Which mic should I buy (vocals)?

[MatrixClaw]

I record mainly metal bands, and I sold all my vocal mics a while back, in order to get rid of the cheap ones and then just buy one really good one.

Right now, I'm using a Neumann TLM103 that belongs to a friend, and TBH, I quite like it. It's a bit brittle on the high end, but it sits surprisingly well in a mix, with minimal effort. However, for the price, I'm not sure it's the best choice.

This will be used mainly for screaming, though it will also be used for singing as well. Please keep in mind, I'm using a Focusrite Saffire Pro 40 - The preamps don't have a ton of gain, and the SM7b doesn't sound very flattering through it IMO. In order to get enough gain on most vocalists, you have to crank the dials way up, which in turn, gives quite a bit of noise.

I used an AT4060 a while back for a few weeks and absolutely loved that mic, but some others have come to my attention.

What I'm currently looking at:

• Audio Technica AT4060
• Rode K2
• AKG C414
• Miktek C7
• Mojave MA200
• Audio Technia AT4050
• Audio Technica AT4047
• Shure KSM44A

I could also probably get a Shure SM7b + GAP PRE73 (or something similar) now, but since you can't bypass the preamps on the Saffire, I'm kinda hesitant about buying new pres right now. I plan on picking up an SM7b once I upgrade interfaces, but for right now, I don't think it's really the right choice for me.

What would you choose and why? Any other suggestions?

If they're within a decent price range, and work well for the application, I'd consider buying a pair and using them as overheads as well.

Price range is ~$700 used.

 

[Revson]

I've used the 414 to record screams before and it worked out pretty well, didn't have to do a lot to fit into the mix. I can say that it did have kind of a plastic sound when I did some critical listening on it. I don't really know how better to describe it. That and the sm7 are the only two mics out of your list I've used though, so someone will probably have a better suggestion.

 

[Melodeath]

If you're looking at an AKG C414, and you're planning to use it only for vocals, I would maybe instead consider the C214, which is the cardioid-only version. Personally, I've been looking at the Advanced Audio CM414, which is a "clone" of the C414EB. Not for vocals in particular, but I'm sure it would sound great. The Miktek CV4 gets great reviews - you hear a lot more about it than the C7, although I never hear either mentioned for "harsh" vocals.

You could get a modded NT1A for under $700 and it's a great U87 clone.
You could get a modded Apex 460 or Nady for around $700 for something in the U47 vein

 

[MatrixClaw]

Well, actually I had mentioned the C414s, because I hear a lot of great feedback on them being used as overheads. A lot of people seem to be kind of torn for certain vocals using them, but the general consensus is that they work great for overheads (which I also need to buy new ones).

I'll check out the CM414 and the CV4. I'd kinda prefer not to go with something modded, since there's so many mixed reviews on modded mics, and it's not like I can really try before I buy, but I'll look into those as well

 

[Revson]

If you want to hear what the 414 sounds like on vocals, click the link in my sig, go to the BandPage and listen to the Abdomen Canvas song. I've been playing with using them as OH's for a few recordings, but they really just pick up way too much and I wound up switching them out for sm81's. Here's something you might want to check out: Oktavamod'd MXL

Edit: dammit, didn't see that you wanted to avoid a modded mic. Check it out anyway, it seems decent and there are sound clips.

 

[MatrixClaw]

^I'm not entirely apposed to modded mics, I just don't believe that a $400 mic is going to sound anywhere near a $3000 mic in a real world situation. Those guys hype their products so much, it's really hard who to believe

Obviously, if it can at least sound as good as the other mics in my price range (or better), then I'm all for the cheaper mic.

 

[Revson]

I don't believe that it's going to sound like a $3000 mic either, but if it can even sound half as good it would be worth it. Another mic you might want to look at is the Heil PR40. I've used that mic on everything, from screaming to singing to floor toms, kicks, basses, and guitars. I picked it over a 414 for a chick singer a couple weeks ago.

 

[kronk_1985]

Shure sm7b straight into the Liquid pre works well.

