what kind of mastering chain do you guys typically use?

[s34nsm411]

I always seem to come to the same plugin combination conclusion when applying mastering effects and i was wondering what other people out there were doing

my usually setup is something like
-some kind of light reverb to smooth things out a little bit
-psp vintage warmer
-eq
-waves c4
-waves l3 maximizer

my final mixes usually rely a lot on eqing/plugins, is that a bad practice?

anyway what do you all do?

 

[AStacy2]

I usually use Har-Bal to EQ the track and get out any peaks/valleys first. Then I use either Waves LimMB or the SSL Comp for a little bit of compression then L2.


I've never had much luck using reverb on the whole mix, it always seemed to make it muddy. But then again, my reverbs always seem like they suck compared to a lot of my favorite mixes so maybe I just don't know what I'm doing.

 

[Torniojaws]

I've never had much luck using reverb on the whole mix, it always seemed to make it muddy. But then again, my reverbs always seem like they suck compared to a lot of my favorite mixes so maybe I just don't know what I'm doing.

Have you tried running a reverb which can high pass itself? Leave out the low range stuff (say, below 150 - 200 Hz). That should clear it up

 

[broken81]

yea I'm curious about what plug ins people use on master.

shit i would love to know what they use on the master during mixing and after but i guess after would be mastering.

 

[Tachy]

Originally posted by HexTheNet
I usually use Har-Bal to EQ the track and get out any peaks/valleys first

Har-Bal?

 

[CJWall]

Har-Bal?

Similar in theory to Elemental Audio's Firium.. it does EQ matching and so forth..

In my experience, Reverb on a whole mic has been uke: high-passed or not. There's just some shit I DO NOT want reverb on.. Bass is a great example.

 

[cobhc]

Yeah, i've always found it shit, because of putting verb on the bass. But saying that, it did seem to gel things together a bit more.

 

[smy1]

@CJ and cobhc:

I think the "reverb on the whole song to make it more coherent" idea comes from a pop and rock background where the music is more open, slower and has more "room". Also it is about using very short verbs that are not noticeable instead of the huge "Roman Cathedral of DOOM" setting.

Try this:

1) Take any of your songs, preferrably a slower one with some "space".
2) Set up 5 aux sends with different reverb plugins (it works best when you use different plugins and not just the same plugin with different settings).
3) Then choose presets of different sizes from very small to large on each reverb.
4) Solo some of your instruments (some drums, vocals, guitars ...) and add some of the reverb to them. Make sure you can hear just a bit of reverb when soloed, but not when you have full playback. It doesn't really matter what reverb program you use on what instrument for this little experiment although I'd put something with a little predelay on kick and snare if you still want the snappy attack to punch thru really hard.
5) Now link all the 5 reverb channels so you can switch them on and off with one mute button (in Cubase you have to link them for that, I don't know about other programs).
6) Listen to your playback with reverb - then mute all the aux channels and listen to the playback without the reverb. A/B back and forth and you'll usually notice that the mix gets a slight bit fatter and "rounder" when all the small reverbs are on.

I know that this is not the same as putting reverb on the master bus, but the idea behind it is the same: you want to add a space to the recording that is "feel-able" but not "hear-able". I prefer the method above to the "verb on th 2bus"-method, but both work. It all depends on the music material because sometimes even some reverb on bass and a lot of verb on kicks can sound killer (I am just thinking of the situation when you walk across a festival site and you hear the mainstage from 200-300 meter distance and there is just a drumbeat and a overdriven MM Stingray through Ampeg stack playing and it just sounds washed out but thundering and great, haha!).

I don't think reverb on the whole mix has any use in speed, thrash or blackmetal, though.

 

[smy1]

Oh, and I typically mix through:

Sonalksis Stereo Compressor
URS Mix EQ
Voxengo Elephant *
TLs Limiter

The Voxengo Elephant is only on when I want to make demo versions that are a louder (for the people at record companies and the bands). I then crank the TLs Limiter also. For the final mixes that go to a mastering house I will shut off the Elephant and set the TLs Limiter to 0db to use it sorta like a "peak catcher" in case a few snare hits or cymbals go wild.

 

[CJWall]

I know what you're sayng SMY1, I do the same thing in my mixes all the time.. But what you're saying is quite a different idea than putting 1 reverb over the entire mix (i.e. on the 2buss) as you know. I'm sure it could work for some slower or pop/rock stuff though, good point.

Oh and a huge +1 to the Sonalksis SV-315! I love the shit out of that plug.. I've demo'd the URS comps and the Waves SSL bus comp and kept coming back to the Sonalksis. Awesome, awesome plug.

 

[broken81]

does anyone use any eq matching at all in mixing or mastering??

I seem to have no luck so far yet but i really dont know what the hell im doing.

