The State of Nationalism 2006

[infoterror]

To believe in a system of thought or government is to accept that no system will be perfect, and that every system will have difficulties in defining itself over several generations of design. As we approach a record year for nationalist and fascist parties worldwide, it is essential that we take stock of our goals so that we continue the evolution of our concept and do not fall into the pitfalls of hastily-conceived political logic.

The period from 2000-2005 was definitive, in that several events happened in sequence: we saw the future of the "world policeman," the USA, as being besets by enemies without and within and being unable to stay on top of them; it was finally shown that not only was our oil supply diminishing in accessibility, but that our years of growth and pollution have produced dramatic and damaging effects on our environment - effects that will revisit us in the future. Further, we saw that despite fifty years of liberal attitudes toward multiculturalism in Europe and the USA, differences persist and cause ongoing, insoluble problems.

Part of our problem as a species is that we are divided not so much by national borders but by political alignment into "right" and "left." The right defends traditional values, but has scarcely leant support to the idea that we must preserve and nurture our environment. The left accepts environmentalism, but is on a crusade to exterminate traditional and national values. While the right is offers protection for our traditional ways of life, it also defends large businesses and threatens an increasingly uptight, financially-motivated society. While the left will liberate the individual from government, it increasingly defends blind idealism toward an egalitarian conformity that will result in Stalinesque totalitarianism.

http://www.nazi.org/nazi/policy/2006/

 

[speed]

To believe in a system of thought or government is to accept that no system will be perfect, and that every system will have difficulties in defining itself over several generations of design. As we approach a record year for nationalist and fascist parties worldwide, it is essential that we take stock of our goals so that we continue the evolution of our concept and do not fall into the pitfalls of hastily-conceived political logic.

The period from 2000-2005 was definitive, in that several events happened in sequence: we saw the future of the "world policeman," the USA, as being besets by enemies without and within and being unable to stay on top of them; it was finally shown that not only was our oil supply diminishing in accessibility, but that our years of growth and pollution have produced dramatic and damaging effects on our environment - effects that will revisit us in the future. Further, we saw that despite fifty years of liberal attitudes toward multiculturalism in Europe and the USA, differences persist and cause ongoing, insoluble problems.

Part of our problem as a species is that we are divided not so much by national borders but by political alignment into "right" and "left." The right defends traditional values, but has scarcely leant support to the idea that we must preserve and nurture our environment. The left accepts environmentalism, but is on a crusade to exterminate traditional and national values. While the right is offers protection for our traditional ways of life, it also defends large businesses and threatens an increasingly uptight, financially-motivated society. While the left will liberate the individual from government, it increasingly defends blind idealism toward an egalitarian conformity that will result in Stalinesque totalitarianism.

http://www.nazi.org/nazi/policy/2006/

Well I agree with your criticism, and I can understand how nationalist support has increased after the last few years of imperial bumbling and incompetance on the part of our wonderfully corrupt imperialists--I mean Republicans.

The question I wonder, is whether there really will be a nationalist style revolution if you will. If the economy faulters with so many middle class people in debt, and competing worldwide with jobs, I wonder if a similar revolutionary pattern as France in the 19th and Germany in the 1920's and 1930's will occur? I doubt it, but it is intriguing. I am of the mind we will mirror the demise of the British Empire, and remain somewhat affluent and reserved.

I do not support your cause, but you do make some interesting points.

 

[infoterror]

Well I agree with your criticism, and I can understand how nationalist support has increased after the last few years of imperial bumbling and incompetance on the part of our wonderfully corrupt imperialists--I mean Republicans.

The question I wonder, is whether there really will be a nationalist style revolution if you will.

Personally, I hope there will NOT be a revolution; I'd like peaceful political change. Revolutions tend to kill off some of the best people, who, even if they're opposed to what's right, may have some useful skills or may simply have never encountered the right information...

 

[Norsemaiden]

Nationalist parties are doing better than ever, but internationalism is far stronger a force, even though it is something imposed on us undemocratically.The forces of internationalism have too much power. They seek to break nationalism by means of immigration and by imposing a monoculture based on materialism. Only certain people would ever be nationalistic and once they reach their maximum and realise they are under threat from the others in the population (who are defended by internationalist power) there may be civil war. As you say, this would be very regretable. These wars could go on for decades, centuries even, with the only people benefitting being arms dealers and any rival nation which has avoided being balkanised in this way.
The civil war would not be sparked by nationalists wanting control over the nation, but probably by a decline in relations between various groups in society with escalating tit-for-tat violence and atrocities like what happened in Beslan in Russia when the primary school children were taken hostage with tragic results.
This is the situation that is becoming ever more likely, and it is very sad indeed. (Sorry if I'm depressing you, but there's always a chance that anticipating the worst will help to prevent it from being so bad.)