 

[MatrixClaw]

Shure sm7b straight into the Liquid pre works well.

*shrug* I've owned 3 SM7Bs and they simply just don't work very well with most of the vocalists I'm tracking. If I'm not mistaken, the SM7b is -49db, the preamps in the Saffire only have 60db of gain. Unless I'm tracking a vocalist who mainly uses false chords (generally much louder than fry vocals), which is fairly uncommon, I'll need to crank the preamp pretty high, which results in unwanted noise.

I do plan on getting one again down the line (once I upgrade my interface), but since this will be a more "well rounded" purchase, I can't help thinking the SM7b might not be the best choice? I've never really been too impressed with it on clean vocals, though I've heard great results from others, I still kept it on the list though, because I've never used it for singing on a better preamp, so that might just be the issue

If you can convince me the SM7b would be the best choice, I'm all ears, but I will not be using it with stock preamps, so the cost of one has to be taken into consideration.

 

[egan.]

I did a massive shootout here and ended up choosing the sm7 for my cleans over a new Neumann U87ai, a late 70's Neumann u87, a Telefunken AK-47, a Telefunken AR-51, a Peluso 22 251, a Lauten Oceanus, a Mojave MA300, a CharterOak Sa538A, and a CharterOak Sa538B.
Ironically, I hated the sm7 on death vocals this time and am using the vintage u87 instead. I found that the sm7 got brittle with the high spl on this vocalist.

Obviously the source makes a big difference but assuming you don't have a u87 budget my favorites of the mics I tested were the 22251 and the SA538A.

We used a K2 on all of the vocals on this album and I thought it was decent if a little harsh at times.

 

[Trevoire520]

AT4050 is a great all round mic, works well on just about anything you throw it on.

 

[MatrixClaw]

I did a massive shootout here and ended up choosing the sm7 for my cleans over a new Neumann U87ai, a late 70's Neumann u87, a Telefunken AK-47, a Telefunken AR-51, a Peluso 22 251, a Lauten Oceanus, a Mojave MA300, a CharterOak Sa538A, and a CharterOak Sa538B.
Ironically, I hated the sm7 on death vocals this time and am using the vintage u87 instead. I found that the sm7 got brittle with the high spl on this vocalist.

Obviously the source makes a big difference but assuming you don't have a u87 budget my favorites of the mics I tested were the 22251 and the SA538A.

We used a K2 on all of the vocals on this album and I thought it was decent if a little harsh at times.

Interesting... But what kind of preamps are you using?

As I've said - The SM7b sounds great on some setups I've used, but I just can't get into it with my Saffire for some reason

If it's any consolation, the interfaces I'm currently looking at are the Allen & Heath ZED R16 and (possibly) the UA Apollo, though that one's probably unlikely, since I can't really afford to pay 2 grand for only 4 preamps; plus I kinda want the analogue EQs in the ZED. The ZED has 60db of gain on its preamps, from what I could find, and the Apollo has 65db.

 

[guitarguru777]

I have no problem with my SM7B and vocalists who do lower volume screams. Im using a Saffire Pro40.

 

[~BURNY~]

What do you mean "you can't bypass the preamps"?
(line input at unity gain = no preamp)
You could add a few oktavamod mics to your list btw.

 

[raisedfist]

I bought a sm7 a year ago and even on cleans and quiet vocalist I haven't taken it off the stand. It just works...with the right pre. I was originally using it with a GAP with mixed results but saw a UA710 on ebay for cheap and its killer.

 

[egan.]

Interesting... But what kind of preamps are you using?

As I've said - The SM7b sounds great on some setups I've used, but I just can't get into it with my Saffire for some reason

If it's any consolation, the interfaces I'm currently looking at are the Allen & Heath ZED R16 and (possibly) the UA Apollo, though that one's probably unlikely, since I can't really afford to pay 2 grand for only 4 preamps; plus I kinda want the analogue EQs in the ZED. The ZED has 60db of gain on its preamps, from what I could find, and the Apollo has 65db.

