecting the country. They are up to. They just need guidance and a push. Trump asked them to do it and they did. They are just waiting for another leader to make it happen.
Disorganized? Are you sure?
They are actually well organized, but they haven't consolidate their ranks politically yet. Most of them are members/founders of pro-gun organizations, veteran groups, hunting associations, etc , where they are the majority in their respective circles.
It's a matter of having a few voices in politics to get them together. The raw material is there's ready to be shaped and seized.
Nothing more useful than a bunch of zealous, conspiratorial thugs that are so blind that they believe that destroying the government and violating the constitution are protecting the country. They are up to. They just need guidance and a push. Trump asked them to do it and they did. They are just waiting for another leader to make it happen.
CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
If half supported it, there's no need to make a new party when they can just take over the GOP.
Einherjar86
Active Member
It’s pretty clear that the GOP has lost nearly half its supporters, but I think it’s less clear what will happen in the years to come. I’m concerned about the threats of imminent violence, but I’m also skeptical that those ex-GOPers will follow through on all the talk.
I wouldn’t be surprised if we see efforts to create a new political party in the years to come, but it’s so difficult to build enough capital to promote a genuinely formidable political party that I’m doubtful of any hypothetical party’s political success.
I think it’s more likely we’ll see the continued radicalism of a right wing that transforms the GOP from within. Not sure what the contours of this will look like, but there’s no doubt we’ll be contending with radical conservatism for a while.
I wouldn’t be surprised if we see efforts to create a new political party in the years to come, but it’s so difficult to build enough capital to promote a genuinely formidable political party that I’m doubtful of any hypothetical party’s political success.
I think it’s more likely we’ll see the continued radicalism of a right wing that transforms the GOP from within. Not sure what the contours of this will look like, but there’s no doubt we’ll be contending with radical conservatism for a while.
Allfader
Kvelding
CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
HamburgerBoy
Active Member
- Sep 16, 2007
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300 arrested, so whether or not they were "processed" (whatever that means) initially, they certainly didn't have permission to do what they did, and what they did was with the intent of delaying governmental processes. Unless the terrorism aspect you're referring to isn't so much the conscious political motive aspect as it is the physically destructive aspect, in which case black terrorism blatantly outnumbers right-wing terrorism when looking at the countless black riots in history (including recent history).