 

[speed]

Personally, I hope there will NOT be a revolution; I'd like peaceful political change. Revolutions tend to kill off some of the best people, who, even if they're opposed to what's right, may have some useful skills or may simply have never encountered the right information...

Couldnt agree with you more. Any revolution will be a peaceful one in this country:a revolution of ideas and ideology is what I was thinking, but I suppose I just assumed everyone would understand that.

 

[derek]

Couldnt agree with you more. Any revolution will be a peaceful one in this country:a revolution of ideas and ideology is what I was thinking, but I suppose I just assumed everyone would understand that.

Revolution tends to be associated with violence because the system that needs replaced rarely wishes to give up power.

I fully embrace the gradual revolution of ideas, but perhaps not the 3 day armed coup.

 

[infoterror]

Revolutions tend to be violent because they are radically polarized. In my view, there is no progress to thought, only better ideas and worse ideas. In that context, one does not need revolution, only a gradual shift toward better ideas.

 

[derek]

Revolutions tend to be violent because they are radically polarized. In my view, there is no progress to thought, only better ideas and worse ideas. In that context, one does not need revolution, only a gradual shift toward better ideas.

That's what I meant by gradual revolution. I meant revolution in the context of changing slowly, not the typical armed revolution.

 

[speed]

Revolutions tend to be violent because they are radically polarized. In my view, there is no progress to thought, only better ideas and worse ideas. In that context, one does not need revolution, only a gradual shift toward better ideas.

But in the last 150 years of the West, really only the Russians had a violent revolution, and the Russians are in many ways half-oriental in their outlook anyway. Even the Nazi's took power in an almost bloodless fashion.

Anyway, we are too rich, too materially wealthy for such a violent revolution to happen. Maybe blacks would--they basically did revolt in the late 60's, and for good reason.

Essentially ideas, policies, issues, mean nothing to anyone anymore. The average American will consume the jingoistic garbage being forced fed them, and they will not complain unless interest rates go over 10%, and greater numbers of their jobs disappear in the hallowed name of meeting stockholders expectations, profit, and free trade.

 

[infoterror]

But in the last 150 years of the West, really only the Russians had a violent revolution, and the Russians are in many ways half-oriental in their outlook anyway. Even the Nazi's took power in an almost bloodless fashion.

Yes. The Russian Revolution will be known as an unparalleled disaster for the Russia people with consequences extending into the next millennium.

The Nazis were elected.

As things get less stable, revolutions become more likely. I'm in agreement with Final_Product about changing attitudes instead of picking up guns - at least, that's how I'd like it to happen, and why I write (otherwise I'd simply shoot people, or something).

Not that I'm against shooting people.

 

[derek]

Not that I'm against shooting people.

You and Dick Cheney, both.

 

[speed]

Yes. The Russian Revolution will be known as an unparalleled disaster for the Russia people with consequences extending into the next millennium.

The Nazis were elected.

As things get less stable, revolutions become more likely. I'm in agreement with Final_Product about changing attitudes instead of picking up guns - at least, that's how I'd like it to happen, and why I write (otherwise I'd simply shoot people, or something).

Not that I'm against shooting people.

But do you really think anyone cares about anything but the most simple and jingoistic ideas anymore? Jesus, when I posted that thread on Plato's republic, I had to explain what it was about because people were confused, and had never read it. And this is a philosophy forum. Surely you have arguments with ignorant Americans, confused and befuddled about history, culture, current events, and economics.

All the smart people I know, pretty much know whats going on; and they are the least likely to pick up a gun over a pen.

 

[infoterror]

But do you really think anyone cares about anything but the most simple and jingoistic ideas anymore? Jesus, when I posted that thread on Plato's republic, I had to explain what it was about because people were confused, and had never read it. And this is a philosophy forum. Surely you have arguments with ignorant Americans, confused and befuddled about history, culture, current events, and economics.

