Tracking drums, toms and snare sounding "thin"

[Viral_Tyler]

I'm working on a PopPunk demo project right now, the room I have to work with is 30' x 30', drywall on all sides, carpet over subfloor (crawlspace).

The mics I'm working with right now are (2) Karma K-10 sdc's, (2) MXL V63M ldc's, (4) Shure PG56, (1) Audix i5, (1) Audix D6.

Here is the intro to the demo, and its as far as we got haha:



I'm mostly concerned about the snare and toms, but after relistening the kick sounds a little wonky as well. I'll post more info on the kit and setup if asked. Also will be posting pictures too.

 

[Shinozoku]

Move the whole kit a foot in one direction or the other.

 

[RedDog]

Don't put the kit in the exact middle of the room. Modal hell. And tell the drummer he hits like a girl. Thin toms need to be tuned properly and you have to beat them.

 

[Trevoire520]

Kick mic needs to be closer to the beater, or you need to use less muffling in the kick drum, one pillow should be enough.
Drummer need to hit the toms harder. You're right the snare and toms do sound a bit thin. If you can post some pic's and details of the setup that would help.

Also, when the fuck did pop punk bands start playing breakdowns? I blame a day to remember for this.

 

[BLUElightCory]

Also, have you tried messing with phase/polarity?

Start by flipping the polarity on your overheads and see if that helps thicken the snare/tom sounds, then try the same thing on the kick and (if you have them) the room mics. Whether or not it works is dependent on a zillion factors that would take too much time to go into, but it's a good place to start if your drums are feeling wimpy.

 

[Drummerrrrr?]

Side snare mic can help.

 

[AKoppenheffer]

Well tuned drums and phase! Or manually time align the tracks.

 

[Charles J]

This sounds like quite an easy fix, actually. Your results may not be AMAZING but you an surely do better than that.

Take the snare, and walk around the perimeter of the room hitting it (or someone else) and STOP when it sounds the best. put the kit here (usually going to be a corner or parallel with another wall).

you're biggest problem here is PHASE. be sure to follow the 3:1 rule *google if you dont know it* and ALWAYS flip polarity in your daw in the kick, snr, toms, etc just seeing if, say, flipping the polarity on the LEFT OH might give you a wider OH sound, or flipping the kick polarity may give the kick more low-end, etc.

=D

 

[Trevoire520]

flipping the polarity on the LEFT OH might give you a wider OH sound

I would NOT recommend this. While it will give you a wider sound it will cause your centre information (kick + snare) to cancel pretty heavily.

 

[Leon--]

Close micing and of course tell the drummer to hit the really hard

 

[Viral_Tyler]

Hey guys, thanks for the feedback! I'll for sure move the kit with that snare trick, sounds experimentive haha; the kit's posted up in a corner right now. I found some pictures I took when I first got the mic's setup, so the positioning has changed since I took the pics.

Some other info for ya'll, I tuned the tension of the both heads on each tom to 73, cranked and tightened the shit out of my snare beater head(prolly a HUGE mistake..), didn't even check the reso head on the snare haha being honest, and the kick I am using the heavy felt beaters (also the pillow is feather, the head also is a Evans EMAD, I have the smaller size dampener in it right now). Also I removed all of the moongels from the toms, but the snare head. I also have a moongel on the reso side of the snare, is that an issue? Also, the room mics are setup in the opposite corner of the room in XY pattern, where the kit is facing.

I really wish I had time this weekend to work on this, the metal band I play guitar for is headlining a concert in Gallup, NM tomorrow night. But Sunday and Monday will work out

Here are those pictures too.

 

[Trevoire520]

Try positioning your tom mic's more like how you have your snare mic setup, this should give your more stick attack and more low end thud from the proximity effect. At the moment the mic's look like they're pointing at the edge of the drum instead of towards the centre which is actually where the drummer is hitting!

Try moving your kick mic to the right of it's current position and then turning it so that it's still pointing at where the beater hits. Sometimes having the mic in the centre of the drum can make things a bit too boomy. You could also try taping some coins to the kick pad where each beater hits, this should help get some more attack. If you're still struggling with the kick being too thuddy/boomy it might be proximity effect working against you, so you could try pulling the mic back to decrease the bass pickup. Though I have a feeling that the main problem is the drummer not hitting the kick hard enough in the first place!

As far as the moongels go, I find it's best to get the kit sounding as good as you can without them and than only using them if it's still necessary once you've got your tuning down. Personally I cut the moongels into halfs or quarters as I find a full one is often too much, you don't want to totally deaden the drum, just control any nasty sounding resonances (this should be minimized in the tuning stage anyway)

 

[luismars]

Learn to eq with mic placement, high freqs on the edge, lower on the centre. Point the mic wherever it sounds better between those two points.

 

[metalhead3ecr]

Slate's TRIGGER....problem solved. haha but seriously just move things around while you have headphones on and the drummer is playing. do some sample tests and see how they sound. It may take some time.

 

[Charles J]

I would NOT recommend this. While it will give you a wider sound it will cause your centre information (kick + snare) to cancel pretty heavily.

Agreed. I should have prefaced this; this only works if your L+R OH are ALREADY out of phase. Which, when they are, the brass sounds wide but kick and SNR are weak.

I'm a 'check phase in mono' FREAK so i know exactly what sound you're talking about =D