For the shootout I used the built in pre's on the UFX. For tracking I used my great river.

 

[MatrixClaw]

I have no problem with my SM7B and vocalists who do lower volume screams. Im using a Saffire Pro40.

Hmmm... the ones I've had in the past I had to turn up to 8 on the preamps of the Pro 40 to get to the level I need them at for vocalists who are fairly low volume. At that point, there was quite a bit of noise introduced and it just sounded very lackluster

I had the chance to A/B the last SM7b I had with an RE-20, AT4060 and a TLM103, and to me - The Shure was the clear loser. The RE-20 sounded similar, but with a bit more detail and it required far less gain to get it to the same level as the SM7b; for the price it costs, though, it's not really something I'd consider. The AT4060 was the clear winner out of the 4 for me, but it's quite expensive.

Like I said though, I've used the SM7b through some higher end setups and absolutely loved it, but I just don't dig it on the stock Pro 40

What do you mean "you can't bypass the preamps"?
(line input at unity gain = no preamp)

The general consensus I've seen from reading quite a few posts on the internet on the subject, is that the line inputs are using the same circuit as the XLR inputs, they're just padding the preamp to line level. Setting them to "unity" gain still adds some coloration from the amplifier. Supposedly it doesn't do much coloration though, but having used a UA 2-610 through it already using this method (also tested through a RME UFX), it wasn't really to my liking.

Maybe I'm just not digging the Focusrite anymore - But the UFX I had didn't really do anything for me either, and it was 4 times the price

Thinking about just investing in a Seventh Circle Audio rack and connecting it into something with better conversion. I dunno... haha.

 

[~BURNY~]

The general consensus I've seen from reading quite a few posts on the internet on the subject, is that the line inputs are using the same circuit as the XLR inputs, they're just padding the preamp to line level. Setting them to "unity" gain still adds some coloration from the amplifier. Supposedly it doesn't do much coloration though, but having used a UA 2-610 through it already using this method (also tested through a RME UFX), it wasn't really to my liking.

Damn, that kind of sucks... I'm starting to regret my order...

 

[Gnash]

If you can't pick up a U87, definitely check out the Shure KSM 44. You can find them on EBay for around $500-$600 all the time. It doesn't have that lustrious top end presence of the U87, but it compares nicely for that price. I wouldn't hesitate to put the KSM44 on any voice. It's a great workhorse mic for other sources too. You can use it for midside stuff. I have an AT4050 and the SM7b too. All great mics for low cost. The SM7b works excellent through an API or Great River, and is perfect for a screamer to hold on to, when a vocalist doesn't want to stand in front of a pop filter. I don't like the C414 on vox, and I stay away from any Rode stuff. Take a look at the KSM44 on EBay.

 

[MatrixClaw]

If you can't pick up a U87, definitely check out the Shure KSM 44. You can find them on EBay for around $500-$600 all the time. It doesn't have that lustrious top end presence of the U87, but it compares nicely for that price. I wouldn't hesitate to put the KSM44 on any voice. It's a great workhorse mic for other sources too. You can use it for midside stuff. I have an AT4050 and the SM7b too. All great mics for low cost. The SM7b works excellent through an API or Great River, and is perfect for a screamer to hold on to, when a vocalist doesn't want to stand in front of a pop filter. I don't like the C414 on vox, and I stay away from any Rode stuff. Take a look at the KSM44 on EBay.

Yeah, I see them going on eBay as low as $400, which is quite intriguing to me.

I'm actually leaning more towards the KSM44 now. I've been reading up a lot on it recently, and though there's a lot of mixed reviews, the things that people seem to dislike about the mic, are qualities I tend to like

If I can pick one up around the $400 mark, I'll probably just pick up an SM7b again, for the hell of it. I was originally planning on spending ~$7-800 on a mic, so if I can get two for that price, that will cover a lot of ground, might as well. I still love the SM7b on guitar cabs and as hi-hat mics, so even if I don't end up using it much for vocals, until I get a preamp/interface I like it better with, I'll at least make use of it on other things.