Ignorance is a general problem and even more, most people are not designed to handle these issues. They lack certain abilities or inclinations. A wise leadership caste is the only way to ensure that those who make decisions are competent to.

One reason people like me begin our "fanatical crusades" (quotations for humorous purposes) within the nationalist camp is that there's a lot of cleaning up to do. I like nationalism; I see it as essential to having a better future. I don't like bigotry. There's a big difference between saying "I want culture to rule over money and bureaucracy, so I need to separate my people by culture and heritage in order for that to happen" and having a universal preference for one race over another. Pan-Nationalists like myself tend to view racial separation as essential to ending racial antagonism, but we're not fond of the n-word chanting idiots at certain "white power" and "white supremacy" forums, most of whom are "white" only by the broadest definition, and whose agenda seems to be more class warfare/revenge than finding a long-term cure for the ailings of modern society.

And I won't kid you - my goal is to replace modern society with something better. But not only to destroy it, to replace it, and with something enduring and good. The world is in the grips of what we might describe as a great "evil," not a single power like Satan, but a great misinformed and misleading series of concepts that do not work so well in reality. Nationalism is part of the equation but not the whole of it. Nationalists need to be educated, and many of them quietly removed from positions of influence if they do not understand nationalism.

 

[speed]

Ignorance is a general problem and even more, most people are not designed to handle these issues. They lack certain abilities or inclinations. A wise leadership caste is the only way to ensure that those who make decisions are competent to.

One reason people like me begin our "fanatical crusades" (quotations for humorous purposes) within the nationalist camp is that there's a lot of cleaning up to do. I like nationalism; I see it as essential to having a better future. I don't like bigotry. There's a big difference between saying "I want culture to rule over money and bureaucracy, so I need to separate my people by culture and heritage in order for that to happen" and having a universal preference for one race over another. Pan-Nationalists like myself tend to view racial separation as essential to ending racial antagonism, but we're not fond of the n-word chanting idiots at certain "white power" and "white supremacy" forums, most of whom are "white" only by the broadest definition, and whose agenda seems to be more class warfare/revenge than finding a long-term cure for the ailings of modern society.

And I won't kid you - my goal is to replace modern society with something better. But not only to destroy it, to replace it, and with something enduring and good. The world is in the grips of what we might describe as a great "evil," not a single power like Satan, but a great misinformed and misleading series of concepts that do not work so well in reality. Nationalism is part of the equation but not the whole of it. Nationalists need to be educated, and many of them quietly removed from positions of influence if they do not understand nationalism.

We agree on a startling amount of issues here. However, my eternal pessimism and practicality, precludes me from being so optimistic about ever replacing our society with something better, and nationalistic impulses frighten me. History has been merely a change in uniforms for each sucessive Police State, and a change in fashion for the corrupt elite. It is perhaps, the human condition. Some like us in the WEst, will benefit from western ideals of freedom--and receive some illusory freedoms; most however, will receive few freedoms.

 

[infoterror]

my eternal pessimism and practicality, precludes me from being so optimistic about ever replacing our society with something better

I believe not only can it happen, but it will, and it is right now. Those who hold on to older illusions will find out last, but it is occurring from inside-out in the rotted hulk of consumer society. And per its bottom-up order, it will not become visible until it has occurred, for most.

 

[speed]

I believe not only can it happen, but it will, and it is right now. Those who hold on to older illusions will find out last, but it is occurring from inside-out in the rotted hulk of consumer society. And per its bottom-up order, it will not become visible until it has occurred, for most.

Well I hope you are right, but I see the otherside of the coin. I dont see any rebirth or development; only cultural and social erosion.

 

[infoterror]

Well I hope you are right, but I see the otherside of the coin. I dont see any rebirth or development; only cultural and social erosion.

Nothing's for certain, and these are very dark times. However, yes, I do see change, it's just slow and I'm impatient.

Another way to put this: awareness is much improved since seven years ago.

 

[speed]

Nothing's for certain, and these are very dark times. However, yes, I do see change, it's just slow and I'm impatient.

Another way to put this: awareness is much improved since seven years ago.

Awareness has improved, but everything else has declined and is getting worse.

 

[infoterror]

Awareness has improved, but everything else has declined and is getting worse.

Awareness among those who will make change, I should say. For most, they remain dumb as rocks to the larger issues. However, the collapse of infrastructure has a positive consequence: it's about to serve us further proof that modern society "equals" failure.

Every time.