 

[smy1]

I know what you're sayng SMY1, I do the same thing in my mixes all the time.. But what you're saying is quite a different idea than putting 1 reverb over the entire mix (i.e. on the 2buss) as you know. I'm sure it could work for some slower or pop/rock stuff though, good point.

Oh and a huge +1 to the Sonalksis SV-315! I love the shit out of that plug.. I've demo'd the URS comps and the Waves SSL bus comp and kept coming back to the Sonalksis. Awesome, awesome plug.

Actually I just mentioned the whole "procedure/experiment" to illustrate how short reverb settings work to add more fullness to a mix, just like a short reverb on the 2bus can do that. I got a bit more detailed than I originally wanted because I figured some people might not know how the whole thing can work.

The Sonalksis compressor is so cool, I wish they had something like Duende but made by Sonalksis. That way I could have EQ and Comp on every channel without bringing the CPU to its knees, haha

 

[cobhc]

does anyone use any eq matching at all in mixing or mastering??

I seem to have no luck so far yet but i really dont know what the hell im doing.

HexTheNet mentioned above that he uses Har-Bal which is EQ matching. vbmenu_register("postmenu_5336497", true);

 

[brandy]

I never used verb while mastering my own mixes, if i miss some verb/depth/athmo etc i would go back to the mixing stage first.

But i have used verb during mastering in the past. Not very often. Normaly highpassed (as stated bevore) or even in a creative way combined with automation. But stuff like that is not that regular and should be discussed with the clients as well.

I ditched Multiband Comps some years ago, i don't like my mixes beeing destroied by them. I use MultibandComps once in a while to "fix" things, maybe to tame the bass area without affecting the mids etc.

I like to combine differnent styles of comp/eq - some "surgical" for fixing things and some "with color" (UAD etc).


brandy

 

[smy1]

I seem to have no luck so far yet but i really dont know what the hell im doing.

Hehe, you just have to do it. If you produce and mix a lot it will all come over the years. This forum (and others) are definitely a great fountain of information that I wish I had had at my disposal in the early/mid-90s, but when it all comes down to it, you just gotta try and try and try. After a while you'll notice that things become better and that you are HEARING things better. In the end it's not about EQ curves and compressor setting but about how well you are able to translate the sound that's in your head to the sound that's coming out of the speakers.

That's why engineers who've done it for a bunch of years sometimes seem to mix without any effort and with great speed, while simultaneously seem to do very little ...

 

[broken81]

well for a rookie like me should i just have a refrance song loaded and just try and mix to that and not even mess with that eq matching crap?

 

[smy1]

well for a rookie like me should i just have a refrance song loaded and just try and mix to that and not even mess with that eq matching crap?

I can't tell you if EQ-matching is crap because I never tried it, but it all depends on the situation:

1) If you have all the time in the world and just want to mix your band project for fun, then try to mix it by using reference tracks and info from the "how to mix your stuff"-guides on the web. Post work-in-progress to get feedback from this forum, too.

2) If you have a deadline and need to get stuff done ASAP, try the EQ-matching and see how far you get. If it works: great. If it doesn't: go back to #1.

 

[moose209]

I feel that EQ matching wont help you turn your mix into the mix you are trying to mirro. Using the analysis to see what regions are present is cool but youre not learning to use your ears to find these regions. Each mix is its own world and each mixing engineer/producer his or her own island in some respects. Its great to see how other people are constructing their final vision but I find that would be dependant on the content. And remeber you are viewing a master more often than not. I think for me at least is to do a mix finish it and then compare it sonically to others and then if I really cant work it out use eq matching analysis. remeber though this depends on which weighting you are using I've been led to believe to use A weighting but some people use peak measurement some rms (my preference) some B weighting some C. Its a whole can of worms in itself as you have to deal with how accurate the program is. Its really hard for a noob but try to use your ears and ID stuff with your ears and brain - no shortcuts in my book - but then again my book is very slim at the moment!

 

[Where She Wept]

does anyone use any eq matching at all in mixing or mastering??

I seem to have no luck so far yet but i really dont know what the hell im doing.

I've had luck with guitars and bass, a guitarist i recorded sounded like shit so i used the Firium eq on one of my own guitars tracks and them matched his to mine. It worked well because i had the individual tracks to learn the eq from.

I tried it on the final mix of the band, I used a breaking begjamin CD at the singer's request and it destroyed the mix. It all just proves the adage of "the better the source material, the better the final product".

 

[Machinated]

I think the ordering of the mastering chain is fairly loose, except I always have a limiter and the Elemental Audio Inspector XL last in the chain. Other than that, Ill tend to use some of these: URS EQ's, Sonalksis SV315, Waves RComp, C4 (sometimes), Timeworks Mastering Comp, and I seem to find myself using Tritone Digitals Colortone FREE. Thats probably one of my most used plugins at the moment, I recommend it highly.